[The Wizzard]

I ordered the RV-8 empanage but am having second thoughts. All my friends are flying the 8 however I my want to teach a few others in the 7. I don't like the center mounted throttle of the 7. Does anyone know of a side mounted setup? I want to fly formation and acro and prefer to use my left hand for controlling power. Can you give me some pros or cons as to why one model or the other.

 

[Andy Hill]

Hi Dave...

As an RV-8 builder / owner / flyer I should be totally biased in favour of the RV-8. However, one or 2 of your points lead me to hesitate to say the RV-8 would suit you better:

however I my want to teach a few others

The RV-8 is a poor "basic instructional" machine. The rear seat instructor has limited vis in the crucial landing / takeoff phase, limited access to controls and by definition limited instrumentation.

The RV-8 is, however, a great "advanced instructional" aircraft e.g. teaching formation, aerobatics (within the CG / weight limits) to pilots proficient at flying. You can coach / feedback all aspects of their flying. I speak as an instructor, and have, largely inadvertantly ended up trying to "coach" people to fly an RV-8 who really needed, it turned out, to be "taught" to fly a taildragger. In both cases, they were sent off to hone / improve their TD skills in another type, and then successfully converted to the RV-8.

I don't like the center mounted throttle of the 7. Does anyone know of a side mounted setup?

I am sure it can, and has been done.

I want to fly formation and acro and prefer to use my left hand for controlling power

At one extreme, set aircraft up to fly from the RHS I fly numerous types (RVs, JPs, Extras, Bulldogs, Airbuses, Yaks) from Left, Right, Front, Back seat, and vary as a consequence which hand is stick and which is power, and have to say, hardly notice it.

Can you give me some pros or cons as to why one model or the other

Leaving aside your points, the RV-8 is, in my biased opinion, the way to go for sheer flying pleasure I do a lot of aerobatics / formation (instructing), and the SBS RVs I find limiting - especially since the low profile canopy limits your visibility across cockpit. As a consequence you want to sit as high as possible (arrange seating) but that is an issue if you wear a helmet which attacks the poor owners canopy As you say, the default quadrant arrangement of the RV-8 is preferable.

I am sure 99 other, and totally contrary, opinions will be coming along shortly...

Andy & Ellie Hill
RV-8 G-HILZ

 

[yakdriver]

I ordered the RV-8 empanage but am having second thoughts. All my friends are flying the 8 however I my want to teach a few others in the 7. I don't like the center mounted throttle of the 7. Does anyone know of a side mounted setup? I want to fly formation and acro and prefer to use my left hand for controlling power. Can you give me some pros or cons as to why one model or the other.

Leave the throttle in the middle and fly from the right seat if you just have to have right stick/left throttle. It is not hard to use left stick, you learned in an airplane with left yoke right?. Modifying it for left hand throttle creates other ergonomic problems like having to switch hands to change radio freqs etc. Also putting a dual throttle set up so you can teach is overly complicated and the guy in the left seat has left stick/right throttle. If you just have to have left throttle/right stick build an 8. JMHO Don

 

[msturgis]

I know Dan Checkoway had a left mounted quad in his -7.

 

[David-aviator]

I fly a 7 and love it, but real pilots sit one the center line of an airplane with the stick in their right hand and throttle on the left.

I had the throttle on the left but gave up on it because too much other stuff had to be operated with the right hand, like flaps, trim, and radio, which involved switching flying hands at the wrong time. The throttle is back center mounted and has been for some time.

If you decide to go with a left hand throttle with the 7, think about those items I mention. It can be done for sure, but I did not plan it well. The back seat throttle for the 8 is what I used. It was not perfect, but it worked for as long as I dealt with it.

 

[David-aviator]

Leave the throttle in the middle and fly from the right seat if you just have to have right stick/left throttle. It is not hard to use left stick, you learned in an airplane with left yoke right?. Modifying it for left hand throttle creates other ergonomic problems like having to switch hands to change radio freqs etc. Also putting a dual throttle set up so you can teach is overly complicated and the guy in the left seat has left stick/right throttle. If you just have to have left throttle/right stick build an 8. JMHO Don

I've done that, but the Dynon D10A is very difficult to read from the right seat. Lots of stuff to think about here....sitting in the middle is best.

When I win the lottery, I'm building an 8 even if I'm 80.

 

[yakdriver]

All of the airplanes I owned and most that I flew over the last 30 years were tandem. I really like my 7 with side by side as it is more fun with somebody next to you. Having someone to help with maps and navigation is way easier side by side. Don

 

[Crossbow]

I ordered the RV-8 empanage but am having second thoughts. All my friends are flying the 8 however I my want to teach a few others in the 7. I don't like the center mounted throttle of the 7. Does anyone know of a side mounted setup? I want to fly formation and acro and prefer to use my left hand for controlling power. Can you give me some pros or cons as to why one model or the other.

