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dan carley

Well Known Member
does anyone know where the smoke jets should be located on the exhaust? i have a system on the plane but not producing enough smoke. the nossels are about 2/3 down on the exhaust should they be closer to the engine?

thanks
danny
 
I have mine right after the "y" on the crossover for one side of the engine. It'll produce as much smoke as I care to, and most of the time I leave my "smoke valve" turned down to 1/4 or so for a nice trail.

Cheers,
Stein

RV6's, Minneapolis
 
smoke sys

i found the problem, one side was clogged. got both sides going should work better now.

thanks
danny
 
dan carley said:
does anyone know where the smoke jets should be located on the exhaust? i have a system on the plane but not producing enough smoke. the nossels are about 2/3 down on the exhaust should they be closer to the engine?

thanks
danny
Click to expand...
I've got one nozzle about 6-8 inches down from the crossover "Y". I get a fair amount of smoke. Would probably do better installing a second nozzle, but it's just not high on my list right now.
 
Marvin Story's Smoke System

Check this out. While not on an RV, it sure looks interesting.

The KC Dawn Patrol sure look to have a LOT of fun with their "fighters".
 
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Well, looks like my smoke system plans have been veto'd by he who holds the larger share of the plane.. ;)
 
DIY Smoke System

I built a smoke system back in 1970 for use in my Champ; I constructed the system from 2 Freon tanks, one contained oil, and the other air. The oil tank was made with a dip tube to the bottom supplying the pressurized oil to the engine exhaust manifold. A valve in the hose to the manifold controlled the oil flow.
A fitting was welded on one exhaust pipe very near the flange and a small hole drilled thru the pipe. Don?t remember the drill size but it was very small.
The link below shows the tanks but I have since robbed the regulator from the tank for other projects. I recall setting the regulator at 20 PSI.
Building one today I would start with smaller tanks, as it was, the air supply would last all summer and the oil would go along way. I would consider using the larger propane torch cylinders for my next system and limit the air supply tank to 60 PSI with 20 PSI to the oil tank.

Don


http://img114.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dsc00639dz8.jpg
 
Smoke trails

I didnt put smoke on my plane right away. But after I did, I have decided it is a nice safety device. Example, flying in the pattern or near an airport, when you report in on CTAF someone else is looking for you just give out a couple puffs of smoke and a lot of times they pick you out much quicker. Plus it is kind of cool to lay down smoke a private runways.

Jim Knight
Burlington Iowa
RV-6
 
Smoke Picture

IMG_0536.jpg




Jim Knight
Burlington Iowa
 
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Good lookin' pic Jim..

Burlington, IA eh? I used to fly a Jetstream 32 into there all the time..

Is that the Smokingairplanes.com setup?

I may have to start saving my pennies.. I think we are about to pick up a couple CH control grips and *NEED* something to go on one of those buttons.. :D


dsc00618nz4.jpg
 
Save a little bit of money - I have a 55 gal barrell of Form Release oil that I use. It's a lot cheaper than the MDW stuff, always available locally (most oil supply houses have it) and if you get a couple of friends together and buy it you can usually get a deal on it. It leaves beautiful white smoke that doesn't smell, and hangs around nicely. See Below. These were shot with the smoke set between 1/4 and 1/2 output. More than that leaves a ton of smoke, but goes through the oil REALLY fast, and I only have the 3 gal tank....

Smoke Pass 1

Smoke Pass 2

Comment about the safety thing. Turns out I have used my smoke system more than once for people to see me. Doesn't take long when you leave a couple puffs out behind you for them to find out.

I like it and think everyone should have one!

Cheers,
Stein
 
Stein -

Is that the Smoking Airplanes setup? Where do you have your oil tank mounted?

I love your videos.. I never really thought about the safety aspect of that but it does make sense... A blip of smoke and voila there you are.. :)

Maybe I can talk pops into biting off on the idea and emphasis the safety aspect.. :D
 
SOLD!

SteinAir said:
Save a little bit of money - I have a 55 gal barrell of Form Release oil that I use. It's a lot cheaper than the MDW stuff, always available locally (most oil supply houses have it) and if you get a couple of friends together and buy it you can usually get a deal on it. It leaves beautiful white smoke that doesn't smell, and hangs around nicely. See Below. These were shot with the smoke set between 1/4 and 1/2 output. More than that leaves a ton of smoke, but goes through the oil REALLY fast, and I only have the 3 gal tank....

