C

cbrown747

Active Member
I am doing all my research, reading through all the rv-builders websites as well as talking over the phone etc.. I am looking to build the rv-9a.

My question is I heard one rv builder (rv-8a) paint his rv while he was putting it together. I am assuming he painted each part and then assembled it.

Does this make sense and if so, what are the pitfalls?
 
I've been thinking about doing that same thing.

Downside that I can see are:

1) any painted trim scheme will likely have to wait until the airplane is complete in order to align the masking for stripes, etc. If you painted the base color it might be sometime before you painted the stripes and most paints want to be applied within 24 hours or so. Having said that if you scotch bright scuffed the base coat in the striped area I would expect you would have no adhesion issues.

2) If you use a clear coat process you will have to clear coat it once assembled anyway and will have to prep for that that time.

3) If you end up buying paint at different times differences in lot color might be noticeable although I think this is unlikely.

4) Any trim tabs you have to add will need to be painted which will interfere with your "in process" paint job.

If you notice bizjets they get epoxy primed and then flown to a completion center where interior and final paint is applied so it can be done.
 
My business partner has built 3 RV's - 2 9A's and a -7, and he painted them all before final assembly and phase 1. All 3 were beautiful airplanes and there were no problems doing it this way. Good thing is, the pieces were painted in a good booth and it was a little cheaper. Plus he didn't have to take everything apart, and then re-assemble it like I did - twice.....
 
The one down side of painting first is that you will be taking the cowlings on and off a number of times during your phase 1 test period. This all leads to scratches.

Also, if you need to make any mods, there is a good chance you will damage your paint.

As for the clear coat, that adds weight. See if you can get a good single stage paint job.

BTW, now that my plane has been taken apart, I will probably paint it. The question is, paint it now why it is apart or assemble it, fly off my new phase 1, and then have it painted? Oh, that's what you asked. I'll probably take it some place and have it painted.
 
I wonder if the builder was priming, not painting as he went?

From my perspective, painting is a huge pain. Been there, done that. One of the issues is that it takes a lot of setup work to turn your shop into a good paint booth. I mean, the space has to be very clean to avoid debris in the paint. You may also want to use plastic film to protect your walls, floor, etc from overspray. Most folks add extra lights (sidelights, for instance) which would probably be in the way of other tasks when you're not painting. And then there are ventilation issues, where to put the cars issues, and a host of others...

The picture I'm trying to paint is that there is a lot of setup work involved before you shoot the first drop of finish paint. I think it would be a real time and effort drain to paint each individual component (or assembly) as you progressed through the project.

Instead, if you want to paint your plane, build it first, then paint all of the major sub-assemblies (wings, fuselage, empennage, etc) in one week (or weeks or months) long effort. You'll save a lot of time that way.
 
Painted before flight

I just finished painting most of my RV-9A before final assembly. Nothing else makes sense to me. Theparts are all there - why assemble them and then interrupt flying to take them all apart again, clean off all the fuel and oil, and paint.

The only thing I have left to paint are the cowl and the gear fairing and pants. I will be painting the cowl within a week or so. Painting all went well using a Harbor Freight one-car canvas garage for a paint booth and couple of large fans (Walmart, $25. apiece). Everyone has their own style, but this made sense to me. Only slowed me down about two weeks.

Neal Powell
RV-9A
Working on cowl and engine.
 
I'd definitely paint before flight, but not before most of the construction is complete. I painted mine with the wings & tail sections off the airplane.

Too many RV's go unpainted for years. There is a lot procrastination in RV land! You either have to have 6-9000 bucks in reserve for a "fly it there" paint job by someone else; or just get with the program and get it done! A RV is not complete until it's painted! It's quite a job, especially with multiple colors, but then you don't have to tear the plane apart, and not fly for months.

With today's high quality multiple part paints (though expensive); you get extreme toughness & elasticity that won't easily scratch when removing parts. Besides, you have to remove a lot of parts every year for the condition inspection. Over the course of two years, my fairings & cowl have been off numerous times with no scratches.

I've always maintained that un-painted RV's only look good to the builders. :D
The builder apparently has a paint scheme in mind, that somehow superimposes itself over their unfinished product. But to us, it's just more boring aluminum & half finished fiberglass... :eek: So yes, get it painted before flight!

L.Adamson --- RV6A
 
I decided to paint before first flight

I watched my neighbor take his Lancair apart and prep it for paint after flying in primer for a couple years as I was building. My feeling was I didn't want to take the plane out of service after waiting 3 years to build and fly it!
I didn't paint the cowl or wheelpants for a while (actually the wheelpants finally got white Krylon this spring after 2 1/2 years), but they come off easily.

I hate to take my plane down for maintenance (modifying plenums, etc) when I have a choice, and I'm glad I didn't need to stop flying for 2-4 months to have it painted.

