R

RV-4

Well Known Member
Hello Gents
A friend of mine is planning to buy an oxygen system and would like to get some feedbacks form the ones of you using such a system.

What is the system you guys recommend for the occasionnal user ??

I've check the Mountain Air web site and it seems to be a nice system..

Thanks in advance for your imputs..

Cheers

Bruno Dionne
[email protected]
 
I've had the AerOx system for about 5 years and have had no issues with it. It works great.
 
+1
watching this thread for intel on O2 systems for my 4



RV-4 said:
Hello Gents
A friend of mine is planning to buy an oxygen system and would like to get some feedbacks form the ones of you using such a system.

What is the system you guys recommend for the occasionnal user ??

I've check the Mountain Air web site and it seems to be a nice system..

Thanks in advance for your imputs..

Cheers

Bruno Dionne
[email protected]
Click to expand...
 
Mountain High

Ditto on the Mountain High. Unless you fill your own, it will save you a lot of money in the long run. Tell him to keep an extra o-ring in the plane so when a refill on the road screws it up he's not out of luck. :rolleyes:
 
I got the AeroX system when I bought my plane for the flight back across the Rockies and had it shipped directly to my hotel. If you buy direct from them, they can ship the cylinder full, saving you some $$, and, in my case, a lot of hassle.
 
If you have the inclination, build your own. There are a couple threads here on doing that. Saves several fillups worth of $.

greg
 
Prescription for O2

I asked my doctor for a prescription for oxygen for the prevention of altitutde hypoxia. He laughed and was glad to supply the prescription.

Next I took the script to a provider of medical oxygen. They give you a tank with a regulator on it for 16 bucks. Buy some tubing and away you go. Tank empty, spend 16 bucks and swap it out.

At 1/2 liter per min, I get about 24 hours out of it (E cylinder). 24 hours is a lot of flying time and I usually swap it out when I get around 18 to 20 hours.

I figure the savings in fuel burn more than pays for the oxygen. Esp since my RV seems to like the 14K to 15K range. I have a bracket behind the passenger seat that stands the tank upright where I can reach it in flight and is strapped in place. Last trip I took that require O2 was at 17K. I noticed that I needed to up the flow to 1 liter/min and the TAS was about 3 knots slower than at my usual altitude. I find that 1/2 liter at 14-15K works well
 
Last edited:
Webb said:
I asked my doctor for a prescription for oxygen for the prevention of altitutde hypoxia. He laughed and was glad to supply the prescription.
Click to expand...

You know, I'm personally all about roll-your-own oxygen systems - but this is so easy and so cheap I'm really tempted to just cave in and do that. For about $1/hr you can have all the oxygen you want with no capital investment.
 
Webb said:
I asked my doctor for a prescription for oxygen for the prevention of altitutde hypoxia. He laughed and was glad to supply the prescription.

Next I took the script to a provider of medical oxygen. They give you a tank with a regulator on it for 16 bucks. Buy some tubing and away you go. Tank empty, spend 16 bucks and swap it out.
Click to expand...

Webb, simply elegant solution to the problem.:D
 
O2 SYSTEMS

Hello All
Thanks a lot for all your goods imputs.I'll pass the info to my flying partner and I guess he will make the decision...
The Mountain Air system will be my personnal choice..but I sure like the idea of getting a doctor's note and go the economic way..

Thanks again

Bruno
[email protected]
 
You get what you pay for..

Mountain High is the system I use. Its as good a system as any. Its easy to use and I am happy with it. If I had to buy again, I probably will buy a regulator at eBay (Max flow 1l/min) and findout how much O2 you need at a certain height.

My friend rents from the Medical O2...this is the cheapest...for sure.
 
Ox System refill/operation?

I just bought a Precise Flight 14 Cu Ft 2-place system at OSH this year (show special of $300).

I'm told that using a welding bottle to refill is the way to go. But I'm not sure what to ask for when I go to the welding supply store (bottle size, connection hose fitting, etc.) I KNOW that if I mention aviation, they'll refuse.

I'll be interested in what others bought (and where), as well as any insight/hints on refilling/mounting/operation.
 
You need a transfiller

riffelj said:
I'm told that using a welding bottle to refill is the way to go. But I'm not sure what to ask for when I go to the welding supply store (bottle size, connection hose fitting, etc.) I KNOW that if I mention aviation, they'll refuse.

I'll be interested in what others bought (and where), as well as any insight/hints on refilling/mounting/operation.
Click to expand...
I got one at Mountain High http://www.mountainhighoxygen.com/index.phtml?nav_id=33&prd_group_id=8 Call them and tell them what you are doing and they will be sure you get the right stuff.

