Ironflight

Ironflight

VAF Moderator / Line Boy
Mentor
For some reason, my PM box fills up with questions a day or so before a Shuttle launch....so there must be some interest! In the hopes of keeping said PM box within the 50 message limit, I'll just answer the questions I have gotten here....

Yes, No, Definitely NOT, Maybe, and I haven't a Clue!! :D

Seriously though....the latest I have from the Wx guys is that the weather has a 70% chance of being no go for the scheduled launch time of Thursday night, and about that bad the next night. There is a frontal system that is going to be moving through tomorrow, and low clouds and showers are expected. After the front, winds could be up. We are still going to give it a try - you just never know if you're going to get a break.

After working three missions in a row, I have this one off, so I have been planning to go down to see the night launch. I was planning to fly over to KSC tomorrow morning from Houston, and get in before the airspace closes. Just to give you some insight into my thinking, I have scrubbed my trip for tomorrow....which (like carrying an umbrella to prevent rain) will probably mean that we get lucky and have a launch! However, I'm betting that I go down a couple days from now, and get to see a spectacular show. So I bet against a launch tomorrow, and hope that I am wrong!

As always...please stay clear of the TFR - launch windows are too small to deal with intruders!

Paul
 
Paul, when the shuttle launches, will it go up the coast? If so, we are able to see it for a few seconds at my place of work.
 
Yup - it's an ISS mission, so it will be going high inclination - pretty much right up the coast. I've heard that some people up the coast have seen launches all the way to Main Engine Cut-off.

Paul
 
Well I am heading down there tomorrow morning. I am packing my golf clubs and if it lifts off great if it doesn't I will play golf again on Friday. My brother is a Major in The Air Force and is the Public Affairs Officer for Patrick AFB so he is keeping me informed. He says it doesn't look good for tomorrow, friday or saturday. Clouds and wind will probably be the main culprits. I think he said about a 40% chance of lift off but we all know how much the weather changes. It's suppose to head towards the northeast and should be able to be seen along the entire east coast. I have been down there for two launches and have seen them both. Hopefully it will be three times!
 
Yup, we see a big bright streak zip across the sky, then nothing, it must be main engine cutoff. I am in southeast Alabama.
 
48-Hour Scrub Turn-around....

Since I have this flight off, I'm just spectating on the decisions....tonight's was a very close decision, but we played by the rules....tomorow the threat is high winds (most of it cross), so we're going to forgo tomorrow's opportunity and shoot for Saturday. That doesn't look particularly good either, but at least it is a target, and we can look again before we commit.

Dang - by staying in Houston (due to forecast bad weather), I was hoping that the perversity of the universe would have made the weather "Go", and we could have gotten off!

Ah well, I hope to fly out for the next attempt - still want to see a night launch!

Paul
 
Delay..

Ah...Paul,

That's what you get for knowing so much. I was descending into Dulles this evening hoping to see the shuttle scooting off to the Northeast, but you knew already the probable outcome. Why the scrub? Was it because of the overcast ceiling around 5,000 ft.?? ...the lack to be able to track visually the launch and any possible debris from the the ext. fuel tank?? just curious. I know the forecast for the next couple of days is not very good at all....mostly for wind reasons I believe.

I'm hoping that we, along the mid-atlantic seaboard, will be able to see this man-made wonder when she passes outbound on her journey to achieve orbit...

Sorry Paul, but you've pretty much been tagged "it" when it comes to this shuttle tech stuff...

And BTW, between your awesome paintjob of Valkyrie and that great photo of you relaxing next to her at that fly-in campground, provides great inspiration and motivation to finish my -8!!! I'm sure that the rest of us would agree??!!!

Jeff
-8 wings ...yes, I know...still!!
 
KSC WX minimums

Hi Jeff,

I think you will find that the Wx restriction is to enable the RTLS - Return to launch site abort - which is the 1st Abort scenario - although I don't believe it has ever had to be used so far - fingers crossed as apparently it is the most difficult Abort situation.

The crew need VMC conditions for a KSC landing - link here as I may have some of this not quite 100% accurate

http://science.ksc.nasa.gov/shuttle/technology/sts-newsref/mission_profile.html#rtls_abort

(Sorry Paul to pre-empt your reply !)

I did watch Nasa TV yesterday evening here in Europe for the crew strapping in - very interesting although it was a shame they lost the Flt deck camera feed - but still great to watch from the comfort of my computer chair :D
 
Paul-
Just wondering ...
With all the visual / camera monitoring NASA is doing for debris from the external tank how do you handle a night launch (you know, dark and all :) )?

Thomas
 
Wx Minimu...

