[Jeffreymd]

has anyone experienced high oil temps on there rv-10. my oil temps are running in the high 240 range. my "BUILDER" has left the squacks up to me, and a&p work is not one of my better forte's. thanks guys, jeff

 

[Brian Denk]

Well, not sure of any particular issues with RV10 cooling, but a few basics need to be checked and considered in the big picture:

*Calibration of the temp gauge/sender. As a point of reference, I just replaced the original Isspro temp gauge in my RV8 with one of Van's new gauges. I thought I was running in the low 200's most of the time but now I'm well below that. Go figure.

*New engine? They run tight and hot for a while.

*What is the oil pressure indicating and is it dropping while the temp is increasing? It should as heat thins out the oil.

*Is this happening when it's 90 degrees outside or in any OSA temp condition?

*Do CHT/EGT temps correlate?

*Baffles sealing properly against the cowling?

*Where is the oil cooler mounted and what brand is it...

Need just a bit more info to make some semi-educated guesses as to what's happening and what to do about it.

We'll get it figured out. You came to the right place.

 

[Jeffreymd]

oil temps

thanks for the reply. here goes. i called dynon and they helped me calibrate my gauge. yes, i do have a new engine. the oil pressure is indicating around 71 and yes it does drop off as the oil temp rises. it's happening on all flights...oat has no factor over it. yes, my cht/egt do correlate....cht's-375-390 and egt's- below 1400. i was told not to lean to much during the break in period of 50 hrs. baffling seals seem to be very good, and the oil cooler is mounted on the pilot side firewall and i called van's and they said that it's the largest cooler they have and its the same as the stewart warner cooler. thanks again!!!! jeff

 

[Mark]

Jeff - I experienced fairly high oil temps (220 - 225) on my Aero Sport IO-540 after first ten hours. I called Bart and he told me that was pretty normal and that the temps would come down after putting more time on the engine. Temp is now running 195 - 200 in cruise (195 @65% and 200 @75% of power) after 42 hours with Texas OAT very warm. I also call Pacific about a SW oil cooler and the person I talked to told me to save my money (not that he wouldn't take it if I insisted) until I had a 100 hours on the engine.

 

[Jeffreymd]

oil temps

i found out that my oil temp gauge is reading 20 high. new sensor on the way. that will put me at 220-225. i have an aero sport io-540 too. so i'm just going to pray that it will come down to 200 after it's broken in. thanks for the help mark. blue skies, jeff

 

[ScottSchmidt]

Glad you guys were talking about this. Just finished my inspection and should be flying as soon as I get someone out to test my pitot static system. I also have an Aerosport engine. I'll keep an eye on the oil temps.
How did you test your sensor?

 

[rv969wf]

Oil Coolers / Stewart Warner #1 in my book.....

I do not have an RV-10 ok. Not sure what brand of oil cooler you have but I have tried just about every brand of oil cooler out there. Not trying to sell one over the other but what I have found is the Stewart Warner Dual Bypass Oil Coolers are the most efficient oil coolers on the market comparing them with the same size as XYZ //// oil coolers. No they are not cheap and there is a reason why. Stewart Warners are designed to work...period...

 

[Jeffreymd]

i had to go with a grt temp probe. my dynon probe was not reading right. temps are now in the 200-210 range. maybe they'll come down 10 more degrees after the break in. i also have an a/c, and we think that maybe playing a part, or maybe not. i will let EVERYONE in the world know how the a/c thing works out real soon. i may go with the dual oil cooler system anyway. blue skies yall, jeff

 

[Rick S.]

No warranty came with your RV huh? That's a rip off.

 

[gmcjetpilot]

More info

"has anyone experienced high oil temps on there rv-10. my oil temps are running in the high 240 range. my "BUILDER" has left the squacks up to me, and a&p work is not one of my better forte's. thanks guys, jeff"

May be you're flying too close to the sun?