Smoke Pass 1

Smoke Pass 2

Comment about the safety thing. Turns out I have used my smoke system more than once for people to see me. Doesn't take long when you leave a couple puffs out behind you for them to find out.

I like it and think everyone should have one!

Cheers,
Stein
Click to expand...

Sooooooooooo... tell us about your system. In the first video, how much oil did you use?

How can we build one?:D:D
 
Yeh, he may not be using the Smoking Airplanes setup, as they have a 3.5 gallon as the smallest tank, if he is running a 3 gallon tank, it may indeed be a home brew setup.. :)

I'd be all over building my own setup.. :D
 
I have one of the "old" (many years ago) smoking airplanes systems and indeed I have the 3.5 gal tank. I just never fill it all the way to the brim so I count on 3 gal's.

http://www.smokingairplanes.com/

It's probably THE most complete install kit for anything I've EVER purchased for my RV. It's not cheap, but the guys have kit put together down to the most minute detail, including the zip ties for wiring! Took me a half a Saturday to install....not that difficult, and since I put mine in, many others here in the MN wing have copied me!

I have nothing but good things to say about this system. It's expensive, but if you accumulate all the stuff you need, then cobble it all together you'll probably expend that much money in time alone.

My tank is in the baggage compartment behind the pilot seat, bit is easily removable (with 4 winged bolts supplied with the kit) and the wire/hose is also quick disconnect. My oil usually lasts me quite awhile because I leave it turned down to 1/4 or so....otherwise at full bore you can pump the tank dry in a few minutes or so (plus, if the EGT is not high, you'll have a messy belly to clean up). That goes for smoke oil as well. Regular Diesel mixed with Tranny fluid to thin it down also seems to work fine, but doesn't leave nearly as pretty of a trail as the form release oil/Corvus does.

Cheers,
Stein.
 
Roll your own smoke system it isn't hard. I used a outboard motor oil tank(two-cycle) a Faucet solid state oil pump, and a couple of home made nozzles welded to the exhaust system and a small flow valve to control the flow in the cockpit. I have put the smoke toggle switch on the panel and a push button on the stick. Works great and you can make the airport go IFR. Total cost under $150.00.
 
dsc00618nz4.jpg
[/QUOTE]


I have a homemade two gallon tank that fits in front of the firewall on the left side. I use a BE2000 fuel pump from Oreillys. I think it is rated at 75 psi. I have two nozzles with
.090 holes in them. I use a 5 dollar 30 amp relay next to the pump to allow small wires to the switch. Oil is ParaFlex from a local oil distributor. I believe it is a food grade hydraulic oil. I can use 2 gallons per minute when it is on. But that would be a three mile long smoke trail.

I quoted the link from Tram to get the picture insert still trying to figure it out. I think I might even have some pictures of oil tank if I can find them. I will post later today.

Jim Knight
 
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Jim - Thanks for the info.. :)

It would be nice to get a tank that would mount on the firewall instead of the in the baggage compartment..

If you want to throw an image into the thread all you have to do is throw a
and it should pop up.. :D
 
Anybody have any pics of the tank on the engine side of the FW? I'm in the early stages of planning a smoke system, and I'd like to keep the weight of it as far forward as I can.

Thanks!:cool:
 
smoke on -7

If you're considering smoke on a side-by-side, check my installation. It's a system from smoking airplanes. One thing that makes my system unique, is that from the start I was insistent that I would never use my smoke system if I couldn't use an external filler. On the -8's, this isn't such a big deal if you put the tank in the forward compartment. But I know me. With the tank in the back of the -7, it's just a matter of when and how much oil I'm going to spill back there. At the time, John didn't have an external fill kit. Initially, I didn't really appreciate the difficulty of finding the right hoses and parts to achieve that requirement, but now I do. I am proud to say that John accelerated development on this, in part to keep me from dragging too much home depot into my plane. :)

n517dg smoke system installation

I will second earlier comments on his kit. It is the best kit I've installed on the plane in terms of how the instructions and parts are provided. And John ranks right up there with his personal support of the product.

