[glenn654]

I bought a -4 about 95% complete so I was not given a repairmans' certificate by the DAR. I have done a fair amount of maintaince since...biggest project currently rebuilding panel for upgrade. Is it possible for me to get a Repairmans' Certificate after signoff? And how would I go about getting it?

Glenn
N654RV @ OKZ

 

[kentb]

Sorry Glenn,

Can't be done after the plane is signed off.

You can do all the maintaince and repairs to your plane yourself.

The only thing that you can't do is the conditional inspection (it is like the annual). This can be done by an AP or AI.

Kent

 

[dmaib]

It is my understanding that you should have been able to get the repairmans certificate when buying an incomplete project and then finishing it. Am I wrong about that?

 

[n468ac]

You must build and prove you built 51% of the airplane to get the repairmans certificate.

 

[Mel]

The only way to get the repairman's certificate without building 51% is; if a group of people build the aircraft, then the "most qualified" person in the group is selected.
Kent is correct. You can do all the maintenance and repairs. Just not the condition inspection.

 

[John Clark]

Third party

Since you get to do all the work of the inspection, disassembly, cleaning, lubrication, and reassembly the A&P's time is kept to a minimum. Besides, I really like the idea of a new set of eyes looking things over.

John Clark
RV8 N18U
Ksba

 

[David-aviator]

I bought a -4 about 95% complete so I was not given a repairmans' certificate by the DAR. I have done a fair amount of maintaince since...biggest project currently rebuilding panel for upgrade. Is it possible for me to get a Repairmans' Certificate after signoff? And how would I go about getting it?

Glenn
N654RV @ OKZ

Glen, in this district a DAR can not issue the repairman certificate, it has to be approved by a FAA inspector.

The only chance you have of getting the authorization is to go directly to your FISDO with as much documentation as you can pull together to show what you've done and what you can do. Put together the best presentation you can and go for it. The fact that you pulled all the pieces together and completed the airplane will go a long way toward making a case. Re think that 95% figure, its very subjective. It won't hurt to ask.

The repairman certificate can not be applied for until after the airplane is signed off, so that is not an issue.

(How do I know all this stuff? I've jumped through the hoops 3 times and have 3 certificates.)

 

[Mel]

David is right. DARs cannot issue the repairman's certificate. It must be an FAA Inspector. They considered letting DARs do it several years but it got shot down by the "Big Guys" in D.C. Technically you do not qualify for the certificate, but like David says, It surely doesn't hurt to try. Gather up all the data and pictures you can and go for it. If you are close with any mechanics, try to get them to write a letter of recommendation. Go in with a positive attitude. Attitude goes a long way with the feds.

 

[glenn654]

repairmans' certificate

Thanks Guys for the info...Since the only thing I am barred from doing is the annual I don't thing I will worry about it. But may make an attempt to get one in the future.

Glenn

 

[kentb]

When is the future?

Thanks Guys for the info...Since the only thing I am barred from doing is the annual I don't thing I will worry about it. But may make an attempt to get one in the future.

Glenn

I don't think that there is anyway to have a repairman certificate issued for a plane after is has been signed off.

I was lucky in that my FAA inspector also belonged to EAA and was an EAA advisor. I had three EAA advisor inspection while I was building and a couple of visits from the chapter builder group. My FAA guy saw my plane while I was building it.

When it came time to get the inspection, I ask what was required as to builder log and getting the repairman certificate. He told me that he was not interested in seeing a builders log. I understood from him that who did how much work on the plane was not an issue, but that he would only sign-off on the repairman certificate if he felt that I understood the airplane systems and construction enough to preform the conditional inspection.
I was told that even if someone had built their plane 100%, that the repairman certificate still might not be issued if he felt that the person would not be able to correctly preform the inspection.

Granted my guy knew me and the RV (even QB) passes the 51% rule.

If you want to have the repairman certificate (now or in the future), contact the local FSDO and talk to someone about it now.

Kent

 

[Kahuna]

I got my last one 1 year after the airworthiness. It can ba done anytime.

 

[David-aviator]

I don't think that there is anyway to have a repairman certificate issued for a plane after is has been signed off.

I was lucky in that my FAA inspector also belonged to EAA and was an EAA advisor. I had three EAA advisor inspection while I was building and a couple of visits from the chapter builder group. My FAA guy saw my plane while I was building it.