Jeff you left a lot of info off so we have to guess, but it could be any and everything. What have you done so far? In a steep climb on a 110F day with a new tight engine, 240F may not be bad or abnormal. Can you fill in the blanks. Here is my guess assuming the set up or installation is at fault.

Get a BIGGER oil cooler made by SW? (There is a 11 row Stewart Warner for sale on this forum. People buy $200 cheap clone coolers and think they will do get the job done of a $500-$600 SW, they will not. They may look a like but there is a real diference. I understand the temptation go cheap there, but on IO360's (angle valve) and 540's (any) you need a SW cooler.

How is the cooler mounted? If you used Vans firewall oil cooler mount kit, throw it in the trash can. The hose and fittings are too small and terribly shaped. Search these forums for oil cooler for more info. Also mounting a LARGE heavy cooler direct to the baffles is guaranteed to break the baffle or the cooler or both from vibrations at some point. Recommend you mount it off the baffle. Here is a picture of a builder who mounted the cooler on the engine mount and ducted air from the rear baffle with a soft or flexible couple.

(click to enlarge):

OR

Note: In second pic the very big Oil cooler, hose and nice diffuser (funnel thing to cooler with gradual angled sides). Vans remote mount oil cooler kit does not look anything like this. Van's kit may get by on a 160HP RV but not a +200HP engine.

I have no idea what the problem is, but hope some of these ideas may help. all the best, George

 

[w1curtis]

...How is the cooler mounted? If you used Vans firewall oil cooler mount kit, throw it in the trash can. The hose and fittings are too small and terribly shaped. Search these forums for oil cooler for more info. Also mounting a LARGE heavy cooler direct to the baffles is guaranteed to break the baffle or the cooler or both from vibrations at some point. Recommend you mount it off the baffle. Here is a picture of a builder who mounted the cooler on the engine mount and ducted air from the rear baffle with a soft or flexible couple.

I have no idea what the problem is, but hope some of these ideas may help. all the best, George

George,

How can you make such a blanket statement about the Van's RV-10 oil cooler installation when you admittedly are not sure how it is mounted? Also, what does the mount kit have to do with the oil cooler fittings themselves? The hoses and fittings are -8

I'm just trying to understand you comments as I see no inherent problems with the Van's oil cooler design. You are suggesting that builders toss this design when you yourself are not familiar with it. Please explain this rationale? This is the IO-540 oil cooler installation on N410RV.

 

[PJSeipel]

If anyone has installed a Stewart Warner oil cooler on the RV-10, I'd be curious to know what model and how it's working out for you. I'm trying to decide if I want to stick with the $200 Van's model or go for the better SW.

PJ
RV-10 #40032

 

[gmcjetpilot]

What the heck

George,

[1] How can you make such a blanket statement about the Van's RV-
10 oil cooler installation when you admittedly are not sure how it is mounted?

[2] Also, what does the mount kit have to do with the oil cooler
fittings themselves? The hoses and fittings are -8

[3] I'm just trying to understand you comments as I see no inherent
problems with the Van's oil cooler design.

[4] You are suggesting that builders toss this design when you
yourself are not familiar with it. Please explain this rationale?

[5]This is the IO-540 oil cooler installation on N410RV.

[1] Well I can and I did.
(In fact the original poster gave little info to go on.)

[2] Ain't talking about the oil line "fittings" but talking about the SCAT and fittings
or the tin metal parts in Van's Mounting Kit Part Number = EA 3" OIL COOLER DUCT.
This accessory kit is especially terrible. The square shallow box top on the
cooler is awful. It works for a O320 but not a 540. I don't know why van does
not make something better. I guess its cheap to press out tin rather than
make a nice fiberglass diffuser. Apparently Van has a different design for the
RV-10 which is better than the EA 3" OIL COOLER DUCT, but it's not much
better. I don't see this RV-10 oil cooler mount as an engine accessory item in
the catalog, so I assume its part of the kit. Time will tell if its a good design.