Don
waiting on paperwork...
rv7-N517DG
 
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Couple notes:

A high pressure in-tank EFI fuel pump taken from your auto mechanic's scrap pile make an excellent pump for small systems. It is part of the sender unit, which often only comes as a unit, thus replacing the sender means replacing a good fuel pump. Your mechanic throws 'em in a box just in case he ever needs a pump. They handle Canopus 13 just fine, and they are tiny. Used one for the system on my Canuck, pumping into three 1/8" nozzles a few inches outboard of the exhaust ports. Made good smoke with very low oil consumption.





Some of the airshow pros are using DC gear pumps designed for marine oil change applications. The Reverso GP-301 or 302 are good examples:

http://www.reversopumps.com/downloads/Reverso_Pumps_Marine.pdf

Compact, powerful, and reversable, meaning you can rig the system to fill its own tank with little more than a valve, a quick connect, and a hose. No more oil spills.

Speaking of quick connects, consider a hydraulic line coupler. Here's one on the belly of an Extra.

 
If you don't need it to create smoke for very long, you can just connect the red wire to the black wire...

:D
 
Wing tank

I've been thinking about this for a while as well and didn't have a good solution until tonight. I was talking to my brother, Chris, about the problem and he suggested making a cylindrical tank that goes in the lightening holes of one of the wing leading edges...similar to the extended range fuel tanks that someone used to sell at one time. I really like this idea, so it's what I'm going to do. I'll post some pictures when I get around to it.
 
mcencula said:
I've been thinking about this for a while as well and didn't have a good solution until tonight. I was talking to my brother, Chris, about the problem and he suggested making a cylindrical tank that goes in the lightening holes of one of the wing leading edges...similar to the extended range fuel tanks that someone used to sell at one time. I really like this idea, so it's what I'm going to do. I'll post some pictures when I get around to it.
Click to expand...

Mike, use caution with this setup!

A friend had a Greatlakes home built and set up the fuselage tank as his smoke tank.

One day while on a cross country flight he pulled in front of the fuel tanks and ran for the bathroom. While in mid-trot, he asked the line boy to top him off. Even with the placard indicating the forward tank was for smoke oil he came out to find the kid was filling the smoke tank w/ 100 LL.

Sure was a good thing he came out when he did. Had he not caught it and stroked the smoke, they probably would have just found little bitty parts.
 
Locking fuel cap on the oil tank sounds like a good idea. I'm just starting the -4 wings, so I'm gonna me looking at how to build in a oil tank. Even harder to find room in the -4.
 
Home rolled

mcencula said:
I've been thinking about this for a while as well and didn't have a good solution until tonight. I was talking to my brother, Chris, about the problem and he suggested making a cylindrical tank that goes in the lightening holes of one of the wing leading edges...similar to the extended range fuel tanks that someone used to sell at one time. I really like this idea, so it's what I'm going to do. I'll post some pictures when I get around to it.
Click to expand...

Funny you should mention that, I have set out to do just the same thing. Am in the process of getting all the parts. I calculate 2.7 gal capacity, installed dry weight of the system under 10 lbs, easy oil fill at the wing tip, cost about $300. Just now trying to decide what to use as an injector(s).
 
A data point for you

Rodoc said:
Funny you should mention that, I have set out to do just the same thing. Am in the process of getting all the parts. I calculate 2.7 gal capacity, installed dry weight of the system under 10 lbs, easy oil fill at the wing tip, cost about $300. Just now trying to decide what to use as an injector(s).
Click to expand...

Rodoc,

Just an FYI, good dense smoke will take at least .75 gpm, with a single injector more like 1.0gpm.

My 3.5 gal system is barely enough.

Slick
 
Just a thought ----

From experience in the RC model world, preheating the oil makes a huge difference it the amount of smoke, and the "Quality" also.

In our RC models we typically have a coil of tubing inside the muffler to preheat.

For a RV, I would imagine a couple of wraps of the copper tubing around the outside of the exhaust pipe and then to the injection port would help a lot.

For fire safety, some kind of purge setup would be a good idea, dont think flying around with residual smoke oil in the preheat tube would be too smart.:eek:
 
Inverted...

Rodoc said:
Funny you should mention that, I have set out to do just the same thing. Am in the process of getting all the parts. I calculate 2.7 gal capacity, installed dry weight of the system under 10 lbs, easy oil fill at the wing tip, cost about $300. Just now trying to decide what to use as an injector(s).
Click to expand...

I figure the trickiest part will be making some arrangement of baffling at the downward end of the tank so that I can continue to smoke while upside down. :D
 
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