A

aelkins

Active Member
Greetings;
My son recently graduated high school.
He has expressed an interest in getting his A&P certificate.
My first thought was joining the military (A/F) however, he does not desire to mak that commitment. (several of his upper classmates joined only to find that the initial career path was 'altered' for numerous reasons)
I checked into a few FAA certified schools that range from 14 - 24 months to complete the required 2180 hours for A&P certification. These schools ranged from $25K - $40K. (the most logical one being about an hour from home here)
http://www.naiasc.com/maintenance.html
That school is $15K (plus $7K housing & 2K in tools).. 14 months completion schedule (8 hour day classes)

I also wanted to see if there was any local A&Ps that may consider an 'apprentice' program. Just as an option in the event the school(s) do not work out. I tried to search the FAA database to get a list of people holding current A&P certificates. I had no luck. The only thing I found was the database of 'Repair Stations'.
I am assuming that a person can hold a current A&P without having a full-time position at a repair station?..

My son's mindset is this.. he wants to earn his A&P certificate while he has no other life commitments to hinder it. (marriage, job, etc) After that, he can decide if he wants to venture into a life career in aviation or, follow a different career path and use the A&P certificate to perform Annuals, repairs, etc locally. (on an as-needed demand basis). My hunch is that their is not enough local aviation business to support him totally but, having the A&P (possibly I/A too) could open several opportunities to supplement his income.
(Actually, I'd love to have that option if I had 14 months of non-commitmental time)

Personally, I'll finance his educational costs... although, I can see my future RV purchase shrinking from a total glass award winning plane... to a more affordable 'rough' model.. But, we do what is neccessary for our children to follow their dreams, right?
Any pros or cons to the above that you guys wish to offer us?
Any advice is welcome..
 
Kudos to BOTH of you - him for being smart enough to realize that THIS is time in his life to do something like this, and you for supporting him in it, emotionally and financially. I only wish I had that option still open to me.
 
What to do

1. Ask around and find a reputable shop that does a variety of aircraft. 2.Have him work for free if need be for a little bit untill they can pay him. If he has a good head on his shoulders everyone will see that he wants to learn and will teach him how things are really done
3. After about 3 yrs he will be eligible for the test... Get the prep material and send him to Bakers in TN (they do the 2 week prep school and the written and send him to a local guy for the oral and practical.
4. Have him work on his private ticket as well at the same time... Your chances of being a great mechanic go way up when you can fly the airplane as well...
5. You can go to an A&P "School" but to do it right.... like the electrical workers... (sure you can read a book but you dont just go out and work on high voltage lines as a new guy...) be an apprentice... and work your way up... trust me... I see people going to the A&P 18 month schools... and they get ripped off big time... and they dont have a ton of real experience.

Call me with any questions anytime
Brian Wallis
A&P/IA
404-405-1315
 
brianwallis said:
5. You can go to an A&P "School" but to do it right.... like the electrical workers... (sure you can read a book but you dont just go out and work on high voltage lines as a new guy...) be an apprentice... and work your way up... trust me... I see people going to the A&P 18 month schools... and they get ripped off big time... and they dont have a ton of real experience.

Call me with any questions anytime
Brian Wallis
A&P/IA
404-405-1315
Click to expand...


Your right if he wants to be an airplane mechanic. However, there are many more oppertunities for A&P's besides being a mechanic.
I see lots of postings by aircraft manufacturers (Boeing, Eclipse, Gulfstream....) requiring an A&P cert.. Some of these positions will require you to travel and perform field checks and repairs but most are for "paperwork" type postions that require knowledge of the FAR's.

It can also be a step to getting an engineering degree. Not sure but don't you get an AAS degree at these schools?


Let me just say; I wish I had any kind of A&P ticket right now. There is a fairly high demand and with high demand comes good pay.
 
Career vs. Job

If your son wants a job working on aircraft then a tech school is possibly the right path. There are various technical colleges and community colleges that have an A&P program for far less than the "Pay Schools".

http://www.tccd.edu/neutral/divisiondepartmentpage.asp?pagekey=36&menu=2

http://www.waco.tstc.edu/aer/index.php

There may be some in your state. I just heard about a fresh A&P being offered $12/hr to start with American Eagle in Dallas. That is **** after a person spends $14K-$20k for an A&P school. I guess you get what you pay for with degree programs running three to five times that amount.

If your son wants a career in aviation maintenance then look to a school with a degree program.

http://www.erau.edu/db/degrees/b-aerosystemsmaint.html

http://www.roswell.enmu.edu/degree_plans.php

There are distance learning (on-line) courses for the degree work which might be able to couple to an apprentice program somewhere.

Just like any other industry, a degree is the key to the advancement club and to a salery that can actually support an enjoyable life.

Good Luck,
JackT
 
Sounds good..

Thanks for the feedback so far.. all sound advice..

Let me just add... we checked into surrounding community colleges.
None offered A&P certification programs.
Some offered pilot programs, and one offered aeronatical engineering.