Ummm, about the teaching part of your post ....

while I am sure that there are several others around VAF that know more about this subject than I do, please keep in mind that Experimental planes cannot be used for Commercial purposes.

Therefore, I think that you can legally use an RV for Flight Instruction, and you can legally charge the student for your time as a Flight Instructor. However, you will not be able to charge the student for the airplane time (fuel, insurance, hanger fees, and other such things).

Therefore, please keep that in mind about your RV decision.

Thanks!

 

[N941WR]

Ummm, about the teaching part of your post ....

while I am sure that there are several others around VAF that know more about this subject than I do, please keep in mind that Experimental planes cannot be used for Commercial purposes.

Therefore, I think that you can legally use an RV for Flight Instruction, and you can legally charge the student for your time as a Flight Instructor. However, you will not be able to charge the student for the airplane time (fuel, insurance, hanger fees, and other such things).

Therefore, please keep that in mind about your RV decision.

Thanks!

Actually you can use an EAB for flight instruction AND charge the student. This is allowed, if the aircraft if maintained in a manner similar to what a flight school has to do (100 hour inspections, etc.) and the owner/instructor wants to jump the through the hoops with the FAA.

This is how Mike Seager and others are allowed to charge for their services.

The FAA made this exception some time back to improve safety, which it has done, IMHO.

 

[Crossbow]

Actually you can use an EAB for flight instruction AND charge the student. This is allowed, if the aircraft if maintained in a manner similar to what a flight school has to do (100 hour inspections, etc.) and the owner/instructor wants to jump the through the hoops with the FAA.

This is how Mike Seager and others are allowed to charge for their services.

The FAA made this exception some time back to improve safety, which it has done, IMHO.

Thanks much!

That is very good information indeed.

 

[flytoboat]

Transition training

Actually you can use an EAB for flight instruction AND charge the student. This is allowed, if the aircraft if maintained in a manner similar to what a flight school has to do (100 hour inspections, etc.) and the owner/instructor wants to jump the through the hoops with the FAA.

This is how Mike Seager and others are allowed to charge for their services.

The FAA made this exception some time back to improve safety, which it has done, IMHO.

I believe this is just for transition training, not primary (PPL) training?

 

[Caveman]

Actually you can use an EAB for flight instruction AND charge the student. This is allowed, if the aircraft if maintained in a manner similar to what a flight school has to do (100 hour inspections, etc.) and the owner/instructor wants to jump the through the hoops with the FAA.

This is how Mike Seager and others are allowed to charge for their services.

The FAA made this exception some time back to improve safety, which it has done, IMHO.

Don't they need a letter of authorization for each individual instructor? I was under the impression that not every CFI could do this.

 

[Paul Thomas]

Think hard about how you're really going to use the airplane vs. how you think you may use it.

I'm building a -7 because I thought I wanted side by side for instruction (received in my case, I wouldn't teach in my airplane). Looking at my flying now, if I were starting today, I'd build an 8.

 

[pierre smith]

Not every instructor needs a LODA

Don't they need a letter of authorization for each individual instructor? I was under the impression that not every CFI could do this.

...or Letter of Deviation Authority. If my wife wants to learn to fly in our -10, any qualified (checked out in it) CFI can teach her and charge for his time. I'll just donate the airplane.

I am in the process of getting my second LODA to give transition training in my -10. The first one was for the RV-6A but each additional airplane needs its own LODA, which allows me to teach in it and charge for those guys needing transition training. I cannot give primary instruction in it and charge for said instruction except for a family member who wants to learn in it. I or any other RV-10 qualified instructor can teach primary in it, but not charge for the airplane's use...like my wife or son getting a freebie from me


You can also take your PPL or other rating's checkride in it, if you find a willing examiner....and I do know one nearby.

Best,

 

[The Wizzard]

Thanks so much for all of the helpful information.

Thanks eveybody! Great info here. I am going to proceed with the RV-8 idea. For me it outweighs the 7 advantages for what I want to do with it. It's kind of like the seaplane thing. If you want to land on water then nut a plane that was designed to do that!

Dave

 

[Maury]

I'm building a -7 because the warden didn't want to look at the back of my head. Seriously, I like the looks of the -7 and I will do more x-country than acro, but I wanted an airplane that will do both about equal.
Rick Maury
tail on the fuselage.

 

[osxuser]

When I was still building my -7 (instead of the parts sitting in my hangar) I was planning a solo-from-the-right configuration. It just made the most sense.

It would have full dual controls, but backup instruments would go on the left.