[3] If your picture is the standard or stock Van's RV-10 cooler
installation, great. I can see some problems and can say the SW is a more
efficient cooler than the Aero-classic, Niagara or Positec.

[4] Nope, just talking, actually to Jeff who is having a problem.
Rational? Trying to help. However if you think the N410RV oil
cooler installation picture you attached is ideal or ever good, I would
disagree. It violates a hand full of basic aerodynamic principals. With that
said Bees fly and they are not suppose to. So if you like it, that is cool with
me, I don't care.

[5] N410RV, the factory RV-10? Is Jeff's identical to that? Is that a
standard supplied part or recommended installation in the kit? Now that you
mention it, yes I do see a problem.

N410RV's cooler box has the duct entering at right angle to the cooler face,
into a wedge volumn, than back out almost in the direct opposite direction of
the air flow out the cowl.


I don't mean to insult you but I got to be honest with you, looking at
N410RV's cooler installation with a critical eye, it's not that great. Part of the
cooler is choked from air (the narrow wedge area).

Even you can see what I mean after I point it out, it's convoluted at best.
The air flow is not even across the cooler core or optimal. If you think it
works great, that is all that matters, but we are talking about Jeff, who does
have a problem. I am trying to help him. Do what ever you want.

I'd don't know how Jeff's RV-10 oil cooler is installed or what type. No one
does based on the post. If RV-10's are like all the other RV's, the oil cooler
installation is left up to the builder and not supplied in the kit. It's possible I
am wrong. If Van supplies the oil cooler installation standard in the
RV-10 kit and it looks like the one in your picture, YES I think you can do
better.


If you don't like my comments please ignore. You make a suggestion, I make
a suggestion, Jeff the poster provides more info and we all work together to
solve his problem. I was not addressing you or N410RV. Just trying to help
Jeff. You obviously got it covered. All the best with your project.

 

[w1curtis]

...Ain't talking about the oil lines but talking about the SCAT and fittings in .. the only one I know of that he sells. It uses 3" SCAT for air, too small and poor design in my opinion. If your SCAT is 3" on a 540, it's not large enough.

The picture provided is the standard oil cooler design provided with the RV-10 FWF kit. It is designed for a 4" SCAT.

If your picture is the standard or stock Van's RV-10 cooler installation, great. I can see some problems and can say the SW is a more efficient make of cooler than the Aero-classic, Niagara or Positec.

Yes this is the standard oil cooler kit provided with the RV-10 FWF kit. Certainly the builder has the option of which oil cooler to use.

Nope, just talking, actually to Jeff who is having a problem. Rational? Trying to help.

OK, I understand you are trying to help and not getting worked up. You just made it seem like you were familiar with the RV-10 oil cooler design and gave specific instructions in your attempt "to help." These instructions were based on incorrect information on the RV-10 oil cooler design.

N410RV suppose to mean something? Oh yea the factory RV-10. Is that a standard supplied part in the kit.
Are all RV-10's the same or is this just on the factory prototype/demo. The point is I have no idea how Jeff's RV-10 is installed his cooler or what type. If its like all the other RV's, the oil cooler installation is left up to the builder. It's possible I am wrong. Does Van supplies the oil cooler installation standard in the RV-10 kit? It's not listed in the catalog.

OK fair enough, so ask for more information before making suggestions "to throw the provided kit in the trash can."

I don't mean to insult you but I got to be honest with you, looking at N410RV's cooler installation with a critical eye, it's not that great. The duct enters at right angle to the cooler face, into the wedge, than back out in the opposite direction of the air flow out the cowl. Even you can see what I mean, it's convoluted at best. The air flow is not even across the cooler core or optimal. If you think it works great that is all that matters. Geeee, I am OK with it and don't really care. We are talking about Jeff, who does have a problem.

