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RNB

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I'm considering buying a ready made RV10, then selling my 172. The current owner put forth someone he knows named Richard White at Lees Summit (maybe Missouri) to perform a qualified pre buy. Anyone know the guy?

How about Doug Peterson? Was/is he a good builder?

Can used Vans RVs be financed? I'd consider carrying a note until my 172 was sold.

RV10 235 HP variants with carburetors, any opinions? I'm told 160-165 its 12 GPH ROP 5000-10000.

What are the specific weak links in 10 builds to keep an eye out for?

THanks.
 
Up to you, but the conventional wisdom is to not use someone for the pre-buy who is associated with the owner, or has a history of working on the airplane--potential conflict of interest. No disrepect to the recommended individual--I don't know him.

No experience trying to finance an RV or knowledge of Mr. Peterson.

No experience with the carbureted/235HP -10 either, but that's about what I see at ~10.5GPH (9-11K' MSL) WOT, 2250 RPM, 10.5 GPH (LOP). Not sure about performance at 5K--I rarely if ever fly at that altitude on an X-C. Two reasons--cumulogranite in the west/southwest and my sense is that the -10 wing likes altitude.
 
Richard White in Lee's Summit has an excellent reputation. His son Matthew worked for him at R&D Aviation. Matthew did all the maintenance and inspections for the guy that I bought my RV-9A from at KALN, and I talked with him a lot during the pre-buy process and a few times after. He also was excellent. Last I heard, Matthew has his own shop MJ Aviation in Lee's Summit.
 
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The. Previous poster gave a real world example of the 260 HP injected engine running lean of peak (‘LOP’). Most carbureted engines won’t run smoothly LOP. The issue is that the standard 60 gal tanks are just a bit small. The carb’d plane has an endurance of 4 hours plus 1 hr reserve. I run mine LOP at 10 gal/hr to get 5 hrs (+1 reserve). Is that difference important to you? If you fly ifr and you need an alternate the range shrinks some more. Run the numbers for your typical trips, see if it matters to you. There are expensive options, of course, ranging from installing extended range fuel tanks (after market) to a whole new engine. When Vans first built the two prototype RV-10’s, one was a lower HP version, close to this plane. Their marketing department found that no one wanted it, so it was never a Vans option. Now, all this doesn’t mean that this is a bad plane. It does mean that the selling price should reflect that this is not the same airplane as the FI 260 HP version.
Things to look for? So many early buyers (who were nearly all not the builder) managed to takeoff with a door only latched at the front pin (and subsequently lost the door in flight) that I think the after market 3rd latch (rotating half wheel that latches to the door sill) should be considered mandatory. Otherwise, the plane has few vices. Check the empty weight and, especially, the CG. Heavy planes also tend to have aft cg’s; most 10’s are limited more by the cg than by the gross weight, if you put people and bags in the back.
Agree with the previous poster: Hire your own inspector. Nothing personal, but you want someone who works for you. Vic Syracuse (this forum) has a good reputation, but I don’t know how far he travels from Georgia.
Borrowing money? Always possible, but current interest rates are rather high.
Edit: I forgot, may be important. Call Jenny at Nationaire Insurance (they advertise on this web site) and get a free quote. If you have zero RV time and/or low high performance time be prepared for sticker shock. Of course if you finance the bank will require insurance.
 
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Richard’s name does not show up in the logs. The owner put him forward as qualified without paying for time and flights for Vic. I get the concern.

i might just stick with Vic idea.
 
MacCool said:
Richard White in Lee's Summit has an excellent reputation. His son Matthew worked for him at R&D Aviation. Matthew did all the maintenance and inspections for the guy that I bought my RV-9A from at KALN, and I talked with him a lot during the pre-buy process and a few times after. He also was excellent. Last I heard, Matthew has his own shop MJ Aviation in Lee's Summit.
Click to expand...
I have met Richard and Matt over a decade ago. Richard built a beautiful RV-8 a decade or more ago. I paid Matt at R&D Aviation to replace a failed Vacuum pump on my airplane more than a decade ago and he did the job quicker than I could with the same care I would have used. Matt and Richard were working on repairing a customer's RV that had a hard landing at the time I had the vacuum pump replaced. Richard also fabricated all the smoke canister brackets that were used on the 49-ship formation flight that took place 13 October 2013.

