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rapid_ascent

Well Known Member
Hi Folks,

So I've been working on my practice kits with some success, getting ready to take the plunge before too long I hope. I had a couple of problems, not major, but I was hoping someone could point me in the right direction.
I was trying to setup my rivet gun that I purchased on Ebay. It's supposed to be an Avery gun so I think it is a quality gun, and as far as I can tell it is. I wasn't sure what pressure to set my compressor to so I saw a video that Cleaveland Tool had that said to set it a 90 PSI. When I did that it seems to really smash the rivets. I do have a regulator on the gun, but I couldn't seem to get that to work very well with such a high pressure. When I reduced my compressor down to 50-60 PSI my gun seemed to work OK. I saw a thread that even had lower pressures. Not sure if the regulator on my gun is just not working. It seemed very sensitive when had 90 PSI from the compressor and I couldn't get good results. I also found that my drill wanted higher PSI so it was a pain leaving the compressor set at the lower PSI. I was eventually able to drive rivets sucessfully, but I may need some help here. Any ideas on the correct way to do this would be helpful.

The second problem I had was with my flush set. I had a standard flush set and I decided since I was a beginner that I should buy one of the swivel type with the rubber cup. I was able to use the basic flush set without any problems, but I was never able to get the other set to work right. It seemed like it wasn't contacting the rivet. Like maybe the rubber cup was preventing the set from hitting the rivet correctly. I thought I remember something about sanding these flush but I'm not sure. Any hints on using these I couldn't get it to work.
 
PSI depends on your gun (2x, 3x,4x) and the size/length rivet you are seting

for AD3 rivets, I use around 30psi, for AD4- 60-80psi depending on length, someone around here had a chart for this sort of thing
 
FWIW (I'm only at the same stage as you) I ditched the little "restrictor" regulator stuck on my gun, and used a very small but "real" regulator so I could actually see the pressure on a dial and it would be regulated on the first hit. (I mounted it with an air connector on either end, so I can just drop it in-line anywhere...as I don't have my "real" building shop setup yet.)
 
My 2 cents

You'll get or find lots of advice in this area, but nothing beat practice.
  • Make sure you don't use too much pressure
  • Hold the gun straight and don't let it wonder
  • I like blue masking tape on my rubber jacketed flush set and my univeral rivet set - replace at the first hint of tearing on the flush
  • Use two people until you are comfortable going solo
  • I like the tungsten bar, but lots of planes were built nicer than mine prior to these 'magic' bars
  • See first bullet point
 
Tech Counselor

Now is the perfect time to go on line and find and EAA technical counselor to come out to your place and show you all the little tricks of the trade. Another builder is also a great source of info. Get your technique down before you start on the kit as mistakes there are more $$$$.

Gary Specketer
Tech Counselor/Flight Advisor
 
I run my compressor unregulated (125 or so psi) and have a full-pressure line available to run the squeezer and air drill - but I also have a small regulator (a REAL regulator, not a restrictor calling itself a regulator) that is adjustable to plug in between the full-pressure line and my rivet gun. I get good results on the 2X at 35-40psi, and on the 3x at about 65psi.

You'll find that you need full pressure for the squeezer and drill, so keep that option available. It's a pain always having to stop and adjust the regulator for full/partial pressure, that's why I used the regulator on the full-pressure hose. You will go back and forth between rivet gun and squeezer/drill much more often than between 2X and 3X guns, so it made more sense to save the time by having a regulator on a quick-attach fitting.
 
rapid_ascent said:
I thought I remember something about sanding these flush but I'm not sure. Any hints on using these I couldn't get it to work.
Click to expand...

I sanded the red rubber guard on mine and it now works great. It didn't contact the rivet because of the height of the guard when I first got it. I chucked mine in a drill press and taped the middle tightly to prevent it from spinning. I then pressed it down onto sandpaper progressing all the way to white polishing compound just because it looked nice with a mirror shine on the face of the set. Probably overkill but only took about 10 minutes total.

I have my compressor set at 100psi but then have a little regulator on my rivet gun that I adjust for the job. The regulator doesn't have a pressure reading; I just increase or decrease the pressure and test it against my work bench until it feels about right. More for -4's and less for -3's. Practice until an approximate 1 second "burp" from the gun sets the rivet correctly.
 