No insult to me since I did not design it. I just don't see any reason to immediately point to the inadequacy of the design without any other or even complete information. All aircraft and their systems are an exercise in compromise. I'm sure this and other system designs could be improved. But maybe also while this design not perfect, it is adequate for the job. If Jeff is using an IO-540, there is a 99.9% probability that he is using the standard RV-10 oil cooler pictured.

As I pointed out Van's Mounting Kit Part Number = EA 3" OIL COOLER DUCT, which I did mention before is especially terrible, especially for larger engines. The square shallow box top on the cooler is awful. It may work for a O320 but not a 540.

This kit is NOT used on the RV-10!

If you don't like my comments please ignore. You make a suggestion, I make a suggestion, Jeff the poster provides more info and we all work together to solve his problem. I was not addressing you or N410RV. Just trying to help Jeff. You obviously got it covered. All the best with your project.

It is not weather I like your comments or not. I'm just suggesting that you ask for more information before making blanket statements that clearly DO NOT apply. Your comments were put forth with such authority that; the uninitiated reading your post could assume that there was an inherent design flaw with the RV-10 oil cooler design.

 

[gmcjetpilot]

Thanks got it

I just don't see any reason to immediately point to the inadequacy of the design without any other or even complete information. All aircraft and their systems are an exercise in compromise. I'm sure this and other system designs could be improved. But maybe also while this design not perfect, it is adequate for the job. If Jeff is using an IO-540, there is a 99.9% probability that he is using the standard RV-10 oil cooler pictured.

Thanks I did not know that, and no doubt its the standard installation. I agree that would be the last thing to look at and there is no need to point to the stock design as the problem, even if its not perfect. I am glad to hear Van went to 4" and is providing it stock to the kit. That is good. I think it will work fine. Regarding brand of cooler, I can say from experience that SW is better; however if you can get by with a Niagara or other brand at much less cost and it works for you, great. I find demanding engine installations like the IO360 angle valve or 540 take a good installation and cooler. With a "Standard" RV-10 cooler that will be good for most builders. No doubt some will have hot rod engines and other changes which may tax the stock set up. I know the small clone coolers have much lower efficency than the SW. The larger clones may be better. With the SW costing so much more I can understand wanting to go with the cheaper clone coolers.

 

[w1curtis]

I (we) value your opinion

George,

Glad we see eye-to-eye now. Hope you did not take my post the wrong way as I've have gained many an insight from your many post on various subjects. I think others on this forum also value your opinion on various subjects so I had to "set the record straight" on this subject because your opinion DOES indeed carry a lot of weight.

 

[Jeffreymd]

thanks george!!! that's some great info. temps here are 85 on the ground and around 76 at 3k ft. i was told to fly under 3k ft, at 75% power, full rich (or just a little lean for better fuel burn), untill 50 hrs so the engine would break in real good. the weather got cooler in the last week and i'm now running around 208. i may wait till next summer to change oil coolers and get rid of that van's setup. thanks again, jeff

 

[w1curtis]

.... i may wait till next summer to change oil coolers and get rid of that van's setup. ..

WOW! This is what I meant by the uninitiated. Dan Checkoway has some insights on his page regarding this. Scroll down to the "You didn't build it section". I had to go back to the first post to get the "my builder" reference. I haven't heard of any problems with high oil temps from actual RV-10 builders. There have been reports of high CHT, but not high oil temps. A builder intimate with the construction may look to the vernatherm first before a wholesale system swap-out.

 

[Rick S.]

Excellent point William,

Exactly how far can Jeff proceed without requiring the services of an A & P? Since he is not the builder the FAR's do limit the scope of work allowed without an A & P license or repairmans certificate right?

 

[kentb]

You have the power

Only the conditional inspection need to be done by an A&P or the repairman. All other work can be done by anyone.

I don't know if it would qualify (I think it would) as a major alteration, therefore you would need to notify the local FSDO and do some phase I testing again.

Kent