751902B3-376C-4154-8A27-84D8F9E645A5_1_102_o.jpeg
 
Richard and Matt are both highly qualified for inspections and RV maintenance. They both run reputable shops in Lees Summit. They are both upstanding individuals.
Ryan
 
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I have an RV 10 that I just finished Phase I. Amazing airplane! And far more of a thoroughbred than I had imagined.
After flying my -9A for almost 1,000 hrs, I thought it would be a simple step up….wrong! The 10 is so much more airplane in all respects.
If you are used to a 172, be sure to get serious transition training. It’s not just for the insurance co but to get you in touch with a whole new level of flying
 
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RNB said:
Richard’s name does not show up in the logs. The owner put him forward as qualified without paying for time and flights for Vic. I get the concern.

i might just stick with Vic idea.
Click to expand...
Cost notwithstanding, it's really hard to imagine that using Vic for anything RV-related wouldn't be be an excellent choice.
 
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I can't see a 235HP 10 doing 160kts but even if It could it won't perform as well overall as the injected 260HP versions which are the norm (eg near GW on a hot day). My personal opinion is fly it and see if you like it. All other things being equal the list price should reflect they went with a lower performance motor. IOW a comparable 10 with a 260HP IO-540 engine should command a higher price. I concur 100% that you do not want anyone associated with that plane to perform the pre-buy -- that's a recipe for disaster.
 
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I'm holding off further on this plane for several reasons.
And mucho gracias to the VAF member that had me call him last night to talk about lots of these concerns.
I remain looking for a 10.
 
Auburntsts said:
I can't see a 235HP 10 doing 160kts but even if It could it won't perform as well overall as the injected 260HP versions which are the norm (eg near GW on a hot day). My personal opinion is fly it and see if you like it. All other things being equal the list price should reflect they went with a lower performance motor. IOW a comparable 10 with a 260HP IO-540 engine should command a higher price. I concur 100% that you do not want anyone associated with that plane to perform the pre-buy -- that's a recipe for disaster.
Click to expand...

Auburntsts said:
I can't see a 235HP 10 doing 160kts
Click to expand...
It should. Remember in cruise speed only goes up proportional to the cube root of power. (10% more power = 3% more speed). But climb rate will definitely be down.
 
Lycoming 0 540 parallel valve:
235 hp is a derated 250 hp engine with lower compression.
260 hp, the 10 hp increase is obtained by increasing the r/m from 2575 to 2600.
The 250 version was most widely seen in the Piper Aztec and Comanche. Early versions of those airplanes had carbs, later fuel injection.
So if the price was right on a RV10 with 235 hp, change the pistons and adjust the prop governor to 2700 rpm and you now have 260 hp. If you want even more higher compression pistons are available. Note that some of the older engines are narrow deck which are more challenging to find parts for.
Barrett offers a modified version that is 317 hp.
 
Doug Peterson built a -6, an -8, and two RV-10’s. This airframe was his third, I own the last one. Doug built a good airplane! My plane has a 250 hp narrow deck O-540 out of an Aztec. The performance is VERY close to what folks here brag about, 160 knots on 21”/2300 and 10.5 gph at 8-10K’. I love to fly high and have been to FL190, DA was 22,800’. 25/25 at 6-8K’ it will exceed 170 knots. I have considered fuel injection but the ROI for the cost just doesn’t make sense for me. As to upgrading the HP, compression will add some but at the cost of fuel options. I have been told, the RPM increase requires different crankshaft counter weights.

How many of us run 2700 rpm other than takeoff, most of the time we are loafing along, a 235 hp might well cruise very close to us at a higher % of power. While it affects the value, I would not hesitate to fly with the lower hp engine.
 
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I’ve got a good friend selling a very nice 10 in the Memphis area. Triple Dynon screens, 260 hp, injected, yada yada. It’s on the sales site that started with outdoor buildings subjected to bad weather… since I can’t say it here.
 
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