rocketbob

rocketbob

Well Known Member
One thing I never liked about my RV was that the dual muff setup I have was good to only about 20 deg. F OAT.

To help with heat I've sealed up the cockpit on my Rocket very well to prevent air intrusions.

One thing I would like to do is make the intake air to the one heat muff I have take in cabin air instead of from the back of the baffle. To do this, I will have to have some kind of blower of adequate capacity.

Has anyone done this who might be able to point me to a lightweight and effective 12V blower?
 
My Porsche 914 has a blower that is pretty close to what you are asking about. It uses two outlets that are very close to the size of the SCAT tubing we use in the aircraft.

No, you cant have mine.

Probably find them cheap at a wrecking yard.

Older VW aircooled bus should have a similar unit. Probably cost less with a VW label, than a Porsche label.

images
 
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Toobuilder said:
Have you considered/tried electric clothing? Works well and only requires a power outlet.
Click to expand...

I have...that would work ok on local flights in the winter months but the problem is when I'm somewhere warm, fly five hours back home again into the cold, its just something else that I would have to carry with me half way across the country.

TX7A said:
puts out such a good blast of air, that I have considered using it as a boost fan for fresh air through the NACA vent.
See post #15 in this thread. http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?t=53269&page=2

(edit: well, now it occurs to me that this wouldn't be a good selection since you're dealing with heated air.)
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I am intentending to connect the fan to the inlet side of the muff so the fan itself won't get hot. The end plates of my heat muff are welded onto the exhaust pipe, so the system should seal well since it will be pressurized.
 
Great idea, Bob. Why didn't I think of that? Duh.

Like you said, below about 20-25* OAT it's like sitting in a refrigerator. After awhile, I get chilled to the bone, regardless of layering. It would be much cheaper to find a 12v fan, run the intake SCAT tubing to the muff and just recirculate the air than to add another muff in series. There's enough ambient leakage in my plane that fogging won't likely be a problem. Make sure you post what you find and how it works.

Dang ... why didn't I think of that? :rolleyes:
 
Volkswagen Blower

JC Whitney Aircraft Supply carries these for just under 2 airplane dollars ($185). Look for "ACC CLIMATE CONTROL 12 VOLT HEATER BLOWER KIT VW".
 
Marine supplies

Considering the hostile environment how about a Bilge blower. These things can move a lot of air and are made for a hot engine compartment.
Most of them are squirrel cages made for scat tubes in the boat hull
 
Pooooner,
You can also pull pre-warmed air off the plate under cyl 3&4 to supply your muff insteade of off the rear baffle. I picked up another 30 degrees of allowable temperature from doing this. Im good to -10F before I need more clothing.
More pics here.
s8engine%20008_small.jpg
 
rocketbob said:
I have...that would work ok on local flights in the winter months but the problem is when I'm somewhere warm, fly five hours back home again into the cold, its just something else that I would have to carry with me half way across the country...
Click to expand...

Well, that sounds just like my mission requirement. Start out hot (on the ground in Phoenix), get cold (cruise at altitude). I'm going with a light sleeveless vest and heated insoles in my shoes - not a snowmobile suit.
With the power off, you hardly notice them in the heat on the ground, but they really keep your core and feet warm up high.

This stuff works so well that I have removed all the exhaust muffs, ducting and valves from the airplane and sealed the holes in the firewall.
 
Heated Seats

Toobuilder said:
Well, that sounds just like my mission requirement. Start out hot (on the ground in Phoenix), get cold (cruise at altitude). I'm going with a light sleeveless vest and heated insoles in my shoes - not a snowmobile suit.
With the power off, you hardly notice them in the heat on the ground, but they really keep your core and feet warm up high.

This stuff works so well that I have removed all the exhaust muffs, ducting and valves from the airplane and sealed the holes in the firewall.
Click to expand...

Heated seats work nicely too!.
 
I second the bilge blower. Either the Rule 240 or the Rule 140 inline blowers should work nicely. You could mount them in the cabin to blow air to the heat muff then have a return hose coming back into the cabin.
 
Kahuna said:
Pooooner,
You can also pull pre-warmed air off the plate under cyl 3&4 to supply your muff insteade of off the rear baffle. I picked up another 30 degrees of allowable temperature from doing this. Im good to -10F before I need more clothing.
Click to expand...

I did something similar on my -6 and yes it did help...problem here is the cockpit is well sealed and won't be leaking much air, so I expect the flow from the heat muff to be minimal if fresh air is taken from the back side of the plenum. I have sealed off the aft bulkhead just fwd of the tail and put a boot in over the elevator pushrod, in addition to sealing any gaps I can find. In my -6 it helped a bunch to plug up the holes in the baggage bulkhead to keep high pressure air from entering the cockpit. So it is possible my fresh air vents might not work well either unless I have some sort of outflow valve. We'll see...

Just ordered a bilge pump to play with...it was only $26.
 
Bob
I would not spend a lot of time fussing with this. I believe that you will find the rocket warmer then your RV6. I do not fly in jan, feb or march due to runway conditions, but the rest of the year I operate without any heat muff or cabin heat. The sealing that you have done with the cockpit should help a lot. I do believe that you will need a dedicated fresh air outlet otherwise air coming in will either be restricted or force itself out around your canopy skirts etc.
 
Have you insulated your sidewalls? On my -7A with the standard single heat muff setup, I've been reasonably comfortable traversing Pennsylvania at 6500' when it's -20F OAT and cabin heat is wide open. However, I do fly with a winter coat on, but not zipped up.

I used the 1/2" black sound insulation from ACS and installed it along the sidewalls to just aft of the cabin seating area. 3/4" was used on the forward cabin floor, but none under the seats. I also wedged 3/4" into place on the aft side of the firewall, but I'm rethinking that placement based on what others have said about firewall insulation. My feet were plenty comfortable with this setup.

Mike
 
My -6 had insulated sidewalls. It made a big difference as far as noise dampening went, and I'm sure it helped in cold weather.
 
I dunno' Bob

Bob,

I've built/owned at least 22 RV's and Rockets and have (like you) flown many more. Most of the RV's only pick up heat with one or two muffs from one or two pipes each. I consider those plane to be 'good' to about 20 to 25 degrees.....that's with no coat or gloves as I don't like to wear them when I fly....I just take them with me. I put 1 heat muff on each Rocket tail pipe and ran them in series to 1 inlet. Each muff picked up 3 cylinders on each side. I can tell you first hand that I had more heat than I could stand on the coldest of days with no complaints from the rear seat px. On days where I dreaded flying an RV due to the cold I couldn't wait to get into the Rocket so I could warm up. My opinion for the Rocket is to not waste any effort on blowers and vents and hoses and tubes etc.

Good Luck.
 
Cockpit heat?

Just a little something to add the mix. If the exit air is reduced are you not reducing the flow of either hot or cold air through the cockpit?
Has anyone experimented with an "efficient," controlled, positive flow of air? Such that the volume of hot air flowing from the firewall to the rear cockpit bulkhead is increased!
 
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