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Darren S

Well Known Member
yesterday and this was the final straw to push me to buy a Zaon TCAS. I made all my usual radio calls, scanning the horizon etc..... but I didn't see this guy till he was what seemed like 300 feet in front of me crossing my path.

Anyways, I have been wanting an TCAS for sometime as well as a couple of other upgrades for my -7. I would like some opinions on the best route.

Currently the panel has : 6 pack of steam, VOR and Navaid wing leveller on pilot side. Bendix King KMD 150 GPS, radio and intercom in center section and an Advanced Engine Monitor 2002 on the PAX side.

I want a Traffic Collision monitor, G-meter and a proper 2 axis autopilot.

OPTION #1:
I have been looking into upgrading to an Advanced 3500 with EFIS and Engine monitor. I have to buy a TCAS from Zaon and I have to buy a Trio A/P controller head. The G-meter is built in.


OPTION #2:
I have a credit with MGL so alternately I could get a G-meter from them as well as the Trio A/P head. I plan to remove the VOR so there is the space for the G-meter and the Navaid wing leveler hole can hold the Trio head. The TCAS would just sit on the glare shied I guess.

Advantages of switching to an EFIS are weight savings, no mechanical Gyro to deal with.

Disadvantage is cost, labour, flying down time.

Which option would you chose ?

Does anyone know how much weight savings there would be by going with an EFIS ?

It's a slider canopy so I know it will be a little more difficult to access the back of the panel vs. a tip up. Also, I thought about going with an MGL Voyager but I don't think many of the sensors and probes will work.

Thanks,

Darren
 
Can't directly address your questions, but I do have a Zaon XRX on the (non-RV) glareshield.

It's a mixed blessing, with a lot of warnings around the airport, so many that it's difficult to determine what's critical. I no longer use the audible warning because of that.

I guess I'd say that it tells me too much; I'd like their warning algorithm to improve. I don't really care about someone 1,300 feet above me if neither of us are changing altitude or if someone's half a mile away and not closing on me.

It would sure be nice if, out of all the contacts, it figures out which ones might actually be a collision hazard and only alerts me to those.

However, out in the open, away from airports, it's pretty handy, letting me know when someone's in my area.

With my distance glasses on it's a bit hard to read.
 
I went the EFIS/GPS route

My XRX is feeding serial data to the GRT and the Garmin 496. You can configure, to some extent, the parameters for warnings. The visual display is more precise for the direction of the target than the instrument's own display.

You don't have to buy their cable, just ask them the pins and wire it yourself. Easy. The hardest part was configuring between the 496 and the XRX.

Yes, there are worthless alerts, but darn few false positives. I'll take it.
 
Darren S said:
yesterday and this was the final straw to push me to buy a Zaon TCAS. I made all my usual radio calls, scanning the horizon etc..... but I didn't see this guy till he was what seemed like 300 feet in front of me crossing my path.
Thanks,
Darren
Click to expand...

I understand your frustration, but the fact is even if you had TCAS, he likely still would have cut you off.
There is no doubt though, that safety would have been increased as at least you would have been able to know where he was. It is just one of those things that happens, and keeping your head on a swivel even with TCAS is a must!
Maybe we should ban Cessna's, and have RV only airports!
 
Darren, I did it.

This spring I started working on my panel upgrade.

My old panel had a 2500 and BMA EFIS. I also wanted to have traffic.



So I did the upgrade.



Although I had a tip-up I removed the panel to work on it. I hate working on my back with the fuel selector poking me.

Note that I didn't replace the panel blank, but cut out access holes and then screwed cover plates over the hole after fitting the new instruments.

AFS has an upgrade path so that you can trade in your 2500 on the 3500. Also I moved my back round gauges to the right side. Replace the Vans air vents with one that I got from Stien. I had to relocate the 496 to a RAM mount to make room for my iPad, but I like it better there anyway.

I decided to go with ADS-B from NavWorx, so there is nothing blocking my view or taking up panel space. I don't know if you have that service in your location.

I though that I would be down about 1 week for the upgrade, but it took more like 1 month. Most of the wiring connection under the panel hook up to the panel with large AMP connectors, so the remove and installation of the panel is not to bad (1 - 2 hours). The unplanned time was the result of not having part and being organized up front. If you can get everything ordered before you start.

When upgrading from 2500 to 3500 you will need new oil and fuel pressure senders and I think that I also replaced the oil temp sender. Trish (at AFS) knows. I didn't use the wiring harness from AFS, but adapted my own. If you didn't trim the wires that came with the 2500 and you locations aren't any worst then my, then the wires will reach.

Good luck with your upgrade.

Kent
 
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FYI, there is a Top Gun sequel in the works ! For those fans out there. Apparently there won't be as much dogfighting requiring switching from "cannons" to "guns" as modern day Fighter Jet warfare is based on Smart Bombs and dropping them. So now the writers have to create a story around this new technology. The original was done 25 yrs ago.

Alas, I digress. Thanks for the input so far. I need to pull the panel and check out exactly what I am dealing with, with regards to access, wiring, busses.

I didn't build the plane so it'll all be new to me.