On another note, I learned to paint while doing my plane. It's a decent 10 foot paint job, but I'm proud of the fact I did it myself. And, I saved a lot of $$. There is a lot of planning to setting up a paint scheme with unassembled parts. I tried to keep it simple.

Sebastian Trost
RV-7A flying 340 hours
Henderson, NV
 
I painted mine before final assembly. I am a lousy painter...no doubt about it. I can shoot orange peel until the cows come home... Every day was an adventure shooting in our sub-tropical climate. I even managed to get a lizard stuck in some curing paint...Jurassic Park painting just plain stinks!

The only good thing to say about doing it this way is that once I start flying, I won't have to stop flying to take her apart again. She is truly DONE as she sits :)
 
My 7A was painted as sub assemblies before final assembly with one exception. I painted the inside of all the fuselage panels, bits and pieces, before riveting the fuselage together. When we finished riveting the fuselage the interior was already painted and only needed minor touch up at the end. I also didn't prime any internal part that was alclad. Even with a heavy House of Kolor candy apple paint job my final weight was only 1057. The interior panels in the baggage area and floor panels were left unpainted. The airlines don't paint the food carts so why should we paint the areas that are going to get the highest wear? Bare aluminum looks appropriate in high wear areas.
 
Gotta do what works. Some can assemble the physical plant to paint, some can't. For example, you can't paint in an apartment, painting in the basement under your house is iffy, and your local airport may not allow painting in hangars. On the flip side, I know at least one very good amateur builder who has a full size professional paint booth.

If you intend to paint it yourself, it is far easier to do so during construction.
 
Paint that belly....

before you roll over the canoe. Sounds wierd, but it was the best trick I learned. Mount all of your antenna doublers and such and secure your lower cowl hinges to the firewall flange. Blast that belly, taped to the last skin seam outboard to the side skins. roll it over on to your padded sawhorses, or put it up on the gear. Saves the hardest part of the paint job, rolling around under the fuse to paint it. Just mask off the belly when you paint the rest of it. Use 3 rolls of 2 inch green tape.After final fitting of all the sub assemblys I painted and striped the fuse and the rest of the parts. Moved it to the airport, put it together, and taxi tested it 14 hours later. First flight 5 days later. Never looked back. Paint looks great. To me, it makes no sense to do it any other way. Only thing I painted afterwards was the rudder trim tab before I attached it for good. Funny, most folks find it hard to believe I painted it myself in my garage.
Regards,
Chris
 
Aw C'mon, Larry

L.Adamson said:
......Too many RV's go unpainted for years. There is a lot procrastination in RV land! ..... just get with the program and get it done! A RV is not complete until it's painted!.... I've always maintained that un-painted RV's only look good to the builders......
L.Adamson --- RV6A
Click to expand...
Gee Larry,

I guess we know where you are coming from. Look at it another way. It took you what....12 years....to get your 1996 vintage kit flying and at last report with total flight hours still measured in mere double digits, you have only been flying for several fun filled months of unbridled giddiness. That enthusiasm is perfectly natural, but try to keep all this in perspective. Fact is, measured by your own performance, a builder who takes 5 years to finally get flying could still wait an additional 6 years to get his RV painted and he would still have smartly beaten you by one full year. Try to be patient with others. If, as you have stated over and over again that unpainted RV's bother you so much, may I suggest you feel free to look the other way for the few seconds it will take that unpainted RV to blow right past you? :D
 
SebsRV7A said:
I watched my neighbor take his Lancair apart and prep it for paint after flying in primer for a couple years as I was building. My feeling was I didn't want to take the plane out of service after waiting 3 years to build and fly it!
I didn't paint the cowl or wheelpants for a while (actually the wheelpants finally got white Krylon this spring after 2 1/2 years), but they come off easily.

I hate to take my plane down for maintenance (modifying plenums, etc) when I have a choice, and I'm glad I didn't need to stop flying for 2-4 months to have it painted.
Click to expand...

Just to give some realistic numbers...

I flew my airplane to the paint shop like this....

2008-02-11.2169.jpeg


And picked it up three and a half weeks later looking like this....

2008-03-06.2193.jpeg


You will notice that my painter did the pinhole filling on my fiberglass in that time period too.

I did the disassembly and reassembly myself with a little help from one other guy each time. It took about 4 hours or so to get all of the control surfaces off, all of the wheel pants off, etc. It was about 5 hours to put it back together, triple check everything for flight and launch for home. It really wasn't that bad.
 
I am still undecided, but I'm thinking seriously about painting it myself before flying and the final assembly.

In an attempt to keep the airplane easier to paint, I believe I'll just spray paint the entire airplane white. (Exception might be the belly - oil, dirt, etc.)

