[ron sterba]

Not sure about the material but its a bar of hard nylon or something. Maybe UTHWM, Any clues where I could buy it or why I should not? Sounds like a good thing. Just finished the mounting of the Vert,Hori,Rudder,Elevator,trim Tab. Ron in Oregon

 

[Greg Arehart]

Ron,

The internal rudder stop is sold by CraigVince (I believe) on this forum. The external (original Van's) stop is a piece of fabricated Al angle.

greg

 

[ColoCardinal]

Internal Rudder Stop

Yes, Craig had taken up the project of making the internal stops. He'll also send you the drawings if you would like to make them yourself.

 

[LifeofReiley]

Quick & Easy...

You can get one right here...

http://www.flyboyaccessories.com/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=82&products_id=409

 

[bsacks05]

There was a 7A camped next to me at SNF that went through the storm. The only damage was to the rudder. The internal stop didn't stop the rudder from getting a hole on either side from the corners of the elevators. Lots of variables in that situation.....very high winds and no gust locks are biggies. Just sharing what I saw.

 

[islandmonkey]

I have heard that because of the extra leverage and moment on the rudder when using the internal stop, damage is more likely if gust locks are not used and the rudder goes slamming into the internal stop.

This is only what I have heard and needs to be justified by people who may have found out the hard way.

 

[Mike S]

Here is Craig's contact info.

Yes, Craig had taken up the project of making the internal stops. He'll also send you the drawings if you would like to make them yourself.

http://www.vansairforce.com/community/member.php?u=4499

 

[Flying Scotsman]

I have heard that because of the extra leverage and moment on the rudder when using the internal stop, damage is more likely if gust locks are not used and the rudder goes slamming into the internal stop.

What extra leverage? What extra moment?

Both internal and external stops should result in the same throw, from the same hinge-line, and the stops are both located essentially in the same plane or nearly so (in one case, the stop is the surface of the spar, and in the other, a bar that extends out from nearly the same plane as the surface of the spar).

The moment of the rudder is also the same, regardless of type of stop.

I would guess that either one, with no lock, may result in damage from a sudden, violent slamming of the rudder to one side and the forces on it...both a momentum as it suddenly stops, and the end flexes as it continues in the direction of motion, plus perhaps a bending/twisting due to wind loads.

 

[islandmonkey]

What extra leverage? What extra moment?

The moment of the rudder is also the same, regardless of type of stop.

I would guess that either one, with no lock, may result in damage from a sudden, violent slamming of the rudder to one side and the forces on it...both a momentum as it suddenly stops, and the end flexes as it continues in the direction of motion, plus perhaps a bending/twisting due to wind loads.

The distance from the hinge to the point where the rudder stop arrests the movement of the rudder gives the moment. I would imagine that with the internal stop that distance is shorter than with the external stop. I could be wrong and I am prepared to be corrected, but in a nice way!!!

 

[Mike S]

The distance from the hinge to the point where the rudder stop arrests the movement of the rudder gives the moment.

I believe the term for distance is "arm", and when multiplied by the force, the product becomes "moment"

I could be wrong and I am prepared to be corrected, but in a nice way!!!

Nice enough

 

[Flying Scotsman]

The distance from the hinge to the point where the rudder stop arrests the movement of the rudder gives the moment. I would imagine that with the internal stop that distance is shorter than with the external stop. I could be wrong and I am prepared to be corrected, but in a nice way!!!

I get what you're saying...you're talking about the moment arm of the rudder spar or the rudder horn, not the moment arm of the actual rudder.

I have seen pictures of rudders damaged from slamming to the stop and the *skin* bangs into the elevators, thus putting a hole in the skin. I thought that's what you were talking about.

Was there some sort of damage other than that to which you're referring? Like damage to the spar itself?

 

[islandmonkey]

I get what you're saying...you're talking about the moment arm of the rudder spar or the rudder horn, not the moment arm of the actual rudder.

I have seen pictures of rudders damaged from slamming to the stop and the *skin* bangs into the elevators, thus putting a hole in the skin. I thought that's what you were talking about.

Was there some sort of damage other than that to which you're referring? Like damage to the spar itself?

Steve, I am glad you grasped what I was trying very badly to describe. I have the suspicion, that the spar can be damaged more easily with an internal rudder stop. Again it is only a suspicion and I stand to be corrected. If I was going to fit an internal rudder stop, I would personally lock the rudder every time the aircraft was parked on the ground.

 

[craigvince]

If I was going to fit an internal rudder stop, I would personally lock the rudder every time the aircraft was parked on the ground.

Internal or external rudder stop, you should still use some sort of a gust-lock. It really doesn't matter how far the rudder moves when you're in a bad storm like the one at SnF. Keep the rudder from moving.

I would recommend something like this: http://www.airgizmos.com/AirGizmos-Gust-Locks_p_35.html

 

[ron sterba]

Thanks Guys. They were good thoughts to ponder on. I appreciate all the help. I think I'll go with the internal stop with a external gust surface lock. Maybe less drag, without the external stops might give me 1-2 MPH faster.....?.....?

Ron Thanks again 9QB