RudiGreyling

RudiGreyling

Well Known Member
Hi RVators,

I see from other threads, that the UK guys are also waiting to get approval from their local Aviation Regulators for the RV12.
http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?p=272072#post272072

I know Vans promised in some of the previous RVators that the RV12 design criteria and proof thereof will be available...initially estimated at Q3 this year.

In South Africa we have exactly the same problem as our UK counterparts, but at least we can commence the build.

I tried in vain to find out the status via various emails...I guess Vans is ignoring me because they are busy with it.

Short of me phoning them and taking more of their time...does anyone have an update on this information the NON USA countries require???

Thanx,
Rudi
 
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Rudi,

I have talked with Ken K and others about why it hasn't been certified yet as an SLSA since that must preceed and ELSA. They have replied (in unison) that because of the ELSA paperwork requirements (POH, Maint manual etc) that they are working fevoriously to make sure they are paperwork compliant to be able to certify not only as a SLSA but so that we can do ELSA's.

As a postnote, when our ELSA's are complete, the builder on the aircraft plate is Van's, not us! Certainly an advantage for resale purposes.

Anyway, I still believe

Pete
 
Hi Pete,

Thanx for the update, but I don't know if we are talking the same thing...
Some non USA countries need a "Design Spec and Proof" package before our Civil Aviation Authorities will allow us to Build/Register the airplanes in our local countries.

Anybody got some more info?

Thanx
Rudi
 
Frustration!!

I have emailed Vans (no names) who said they would pass it to engineering. No response. I have spoken to the LAA (again who said they would speak to the powers that be - no response).
The LAA said in an email that they have spoken to Vans and are will take information on a piece meal basis. Vans say (recently) that they the full pack only will be issued.
I have enough faith in Vans history of aircraft models to have bought all the kits issued to date.
Would Vans please issue something for us to start or start talking to the LAA (or is it the other way round?)
If anybody can help the 2 UK builders (as far as I know) it would be greatly appreciated.

Jim D
 
Thanks

Thanks guys for supporting the call for information. I'm about to receive my tail feathers. That's make another couple of boxes decorating the garage. Seems like we'll have to wait until Vans makes their SLA submission...

Nothing to prevent us building a trailer however...except that in the UK the maximum width is 7 ft 6 in, 6 inches less that the tail :-(

Think I'll move to the States where a dollar is still worth a dollar, and houses are cheap, and gas is cheaper than beer.
 
Jim,

I feel your pain, my emails also does not get answered...I wish we had just some news, any news....Like: "We are still busy with it, we have not forgotten about you guys, currently it looks like it will be ready by X DATE, so please dont bug us until then again cuase it detracts from our work"

Then at least we can relax till date X, but currently I feel like a mushroom, kept in the dark and....??? Not very good customer service for people that parted with their money already, based on a promise that the design pack will come Q3 2008.

Please Vans just keep us in the loop and informed, is that too much to ask??? We already parted with our money and trust in you, it is in your interest to keep us updated please. :D:)

Rudi
 
Jim & Keith,

I would suggest that you are interpreting the rules in a very rigorous way - there's nothing stopping you from starting. You know that the LAA will ask your inspector to inspect your workshop and anything you do before you close up any piece of structure. So as long as you find a pragmatic inspector who is happy for you to progress at risk, and will actually inspect things as you complete them before your build book arrives, then off you go. Clearly if LAA Engineering discover issues that they deem unsatisfactory, and require a modification before they will certify any UK built examples, then you may have some re-work. But that's the risk you run by starting before the project has been blessed by LAA Eng. You are also assuming that the LAA can get all the information the require from Van's - hasn't always been the case in the past and their relationship hasn't always been harmonious. Also, the LAA has to work to CS-VLA and the aeroplane has been designed to the LSA rules, so there may be some discrepancies. The other point is that if Van's haven't released all of the sub-kits yet then I'm guessing there is potential for the design to change (although perhaps only in a minor way), so how could the LAA approve a design that is not yet frozen? I think its reasonable for Van's to only release the datapack in one lump, and then not until the complete kit is available.

Bottom line is, if you want to, and are happy to take the risk, the start building.

Pete
 
UK situation

Thanks for the post.

I understand, from Jim, that Vans has shipped a set of documentation to the LAA, so the next action is with them.

For the benefit of UK readers, the LAA have not forbidden me to start, just not recommended it. They won't issue a "project number" until they are happy for a build to commence, so it isn't "legit" until that happens. Meanwhile it is very much my risk.

The LAA have, however, instructed their inspectors not to sign-off on any project that hasn't been officially blessed. So that is a further complication if we get past the point of closing any structure - which doesn't seem long for the tail components ;-)

I do have a friendly inspector and I am starting to progress, but am reluctant to close anything up meantime.

I am also aware that in the UK the airplane will be blessed (or otherwise) according to a different build standard. I guess this can be good and bad. We will, almost certainly, have to supplement an electronic display with some steam gauges and possibly warning lights, but we will also have choice as to what to install.

Cheers...Keith
 
gblwy said:
We will, almost certainly, have to supplement an electronic display with some steam gauges and possibly warning lights, but we will also have choice as to what to install.
Click to expand...

No almost about it! LAA require huff & puff ASI & Alt - slightly surprised that Van's chose to leave them out. Not sure what warning lights would be required, possibly starter engaged?

Pete
 
Starter warning

I also follow the Sportcruiser website. Recent correspondence there seems to suggest that a "starter engaged" warning light is no longer required?

Cheers...Keith
 
FYI: Queried Vans and they send me an email that they are still busy with the overall "Design" documentation. It seems they will be busy with it until all the sub kits and plans are released, cause the plans form part of it. Regards Rudi.
 
Current LAA Status

Hi
Based in Scotland, I'd like to build an RV12, however having spoken to the LAA they have indicated that I can start but at my own risk.

Does anyone have an update on how things are progressing with the LAA approval process?

Thanks

Grant
 
Current LAA Status

Grant,

The LAA are, to say the least, very tardy in responding to queries on the current LAA status. The design is being reviewed but dates seem to keep slipping without any information coming out. There are two kits that I know of un the UK, mine in Hartlepool, NE England and Keith Boardman in Scotland (see Keiths posts on this forum).

Jim D
 
LAA

Jim and I have now been issued with the yellow form inviting us to register our projects. Came with a disclaimer letter saying LAA do not recommend we build a new design, it may never be approved for flight, or may require modification. However the letter also points out that if no one is a guinea pig there will be no new designs in the UK.

Grant, if you wish to see my kit, feel free to contact me. I'm a complete novice as you will see from my blog.

http://www.mykitlog.com/grmps

Cheers...Keith
 
Kieth,

Just read through your Kitlog entries. Brings back lots of memories of when I was there as a novice builder. I had to learn to resist my natural inclination to make everything perfect. I slightly not-perfect rivet is way better than a messed up hole!

What is that primer you are using? I am just using NAPA 7220 spray cans from the local NAPA store. Priming the internal structure, but not the skins.

Good luck with the project.

John
 
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