[RV10Rob]

Just a heads up for those of you using the Parker Rolo-Flair tool to do your flares. As Ron pointed out in this post a few months ago, there can be sharp edges on the side away from the flare that cut into the tube when clamped down. Additionally, mine had a sharp edge on the flare side, which produced results like this:

I'd call these fairly significant cuts/gouges in the flare--I can catch my fingernail on them. Not sure whether I didn't notice or just ignored this on the flares I did earlier, but do yourself a favor and save the worry and/or additional work of replacement and keep an eye out. I filed down the sharp edge on the tool, and the problem went away. I'm curious how it got there in the first place.

-Rob

 

[asav8tor]

Dip the tubing end to be flared in STP oil treatment and a bit on the cone before flaring. Big difference in results.

 

[clevtool]

I have contacted Parker about their quality control when Ron Sterba pointed this out last spring. This is a serious problem with the stress marks in the tube. The units that we had on the shelf we have disassembled and polished with the 3M deburring wheel. This seems to solve the problem. I don't know if Parker has solved the problem on their end yet. The Parker tool is the best one that we have used for flaring. If someone has experience with a better tool please let us know.

 

[9GT]

Mine does it also and I solved the problem by not clamping down so hard.

 

[aturner]

Me too

My Parker Roto-flare gave me headaches too. I had to take it apart and clean up the dies with files and deburring wheel. It still seems like the 1/4 die is too small, but as long as you don't use too much clamping pressure it works OK.

 

[Phil]

Exact same issue with mine. I finally quit driving the male die so hard and that helped. Now I just crank down until I think I'm close to bottoming out - then I stop and take a look at it.

9 times out of 10 it's okay using that method but if I smash the two dies together it causes all kinds of problems.

On the lines that do have the marks, I've managed to polish them out. But the ones that have deep marks like your photo are too deep for my taste.

Can you show us a photo of how you filed the dies down? I'd love to do that too.

Phil

 

[RV10Rob]

Can you show us a photo of how you filed the dies down? I'd love to do that too.

Phil

I just cranked the mail die down directly into the female with nothing inserted, then a light rub with a scotchbrite pad. Flares now look good. Wish I'd done it before I made all my fuel lines. I wonder how many others out there are, like me, new to airplane building and don't know those bad flares are unacceptable.

-Rob

 

[douglassmt]

I

was taught to screw it down just until you start to get resistance, never had any trouble with it. As others said, try backing off the pressure. Of course, it could be a QC problem with a new lot. I'll be looking at mine again to make sure they're OK. Thanks for bringing this up.

 

[The Wizzard]

the lines

Would someone point out what lines your actually speaking about? Not the scratches?

 

[ron sterba]

Gentlemen.
Glad to see you are sharing these concerns. Yes I advised the FAA at the Arlington airshow( July 2010). I took my tool there and showed the FAA gentleman. I was told they would look into the problem. I showed the FAA man my concerns and he understood exactly what I was concerned about since he had a backround in gunsmithing. Now if someone remembers back in the early spring 2010 in ( Texas ) RV 10 having a fuel line problem where he shared a video of his flight (DEAD STICK) on a computer generated flight path in IMC to a "NEAREST" and safely lands VFR at a airport. He showed his broken fuel line. If I remember right it was with-in 1/2" to a inch of the flare where the fuel line BROKE! I have not found that video as of yet but I know it exists. It would be nice to find out WHY it broke where it did.

Ron in Oregon

 

[Walt]

I advised the FAA at the Arlington airshow( July 2010). I took my tool there and showed the FAA gentleman.

Don't understand what you plan to accomplish by getting the feds involved except perhaps showing them that "Homebuilders" are incapable of building an airplane because they have no quality control.

 

[L.Adamson]

Don't understand what you plan to accomplish by getting the feds involved except perhaps showing them that "Homebuilders" are incapable of building an airplane because they have no quality control.

That's what I'm wondering. I've used this same brand and type of tool for many years in the refrigeration business (45 degree). And my 37 degree Rolo Flair has been passed around several other builders besides myself. We've ended up with some pretty good flairs. If it's bad, then do it over.

L.Adamson --- RV6A

 

[lorne green]

Roto-flare

was taught to screw it down just until you start to get resistance, never had any trouble with it. As others said, try backing off the pressure. Of course, it could be a QC problem with a new lot. I'll be looking at mine again to make sure they're OK. Thanks for bringing this up.