Then I plan on using vinyl decals to add the flair to the scheme. This way I can change my mind 5 years down the road and completely change the look of the airplane without too much hassle. I can always keep it modern looking.

That's just what I'm thinking. But we've still got a long ways to go before we get there.

Phil
 
Rick6a said:
Gee Larry,

I guess we know where you are coming from. Look at it another way. It took you what....12 years....to get your 1996 vintage kit flying and at last report with total flight hours still measured in mere double digits, you have only been flying for several fun filled months of unbridled giddiness. That enthusiasm is perfectly natural, but try to keep all this in perspective. Fact is, measured by your own performance, a builder who takes 5 years to finally get flying could still wait an additional 6 years to get his RV painted and he would still have smartly beaten you by one full year. Try to be patient with others. If, as you have stated over and over again that unpainted RV's bother you so much, may I suggest you feel free to look the other way for the few seconds it will take that unpainted RV to blow right past you? :D
Click to expand...

Rick, don't tell me yours isn't painted either?? :D

12 years yes, but I just couldn't pull it out of the garage unpainted. I have standards you know! :)

As to flight hours, it's a hair less than a month to go...... before being a year.
As of yesterday, it's 95.3 hours on the hobbs.
As to RV blow by's, it just doesn't happen. Don't ask me why, but my RV seems to be fast compared to others, of the same type. Maybe that 180 with a C/S thinks it's pumping out 250HP! :D Still a bit slower than our local F1"s and Rockets, though.

First time out of the garage. Two years ago.



L.Adamson ---- RV6A
 
We seem to have some thread creep (Imagine that!) as the original question was to the advisability of "painting as you go" as opposed to painting it yourself or trading cash for letting a prop do it after it was flying.

I've been wondering about the trade-offs of "doing a piece or two" at a time over a longer period versus eating the elephant at the end.

I listed my thoughts but have not heard too many focused on the original question....
 
THANKYOU!!

Rick6a said:
To help explain a possible advantage of waiting to paint after the bird has flown a bit, refer to my picture on post #4 here:

http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?t=41690
Click to expand...

Yes,........ I actually incorporated that suggestion into the fairings.

Those, and the gear fairings where the only items I hadn't painted. Afterall, we don't use them to break in the engine on first flights anyway. :)

But, after seeing that exact post; I did indeed cut my fairings with the overlap as seen in the pictures; and the pants/fairings are now painted.

Someone told me that the unpainted pants were ugly, and it would fly faster painted! :D

IMO, it's very worthwhile to read all these threads during the construction process. Lot's of good ideas, that may be incorporated into the project.

L.Adamson --- RV6A
 
rbibb said:
I've been wondering about the trade-offs of "doing a piece or two" at a time over a longer period versus eating the elephant at the end.

I listed my thoughts but have not heard too many focused on the original question....
Click to expand...
To answer your question... Painting is all about set up time, prep time, and post-paint cleanup time. The more times you have to do this the longer it is going to take to do your paint. Likewise, painting in stages will lead to a longer overall build time. The only exception to this is if, for some reason, you have downtime waiting to buy/build the next subkit, engine, etc. If finances are holding you up, then there might be time advantages to painting in stages. The other drawbacks mentioned in related threads, however, will still apply. Good luck.
 
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thanks for all the replies on painting your rv

Wow, couldn't believe I received 14 replies within a 24 hour period. I received a wide variety of opinions but the ones I think I like the best are painting the airplane before final assembly.

I have always told my fiancee that I am not just building just an airplane, but I am building a vacation and social machine with so many rv folks out there more than willing to help out. Thank god she is all for it as she sees the benefits as well.

Unfortunately I have to wait until next summer before I start building, but I hope to learn a lot from other builders in the meantime that may make up for my delayed start.
 
To get a really high quality paint finish (automotive finish) the paint needs to be applied in a properly constructed and filtered spray booth/curing oven with high quality lighting (ie a professional booth with a controlled environment). This will ensure the best possible chance of a dust and defect free finish. It will also ensure proper baking and therefore proper crosslinking of the paint system for durable performance over the years.

So how do you get your plane painted and baked in a professional oven once it is flying. At that stage you literally have to fly it to the painter. And the problem is that very few airport painters have professional ovens. And in the rare case that they do....it will inevitably be too small to fit an RV inside with the wings on.

In a practical sense I therefore suspect that the only way to realistically get an RV painted and baked to a high quality automotive finish is to transport it in segments for painting in a proper spray booth/oven before final assembly.

Of course you could always dismantle the plane, including removal of the wings, and transport it to a proper painting oven off the airfield.....but I suspect that not too many RV builders would be keen to remove the wings once they're on.

Incidentally, I'm with Larry. If it aint painted it aint finished.
 
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