A weight savings would be a nice benefit but if it's only going to be 5-10 lbs I may take the easy route and go option #2. Buy the A/P head, buy the TCAS, buy the G-meter.

Darren
 
You'd be surprised how many airplanes fly with their transponders switched off. Last weekend I crossed paths with a CAP 172 and my MRX never took notice.
 
Darren, why don't you think the probes you have will work with the MGL Voyager? They're pretty configurable with a variety of probe-types. I bought my probes from Grand Rapids and configured them in my dual-Voyager setup. Works great.
 
Ron Lee said:
Fly high. Cessna's are scared up there.
Click to expand...

See, your problem, Darren, is that you should start flying out of CYBW! If you can't scare the Cessna's off, at least control them ;).

Seriously, if you need a hand with your panel upgrade, feel free to call me. I may have one in my future as well, so we can learn together.

J.
 
rocketbob said:
You'd be surprised how many airplanes fly with their transponders switched off. Last weekend I crossed paths with a CAP 172 and my MRX never took notice.
Click to expand...

I'm with Bob! While onboard traffic warnings are another good tool in the bag, I worry that folks are going to be flying around DEPENDING on it to tell them where all the traffic is. I have spent enough of my career flying non-electrical airplanes around to know that there are lots of airplanes without transponders - and hitting them will be just as deadly.

Keep the eyes outside as much as possible!
 
Very shortly (in next couple of weeks) SkyView will be able to receive traffic information from any device that outputs data in Garmin's GTX 330 TIS format. This includes the Zaon XRX, the Garmin GTX 330, and the NavWorx ADS-B receiver, as well as the new SkyView SV-XPNDR-261 and SV-XPNDR-262 Mode-S transponders. Traffic graphics are shown in the standard TCAS 1 format, as you can see below.

-Robert
Dynon Marketing

SkyView-Traffic-PFD.jpg


SkyView-Traffic-Map.jpg
 
Keep looking

Ironflight said:
Keep the eyes outside as much as possible!
Click to expand...

Indeed! I have spent a lot of time flying into "uncontrolled" (I prefer "pilot controlled") airports in aircraft with full-on TCAS. A lot of traffic observed out the window never showed up on the display. Keep your head on a swivel.

John Clark ATP, CFI
FAA FAAST Team Member
EAA Flight Advisor
RV8 N18U "Sunshine"
KSBA
 
AAnybody have a rough guess as to the weight savings if I change from an 8 pack of steam gauges (has VOR and Wing leveler) to a Glass EFIS ?

Thanks,

Darren
 
SKYVIEW TCAS INFO

Hello Robert from Dynon Marketing..
----------------------------------
'' SkyView will be able to receive traffic information from any device that outputs data in Garmin's GTX 330 TIS format. This includes the Zaon XRX, the Garmin GTX 330, and the NavWorx ADS-B receiver, as well as the new SkyView SV-XPNDR-261 and SV-XPNDR-262 Mode-S''
----------------------------------
I will be picking up my new Skyview next week and would like to know if this Traffic info will be working for us north of the border as I believe the TIS System is a US only system or will it work like a standard TCAS system??

Thanks

Bruno Dionne
[email protected]
 
RV-4 said:
I will be picking up my new Skyview next week and would like to know if this Traffic info will be working for us north of the border as I believe the TIS System is a US only system or will it work like a standard TCAS system??
Click to expand...
I'm interested in the answer to this as well. I'm considering upgrading my steam gauges to a glass panel.
 
Snowflake said:
I'm interested in the answer to this as well. I'm considering upgrading my steam gauges to a glass panel.
Click to expand...

As I understand it, TIS will be scaling back even in the US... these are rather old pages though, so things could have changed since then.

http://www8.garmin.com/aviation/tis/index.html
http://www8.garmin.com/aviation/tis.jsp

What is the future of TIS?
The FAA provides TIS services through a network of 129 radar ground stations, which send traffic information in covered areas to Mode S transponders. The TIS information comes from ASR-7, 8 and 9 radar units. Over the next several years, the FAA is upgrading 22 of these radar ground stations to ASR-11 units, which will no longer support TIS. The 22 radar ground stations are scheduled to be replaced one by one between now and 2013.
Click to expand...
 
RV-4 said:
I will be picking up my new Skyview next week and would like to know if this Traffic info will be working for us north of the border as I believe the TIS System is a US only system or will it work like a standard TCAS system??

Thanks

Bruno Dionne
Click to expand...
I asked that very same question here and the response was:
dynonsupport said:
SkyView can accept traffic from any device that supports the Garmin 330 format.

This means we can receive traffic from:

Dynon Transponder (TIS)
Garmin 330 Transponder (TIS)
Zaon XRX (Passive)
Navworx (ADS-B)
TRIG (future ADS-B product)

And anything else I may have forgotten.
Click to expand...
So, to recieve traffic in a "foreign" radar environment (that is, no TIS), you'll need the Zaon XRX (or that Monroy Aerospace thing, IIRC). Other than that, you can do what I am going to, and get the XRX, as well as the NavWorx box to cover both SSR and ADS-B replies.
 
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