Then go to a welding shop and buy or rent O2 tanks (I bought, renting for long term gets expensive but I don't recall what I paid). I don't recall the size, but they are about 5 feet tall and will allow many refills. Your are right, don't say what you want them for, just say gas welding if they ask.

There are several setups of transfillers. The basic one connects your bottle to the larger tank. You will find one will fairly quickly drop in pressure so the set up I have has two tanks. One donor tank does the volume and then when its as high a pressure as it can give then I switch to the fuller tank and top off my bottle for max pressure. One caution, monitor the tank you are filling. It will heat substantially while filling it. I fill slowly or stop filling if it gets too hot. I have a TR-55 refill hose plus a TR-CIC-540 to allow a seamless hook up to the second tank. I just swapped my two tanks for 55 bucks. I used them for about 5 years and I cannot count how many refills I did.
 
O2 Bottle getting hot

Roger
'' One caution, monitor the tank you are filling. It will heat substantially while filling it. I fill slowly or stop filling if it gets too hot.''

One way to avoid this is to put your bottle in cold ( not freezing though )water, that is what most dive shop do when they refill bottles...It also act as a first safety barrier in case something goes wrong..

Cheers

Bruno
 
DIY Transfiller

We built our own tranfill whip from approved O2 parts (Western) bought on the web. Works great and ~$110 in parts. 6 guys split the cost of the whip and O2 fill tanks. We are now breathing O2 on the cheap!

Our whip is similar to this one

QTY DESCRIPTION
1 312-BCR-4HP
2 312-662P
2 312-663
1 312-663-KPT
1 312-217
1 100-B24000
1 312-PF2-4-72
3 312-B-4HP

We purchased the parts here
 
Good suggestion

RV-4 said:
Roger

One way to avoid this is to put your bottle in cold ( not freezing though )water, that is what most dive shop do when they refill bottles...It also act as a first safety barrier in case something goes wrong..

Cheers

Bruno
Click to expand...

Thanks. Something to consider.
 
Transfill Whip

I bought a "K" bottle ($275) from the Welding supply shop along w/ a 24" trans-fill whip that they guy made up for me (24" oxygen-clean line, 2 CGA-540 nipples and nuts - $40). I chose to not get for the gauge/pressure relief valve after talking to the guy at the shop - I've already got a gauge on the portable and slowly loosening the nut will release the internal pressure in the line.

Could have rented the bottle for $6/mo - but since they would buy-back the bottle for about $200, the purchase was a better deal if I kept it for at least a year. They'll exchange the bottle for a full one for $22.

Filling was a snap. Connect the lines between the supply and portable bottles, Open the portable, SLOWLY open the supply until the portable pressure valve stops, Close the supply, Close the portable. Then SLOWLY loosen the supply nut to relieve the pressure.

For safety, I chained the supply bottle to the hangar so it wouldn't be able to fall over.
 
Ox System Mounting Pics?

I mounted my Precise Flight Ox System portable using the provided bag w/ the straps over my RV7A copilot seat. But I'm not that happy with it and looking for a better solution.

I'd appreciate any pics of ox bottles mounted to the back of the copilots seat. I'm hoping to get an install that doesn't consume too much baggage space, is secure - but easy to remove for filling and that is easily visible/accessible from the pilot side.

Thanks.
 
riffelj said:
I mounted my Precise Flight Ox System portable using the provided bag w/ the straps over my RV7A copilot seat. But I'm not that happy with it and looking for a better solution.

I'd appreciate any pics of ox bottles mounted to the back of the copilots seat. I'm hoping to get an install that doesn't consume too much baggage space, is secure - but easy to remove for filling and that is easily visible/accessible from the pilot side.

Thanks.
Click to expand...

I have the D size bottle, 8 lbs, & didn't like the weight in baggage. I just changed mine to rest between my seats in my 7A. I bagged the cylinder in a expandable sleeve, adapted from a scuba tank protector. It cushions the tanks against the 3/4 angle of the seat. The valve is is bungeed to the the flap chamber. I'll post a picture tomorrow.
 
Any thoughts or pictures of WHERE to put the bottles in an 8? There doesn't seem to be a place where it is both accessable and out of the way....
 
I recall reading somewhere that the use of anything but "medical grade" oxygen was a bad idea. Something about water in the oxygen causing trouble at high altitudes.

Was this a bogus tip?
 
O2 is O2

Medical grade oxygen comes from the very same compressors and storage tanks that welding oxygen comes from.