The little regulator with a gauge sounds like a good idea. I think I'll need to work on my air hose configuration a little too. I didn't like all the unplugging when I need to drill out a rivet. Hopefully that will start happening less, but who knows.
 
It seemed like I need to do some sanding on my rubber gaurd. It seemed like it wasn't making contact correctly. The drillpress sounds like a good idea for sanding down the rubber guard. I started doing it by hand and I wasn't getting too far. Did you tape the face of the flush set to prevent it from getting sratched or where you saying you just polished back up after you got the guard flush?
 
Rapid Ascent - I use 40 psi for AD3 and 60-65 psi for AD4's. I built a manifold for the compressor out of brass pipe that splits into 2 lines, 2 regulators and water traps - one is set at 125 psi for the drill, die grinder, etc, and the other regulator set lower for the rivet gun. As the compressor is in a large insulated box for sound control, I mounted the regulators on the outside for easy access. Also bought two cheapy harbor freight air hose reels - absolutely love them for winding everything out of the way, and they never have leaked.
On the rubber surrounded flush set, never had issues. The rubber will not keep the head from contacting - it will strike the rivet. It is useful to prevent skidding somewhat if your grip force is not perfectly axial to the set when riveting and your other hand is holding the bucking bar.
 
Regulator

Consider the regulator on the gun as repetition rate controller, not a pressure regulator. Regulate the pressure at the compressor.
 
A 3x gun is on the large side for -3 and -4 rivets which are the majority for RVs. I use a 1x and 2x gun with the latter more than adequate. However one obvious thing to check is that it really is rivet gun and not an air chisel (no insult intended, it does happen). A rivet gun will have a "teasing" trigger that you should be able to control the gun from very light taps to full power. My rivet guns (Atlas Copco) also have a built in regulator in the trigger which allows you to limit the maximum power. Without this feature, as others have stated, you will need to use an external regulator to limit the maximum power. Get used to the feel of the rivet gun at various pressures by holding the rivet set against a piece of wood and giving it a 1-2 second burst. Then practice riveting with some scrap aluminum. No matter what gun you have, good riveting is a matter of practice. The hardest thing I found was keeping the rivet set (especially flat sets) square to the surface so the gun didn't tend to walk away from the rivet and damage the skin. Limiting the maximum power was one key, practice was the other.
 
Thanks for all help.

I'm going to get one of the little pressure regulators and practice some more. I actually felt like I was doing ok with the pressure turned down, but it wasn't automatic or anything.
 
This is the little one I use, as secondary to the tank regulator I leave set high. (Note I actually keep it attached to the other end of the hose...just attached there directly to show its size.) It was the cheapest sold at either Home Depot or Lowes, including the male/female ends..

reg.jpg
 
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Rick,
Your set-up obviously works, but an alternative way that would be a little less cumbersome is to hard mount the regulator somewhere convenient (mine's on the front of one of my workbenches) and run hose from that to the gun. I have a swivel regulator that I attach the tools to. I run the compressor's regulator at about 110psi and adjust the bench mounted regulator to whatever the tool needs. The swivel is left wide open all of the time and is just there to keep the hose at a comfortable angle to the tool. I don't go back and forth between air tools of different operating pressures often enough to worry about adjusting air right at the tool. Just food for thought....
 
Bruce:

Thanks a lot for your posting of the rivet pressure cheat sheet from Brad. Do you know what rivet gun these pressures are for? 2x, 3x etc.? Thanks.
 
Keith,
I use those pressures listed by Brad on my 3X gun (I got them way back when from Dan Checkoway via his now defunct builders site).
 
Auburntsts said:
Rick,
Your set-up obviously works, but an alternative way that would be a little less cumbersome is to hard mount the regulator somewhere convenient (mine's on the front of one of my workbenches) and run hose from that to the gun.
Click to expand...

Right -- I don't actually use it like that, I keep the regulator on the other end of the hose. Just showing the size. :)

(And, thank you. :))
 
Rick,

I think I'll get one of those and give it a shot. I have no doubt this will take care of my problem.

Thanks,

Ray
 
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