To give a better description of his goal is;
He wants to earn his A&P certification before following any career path.
We have a private (public use) airstrip with a 50 x 100 hanger.
A nice setup to 'half' the hanger into a repair station. Just lengthened the strip to 2500' (with access to a regional airport less than 10 miles away)
Good location to perform annuals, overhauls, repairs 'IF' the business is successful. If not, after being certified, he can obtain another full/part-time job and perform part-time A&P work (as it becomes available)
And yes, he will have his private ticket by then too. Being certified to FLY what you FIX gives the plane owner a cushion of confidence in your work. (or at least, that's my perspective)
I will check with the regional airport to see if there are any current A&Ps there willing to 'take him under their wing'.. That is the most pocket-friendly method however, I am willing to finance it all if neccessary to get him setup (so to speak).. I guess he can repay me with the next 30 annuals on my future RV purchase.. :rolleyes:

Again, thanks for all the feedback.. you're experience and willingness to share is priceless.
 
A theme I see in your post is for your son to do annuals. It takes three years of having an A&P before you can get your IA. Having the A&P is great but having good training during the process is more important. Look for a place the offers a lot of practical/lab experience to go along with the book work. Look for schools that have donated aircraft. Getting on airframe experience is very valuable.
 
EAA

If you haven't already done so, check with your local EAA chapter, you might be able to get some scholarship assistance, plus there might be other info there that can help you and your son out.

Too bad you are not local, our chapter has already assisted one kid in getting his A/P.

Good luck.

Mike
 
I paid 2500 for my A&P including books and tests when I got it at the local community college. I highly recommend, all other things being equal, going with the cheapest program, since the FAA regulates what you have to learn...
 
Try Wayne Community College

I am an A&P here in NC and I graduated from Wayne Community College in Goldsboro. It was a good program in the late 80's when I was there, and alot less that what you quoted. I'm not sure what the price is now, but it is worth a look. This is a two year program, including summers.

Scott
 
clarification

CraigC said:
A theme I see in your post is for your son to do annuals. It takes three years of having an A&P before you can get your IA. Having the A&P is great but having good training during the process is more important. Look for a place the offers a lot of practical/lab experience to go along with the book work. Look for schools that have donated aircraft. Getting on airframe experience is very valuable.
Click to expand...


Lets clarify... An A&P can have a repair station... a repair station is authorized to do an annual... I WOULD NOT HAVE YOUR SON DOING ANNUALS in the first 3 yrs anyhow... you'd be surprised how steep the learing curve is... you may be authorized... but look up 65.81 for experience requirements... Have your son be an apprentice... a degree program is great but he needs to be an apprentice.... that's where he will learn the knowledge to save his life that he may not learn in a degree program...a piece of paper is just a piece of paper... it looks nice... it's got pretty writing on it.. but when your son misses something that he would of learned being an apprentice instead of the "degree program" and those people die in a firey crash.... the piece of paper is just that... and it will get taken away... and who knows how much he will be sued for... have him take a picture of everything he does... EVERY STEP... just like I do... there are some stupid people out there and you have to protect yourself. The BEST thing for him to do is actually to go to a degree program and be an apprentice at the same time.... however the world is not perfect.
Best
Brian Wallis
AP/IA
 
You could always send him down here to daytona beach to Embry Riddle. We offer a 18 month A&P program. Also there are many shops around here that will take an Assistant in a heartbeat. I am currently working at one right now and im not even in the A&P program, just know a little bit of knowledge from working on our clubs Piper Cubs and Pitts S2-B. It may be expensive but WELL WORTH IT. Take it from someone who is there now.
www.erau.edu
David
 
Slight hijack

I find this discussion very interesting because I've been considering getting an A&P when I decide to leave my corporate I/T job (next year :) ). I know that there are many community college based programs but you can't really find them with a google search.

I hadn't thought much of going the apprentice route but that a good idea. Any other comments about working as an apprentice would be appreciated. Are most shops willing to take on an apprentice?

The 2 links to the schools in TX were interesting. Any other A&P programs in central TX or Arizona?
 
Good State School in MO

University of Central MO (http://www.cmsu.edu/x36709.xml) offers a good A&P program as well as flight training and Aviation Safety, etc. Also have their own university airport (Skyhaven (9k4)).

Numerous other academic programs there if he decides to branch out and the school is much less expensive (even with out of state tuition, etc.) than many in-state programs.

Good luck!

Mike
 
A&P

There is no better time to get an A&P than right out of high school. I started A&P school at Pittsbutgh Institute of Aeronautics 2 weeks after graduating from highschool.Never had time to get lazy ! Had my A&P at 19 yrs old.Got my Private Pilots while I was still in HS. Planned to go into engineering and Pilot career, but was offered a job with Eastern Airlines right out of school. I have now been in the "maintenance" side for 27yrs with little regret.I obtained my IA a few years ago and do about a dozen or so annuals /yr. I live in Winston-Salem NC., and work as an Operations Manager for a large aircraft overhaul facility at Greensboro airport called TIMCO. Hondajet is also building their final assembly and test flight facility next to us. Atlantic Aero has a flight school on the field, and Guilford College has an A&P school that also offers some degree courses on the field. TIMCO has some apprentice courses that can get you to work without a liscence to build time, however, I suggest getting the ticket ASAP while young. Feel free to drop me a Private message if you want to know more about the area, and keep that young man going !

Bill E.
RV-4 paint prep
 
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