I too was instructed using this method (crank down till you feal some resistance). Looking at the original poster's picture,
it's hard not to imagine the rolo-flare being cranked down to the point where it's leaving witness marks on the back side of the flare.
I've not had this problem on my four year old Roto-flare tool. Not to say there could't be a problem with this recent (1-2 year) batch of tools.
Regards.

 

[RV10Rob]

Looking at the original poster's picture,
it's hard not to imagine the roto-flare being cranked down to the point where it's leaving witness marks on the back side of the flare.
Regards.

I'm also cranking it down only until I feel resistance. The one pictured looks worse than most, so I might've gone a little too far on that one, but they *all* have gouges to some degree in that position. I can't get a picture of the tool now, since I fixed it, but there was definitely a sharp edge on the "female" side. Interestingly, I saw this only on the 3/8" position, and all my 1/4" flares are spotless.

FWIW, mine is probably about 4 years old.

-Rob

 

[Captain Avgas]

Better alternative

Just a heads up for those of you using the Parker Rolo-Flair tool to do your flares. As Ron pointed out in this post a few months ago, there can be sharp edges on the side away from the flare that cut into the tube when clamped down. Additionally, mine had a sharp edge on the flare side, which produced results like this:


-Rob

Rob, Parker produce two flaring tools with a similar name but completely different design. The one you are using is the Rolo-Flair flaring tool. But there is also the Rol-Air flaring tool. I used to use the former (as do most RV builders) but flogged it off and bought the latter which will not produce the deformations that you describe.

The Rol-Air can be a fraction more expensive but having used both tools I have no doubt that it produces a far superior flare (and as a bonus it can be used in much tighter spaces to flare tubing insitu on the aircraft).

Take a look here: http://www.newmantools.com/imperial/ft5.html This is the tool that I see most aircraft mechanics use.

 

[PCHunt]

Yikes!

..... Yes I advised the FAA at the Arlington airshow( July 2010). I took my tool there and showed the FAA gentleman. .........

I am trying to think of a reason to go to the FAA. Not coming up with any answers.

I might have sent a note to the manufacturer of the tool inviting their attention to the potential problem, and waited for their reaction before involving the FAA.

I'm just sayin'. YMMV.

 

[koda2]

Imperial

Just another data point.

I bought an Imperial flaring tool from Brown Tool. It did not look like the one pictured in the previous post. It is the worst flaring tool I have ever seen. It cut holding marks in the side of the tubing and ballooned the end of the tube just before the flair. It was also missing some kind of detent on the screw that kept the whole assembly engaged while making the flair.
Even after polishing the dies and fixing the screw on my lathe it still produced unacceptable results. So I bought a Rolo Flair from Avery. World of difference.
Dave A.
6A build

 

[gasman]

Just a heads up for those of you using the Parker Rolo-Flair tool to do your flares. As Ron pointed out in this post a few months ago, there can be sharp edges on the side away from the flare that cut into the tube when clamped down. Additionally, mine had a sharp edge on the flare side, which produced results like this:

-Rob

I just checked the gap in the lower die with 3/8 tube installed. It was less that .015". In the above picture, the gap I am talking about is what created the blister that you see on the side of the flair in line with the tube. Also, the marks that wrap around the tube also indicates that the die IS UNDERSIZED.

The blister happened because the dies are too small and the male die was driven into the lower die with excessive force.


1. Parker needs to replace the defective parts.

2. Read and understand the instructions on how this tool works.

When done properly, This is a quality tool and you will like the results

 

[rzbill]

Mine has done this too

My flares, both 1/4 and 3/8 have this deformation to some degree. This is with an Parker ROLO-FLARE part # 212FB manufactured 1/16/07.

I will not rule out my own workmanship/methods. I do want to make a point. It is certainly possible to over flare. I did it it and recognized it early on (or thought I did) when practicing with the tool. I thought that I had "recalibrated" myself to making decent flares and the jaw marks were a fact of life. On the assumption that there is nothing wrong with the Parker tool and it is my methods, I become concerned about the ability to make consistent flares. I had been using what I thought was the minimum pressure to create a repeatable flare geometry. (first indication of any detectable torque rise)

So, I guess I will practice on some tubing scrap soon, just to see if I can make a flare with zero jaw marks.

At least I'm not flyin' yet and it will only take a couple of sessions to check/replace.

 

[Caummisar]

Learning Opportunity

Win, lose or draw,,,,,,no matter which tool you buy and how you use it....to good results or bad,,,,these posts are GREAT lessons learned for new and old builders. Bottom line, closely inspect the results you get from any tool. Keep 'me coming, folks.