I have been sniffing welding O2 for the last 3 years and have had no ill effects, (unless you count a strange almost overpowering attraction to cutting torches!?!?!)
 
I have checked with the local welding supplier and they claim that the dew point of the welding and medical O2 is minus 60 degrees. If you get into that low of temperature I don't think you will be too concerned about it. The local military group use medical O2 in their planes.
 
I have a couple of B bottles.
I haven't set on a location in my RV-8 project yet, it's not that easy to find a good spot.
I considered mounting it in the forward baggage with the top of the bottle facing aft. The idea is to run a short shaft thru the instrument panel to permit opening the oxygen valve in flight. I just can't justify mounting a tank of oxygen so close to the engine.
Across pilot's seat back is another possibility. A little squirming around and the pilot could open the valve in flight. It would be above or below the back seater's control stick. Both have issues.
The aft baggage compartment seems safest, and a good location for CG. Opening the bottle valve in flight would be more difficult. A complex shaft or cable arangement or a solonoid operated valve?
 
Scott, my Aerox has an on-off point closer to the cannula. Just open the main tank prior to your flight and then open the other point when you need it. Obviously this method is best when you know you will need the O2.
 
I have a -4

I usually just put the bottle up front in the battery compartment between my feet. (I moved my battery to in front of the firewall.)

If the compartment is full of other stuff, and I am by myself, I put it on the floor at the side of the seat and behind the spar. If I have a passenger, I have them put it beside their seat.

I have not been able to fugure out a way to mount it where it is truly out of the way and not a negative for my weight and balance.
 
How about mounting one under each wing like drop tanks or bombs from the hard points. It would maintain the cabin room and in the case of a mishap you would not have the O2 feeding the fire.
 
Medical grade O2 vs aviators' breathing O2

Is medical oxygen the same as aviators' breathing oxygen? I thought aviators' oxygen was moisture-free to avoid freezing in the regulator, and medical oxygen has moisture added to help prevent nose bleeds from continuous use.

Gas expansion in a pressure regulator can cause localized cooling, and any moisture in the gas poses a risk of creating ice in the system. With the high pressures we use in oxygen bottles, -60 degrees isn't that difficult to reach.

I don't know if the moisture in medical oxygen is a problem in practice, but I just want to make sure we have accurate information.

M
 
If it was a problem then the military would not be using in for refills. I think -60 would be hard to reach at the temps we see in the cabin and the small volume of gas that we are using.
 
The only way you will see -60 in that oxygen tank is 1) flying REALLY high or 2) yanking the regulator out of the bottle. At any reasonable flow rate, the expansion cooling of the gases is virtually insignificant. So even if there was water vapor in the bottle, it would not likely freeze from expansion cooling alone.

greg
 
foka4 said:
Is medical oxygen the same as aviators' breathing oxygen? I thought aviators' oxygen was moisture-free to avoid freezing in the regulator, and medical oxygen has moisture added to help prevent nose bleeds from continuous use.

Gas expansion in a pressure regulator can cause localized cooling, and any moisture in the gas poses a risk of creating ice in the system. With the high pressures we use in oxygen bottles, -60 degrees isn't that difficult to reach.

I don't know if the moisture in medical oxygen is a problem in practice, but I just want to make sure we have accurate information.

M
Click to expand...

Yeah, M, I may have screwed up my recollection about the oxygen issue. Maybe what I was told was to NOT use medical O2 because of the addition of moisture. That makes more sense. Thanks for the clarification.
 
The amount of moisture in medical O2 is very small and NOT added to prevent dry nasal passages. The moisture is just not completely stripped out in the manufacture of it. The medical staff hydrate the O2 as needed when it is in use.
 
Norman, that suggests two different types of O2. My understanding, perhaps wrong, is that it all comes from the same facilities.
 
Ron, around here the O2 all comes from the same place. A lot of people think that medical O2 has water in it but with a dew point of -60c that's not much matter of fact that's pretty darn dry. I would be very interested to know what the dew point of aviators O2 is at. No one around here has ever been able to answer that question for me. Maybe some one here on this list knows. The F18 boys don't seem to concerned about using medical O2 here. Maybe their tanks are mounted in a warm place but probably not as warm as where we would mount them and we don't fly our birds in very cold air.
 
LOX

Virtually all oxygen in the wild, medical or otherwise, comes out of the same really big tanks of liquid oxygen. Dry? You bet. :eek: In medical usage, the oxygen is bubbled through a water bath right at the point of administration.
 
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