M

mantry

Well Known Member
Howdy, I have made an initial offer on a 2004 RV7 with O360, CS and when I gave it a quick look over to determine if this was an airplane I would consider I came away a little underwhelmed with all the NON-AIRCRAFT related issues, in other words, the airplane looked great but when I didn't see some things I thought I should see I became a little concerned. The current owner is the 2nd owner and purchased it from the builder.

I would like to find out all the details on what I should be receiving with the airplane. I did print out the "SO YOU'RE CONSIDERING BUYING A FLYING RV" off VANSAIRCRAFT and it mentions a few things:

1. Special Airworthiness Certificate - Pink
(I have seen this in the aircraft)

2. Registration
(I have seen this in the aircraft)

3. Weight and Balance
There was Weight and Balance in the aircraft but I'm a little concerned as this weight and balance was really more of the "WEIGHING OF THE AIRCRAFT". I didn't see the loading details, like FUEL MAX xx GALLONS and the weight for that, or even the weight for the pilot/pax and baggage. Q: What all should I see concerning this?

4. Set of Operating Limitations specific to this one airplane. This is what is mentioned in the VANS document, what exactly am I looking for on this? Can someone give me an example or tell me more on what I'm looking for?

5. Operator's Handbook - Don't know that I saw any of this in the aircraft. Is this going to be the checklists, operating limitations, etc.

6. Maintenance Manual - Is this a requirement or a nice to have?

7. Plans and Builder manual - Is it normal to expect that these would be available?

8. Copies of Builders log and photo record - I'm guessing this is not a required item but it would sure be nice to have.

Help.........
If you guys could give me some direction I would sure appreciate it.

I have a friend who is an A&P/IA who was going to do a Pre-purchase inspection and while I think he can handle the mechanical aspect of checking it over I'm not sure he knows the EAB aspect as well.

I am an EAA member, but not active in the local chapter. Sounds like I maybe need to dig up a local person/tech advisor who can help me navigate this process.

Thanks in advance!
 
Operating Limitations

It is part of the pink 8130-7 form you saw. The plane must have both in the plane to be legal for flight.

It will be a 5-6 page document on FAA letterhead. One of the first sentences says "these operating limitations are part of 8130-7 dated xx/xx/xxxx.

A manual is not required. Placards/labels are required and are mentioned in the Operating Lims.
 
I would hope for some maintenance records. How old is the engine? Prop?
Is there a wiring diagram or circuit list?

Getting a copy of the plans is easy. Buy the $10 CD-ROM from Van's.
 
The A that maintains the aircraft for the owner has the logbooks and I have not had a chance to see those yet but will before I proceed. Hopefully there us some of this missing stuff there also.

Thank you!
 
1. Special Airworthiness Certificate - Pink
(I have seen this in the aircraft)
>this is required, but needs operating limitations to be complete.

2. Registration
(I have seen this in the aircraft)
>You will have a new one, but good to know he had one.

3. Weight and Balance
There was Weight and Balance in the aircraft but I'm a little concerned as this weight and balance was really more of the "WEIGHING OF THE AIRCRAFT". I didn't see the loading details, like FUEL MAX xx GALLONS and the weight for that, or even the weight for the pilot/pax and baggage. Q: What all should I see concerning this?
>the empty weight is established as well as the CG of same. You can download a spreadsheet for loading scenarios online or probably here on VAF.

4. Set of Operating Limitations specific to this one airplane. This is what is mentioned in the VANS document, what exactly am I looking for on this? Can someone give me an example or tell me more on what I'm looking for?
>it will say "Operating Limitations" in big letters and will be 2-4 pages. It must be in the plane to be legal to fly. A FSDO or possibly a DAR can issue new OL's if you lose the originals.

5. Operator's Handbook - Don't know that I saw any of this in the aircraft. Is this going to be the checklists, operating limitations, etc.
>there should be samples online or here on VAF. Or, you can make one up.

6. Maintenance Manual - Is this a requirement or a nice to have?
>if there is one, he made it up himself. Usually an original set of plans are the best Maint manual.

7. Plans and Builder manual - Is it normal to expect that these would be available?
>nice to have but not required.

8. Copies of Builders log and photo record - I'm guessing this is not a required item but it would sure be nice to have.
>nice to have but not required.

I have a friend who is an A&P/IA who was going to do a Pre-purchase inspection and while I think he can handle the mechanical aspect of checking it over I'm not sure he knows the EAB aspect as well.
>you will want a Prebuy inspection by someone who knows the RV-7.

I am an EAA member, but not active in the local chapter. Sounds like I maybe need to dig up a local person/tech advisor who can help me navigate this process.
>you will want a Prebuy inspection by someone who knows the RV-7.
 
I do NOT see logbooks in your list.

You should get ALL Logbooks. There is required to be an Airframe logbook. I recommend that homebuilders have 3 logs. Airframe, Engine, and Prop. There may even be a Test Flight Logbook.

Make sure that the Airframe logbook has a record of the latest once a year "Condition Inspection." There also must be an entry for completion of Phase I (Flight Testing). There also must be an entry by a DAR or FAA Inspector that the aircraft was found to meet the requirements for the certificate requested and the date the 8130-7 and OpLims were issued.

Most homebuilts do not have an "Operator's Handbook" or "Maintenance Manual."

The FAA Requires that they get a copy of Weight and Balance showing calculations with sample loadings for empty weight, gross weight, Most Forward CG, most Aft CG, and sample 1st test flight examples. Most people will put a copy of this in the aircraft. The above examples should give any pilot a good "Go" or "No Go" loading configurations. As long as you load between the examples, you should be good weight and balance wise.

IF the OpLims are missing, you can get a copy from the FAA Registry in OK City. The FAA Registry has been know to FAX a copy to pilots when they are missing. You can also purchase all the FAA Registry files from the FAA on CD. Most DAR's should be able to get you an eCopy but the FAA does charge the DAR a fee to get an eCopy. Weight and Balance most likely will not be in the FAA Registry files.
 
Since you are buying from a second owner, he may not, himself, have the plans and builder's log. However, I seem to recall that Van's would make the plans available to new owners - that may only apply to unfinished aircraft. However, it can't hurt to ask and they now have them in electronic format. However, that only covers the airframe and does not cover avionics, firewall forward, or any modifications the builder may have made.
 
Folks, thanks so much for your input. I think I'm up to speed now!

I'm set up with my local A/P friend and the local EAA Chapter chief tech advisor so that combined with all the input I received on here we should be on track.

I'll be sure to post the new addition since.
 
flion said:
Since you are buying from a second owner, he may not, himself, have the plans and builder's log. However, I seem to recall that Van's would make the plans available to new owners - that may only apply to unfinished aircraft. However, it can't hurt to ask and they now have them in electronic format.
Click to expand...

Yes, the CD Plans are available for all models for $10 each. A very handy resource...

You will also want to ensure that you receive copies of the Kit Packing Lists that will document every part that was shipped and went into the project. Invoices, receipts, and other miscellaneous communications are also helpful. When you consummate the deal, make sure that you forward a copy of the Bill Of Sale to Vans to register that aircraft SerNo in your name.

And of course, every manual for every other system on the aircraft...:eek:
 
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