When it came time to get the inspection, I ask what was required as to builder log and getting the repairman certificate. He told me that he was not interested in seeing a builders log. I understood from him that who did how much work on the plane was not an issue, but that he would only sign-off on the repairman certificate if he felt that I understood the airplane systems and construction enough to preform the conditional inspection.
I was told that even if someone had built their plane 100%, that the repairman certificate still might not be issued if he felt that the person would not be able to correctly preform the inspection.

Granted my guy knew me and the RV (even QB) passes the 51% rule.

If you want to have the repairman certificate (now or in the future), contact the local FSDO and talk to someone about it now.

Kent

Kent, obviously your situation is special, you knew the FAA inspector as an EAA advisor. But your conclusions based on that relationship are not the norm or accurate.

In this district, you can't get an FAA inspector to look at an airplane - they are too busy with higher priority projects. That's why we have DAR's. But the builder has to go back to the FISDO guys to get the repairman certificate, there is no other way to do it.

(You also have to go back for concurrence with a major change that moves the airplane back into phase one testing. I've done that with a proposal letter which they approved promptly, it is no big deal. DAR's can not approve major changes, at least not here)

On my last application for a repairman certificate, the builder log, pictures, certificate of air worthiness, registration certificate, operating limitations, pilot license, medical certificate, and everything else I could think of to bring was looked at by the woman inspector. She never saw the airplane and did not want to see it. That was the function of the DAR. I had to convince her I built 51% of the airplane, that I was who I claimed to be, and that the paper work was in order.

A basic premise of the regulation concerning this matter is if one is smart enough to build an airplane, get it certified, and fly it, she/he is smart enough to do the annual condition inspection. Beyond that, its all about proper documentation and a friendly, courteous, attitude presenting it.

 

[Mel]

David,
You are correct on every count except one. A DAR CAN approve a major change by doing a recurrent airworthiness inspection. The downside is that this involves the same inspection and cost as the initial inspection, whereas the FAA can do it without looking at the aircraft. The operating limitations allow YOU to do the mod and place the aircraft back into phase I yourself. The FAA only has to approve your test area. For a DAR to do it, he must reinspect the aircraft and issue a new airworthiness certificate. This is assuming that you have operating limitations that allow you to do this. This option was introduced into the operating limitations somewhere around 2000. If your operating limitations don't contain this option, your only recourse is a recurrent airworthiness inspection.

 

[$ Bill]

Repairman Certificate

$ Bill would like to find out the following.

If I purchased a RV7A from the builder can I obtain a repairman certificate to do the anual condition inspection ?

Where can I obtain the 16 hr. course to get the certificate ?

Please respond

 

[BillC]

I'm not an expert so perhaps someone that is will step in here but, as far as I understand the repairman cert. It can only given to the original builder and cannot be transfered. As for the 16 hour course I have never heard of such a thing.

Good luck

 

[n5lp]

$ Bill would like to find out the following.

If I purchased a RV7A from the builder can I obtain a repairman certificate to do the anual condition inspection ?

No.

Where can I obtain the 16 hr. course to get the certificate ?

Not applicable.

 

[N908RV]

Nope

Only the builder of your prospective specific RV-7A can perform the annual if he or she has the Repairman's Certificate. Nobody else but the builder qualifies as a Repairman. Those 16 hour classes you are referring to have relevance to certain aspects of the light sport market. My friend just took the class. Won't work for an RV - at least not until perhaps the 12 and that probably also depends on how it is certificated.

Otherwise only the builder of that specific experimental aircraft, or an A&P or an A&P-IA can perform the annual condition inspection.

If you purchase this plane, you may do all of the maintenance, so long as you do not make a major modification to the aircraft (i.e. change to larger engine or different prop, etc.) and you can even sign off your own work as the owner.

However here comes the big "but"....

Once you do your work, it needs to be signed off at the annual inspection by an A&P (doesn't need to be an IA for experimentals because this is not a true Annual Inspection, rather it is a Condition Inspection. Your aircraft will not technically be airworthy to fed standards, rather it will be in a "condition for safe operation.")

So in summary, if you want to do your own work, yes, you can, but be sure you know a good A&P that will be willing to do the annual condition inspection and during that inspection will be willing to declare your previous work as "in a condition for safe operation."

Good luck with your RV purchase, it is doubtful you will be disappointed...

Rob