Morning guys,

Last night's launch attempt was actually a "Go" for RTLS weather criteria (basically 5,000 Broken), but was "No Go" for Range Safety Constraints - the cloud layer was too thick. Range Safety is the function that keeps the public safe in case of a serious problem, and they have certain visual tracking requirements....

As far as the night launch, we have gotten the visual data that we need to verify the new foam processes on the External Tank from the previous three flights, and have spent literally thousands of man-hours satisfying ourselves that it is OK to return to night launch. We are still doing two complete on-orbit visual/instrument scans of the vehicle to make sure there isn't any damage before Entry. Oh...and we THINK (but will have to see), that we'll still get enough light from the engines to get some video from the ride-along cameras (those things are awesome!) that we are using now.

It's just like "real" flying...go to the airport, have a look, understand your weather rules (and that no mater how hard you try, you can't CHANGE the weather - only understand it...)...and then make the right decision. There is always another day!

Paul
 
I had a unbelievable view (for me!) of the shuttle last night as it sat perched on the pad. Visibilty was great but that **** ceiling! My brother, PA officer for Patrick AFB, would call every ten minutes alternating between "green" and "red". Now you know why they call it Mother Nature. I was standing on top of my Ford Expedition parked along one of the roads to the beach. I couldn't believe how close you can get to the shuttle. Within twenty minutes of leaving our viewing site the clouds started to part and the moon and stars came out. If that launch was a half hour later it probably would have been a go. But just to see the shuttle lite up was still pretty cool. The weather is miserable today. The wind howled all night long and is still blowing strong. Tomorrow doesn't look good either! At least I got a good game of Golf in yesterday.

Paul, are there any more night launches scheduled in the future?
 
I was just reading the previously linked to page on abort modes.

Check out this sentence:
"In a TAL abort, the vehicle continues on a ballistic trajectory across the Atlantic Ocean to land at a predetermined runway. Landing occurs approximately 45 minutes after launch."
Click to expand...
Wow...I guess if that abort mode is ever executed it will set a new world record for a transatlantic crossing. :D
 
We see certain airports NOTAMed around launch day. One airfield is in Spain, the other is in Gambia. If it ended up in Gambia, the shuttle would probably disappear as fast as the airplane in the gun running movie with Nicholas Cage - hilarious sequence when a Fairchild or similar is stripped in time lapse in a few hours !
 
It's actually scheduled for an hour from now....there is a built in 40min hold at T-9. Kinda confusing if you just tune into the live feed and see the clock counting down which right now is inside of 20 min even though actual launch is an hour away at 20:47 Eastern.
 
Its on its way

I was browsing the site and happened to read the posts here at 8:48. I ran outside just in time to see it going away. Too bad I was not a minute earlier, I would have seen the first part of the launch.
 
Slightly OT ... but there is some good stuff on the Science channel tonight ... a show about the return of the shuttle to space with Discovery's flight and right now a show about the first Apollo lunar mission.

T.
 
I was down there Thursday but had to head to Savannah this morning. It was an incredible sight. Just after main engine ignite the low level clouds turned into a giant orange blob. The shuttle rose above the clouds as a giant streak of flames. It was even better than watching a day launch from ten miles away! Being down there this morning I would have never guessed that they were going to be able to launch. The winds were howling! It was amazing to see how many people up here in Savannah who were parked along the road to the beach to watch the launch. The shuttle is one of the great things you get for your tax dollar.
 
Great Launch - Gotta go beat up a Weatehrman....

Just kidding! :rolleyes:

See, my ACE weather guesser told me yesterday that if it were him, he wouldn't waste the gas money flying down until the Tuesday opportunity. This is the same guy that called the scrub dead solid perfect on Thursday....(and their usual batting average is about 85% - pretty darn good for weather guys!)....so I stayed in Houston, and sure enough - they had a good ascent! Ah well - something tells me that if I had gone, down, the weather wouldn't have been good. Gene Kranz never got to see a launch live until after he retired either....oh well, I'll have a few more chances.

All sounds good so far from here in Houston. I thought the External Tank Camera video was spectacular for a night launch - I kind of suspected we'd see pretty good detail by the light of the main engines, and we did. Now it is on to the Station for one seriously complex mission.

You folks on the east coast shoudlo have had a great light show! :D

Iron Sends
 
Shuttle "Fly by"

Paul,

My wife and I got a nice view of the shuttle as it came past this evening. We're just north of Richmond, Virginia and saw it for about a minute or so (off to the east and north bound) about 7+ minutes after launch. I've never seen a launch in person and the mixture of pride, excitement, envy, awe, and joy for the crew as I stood there watching is impossible to describe. It sure was a great night for viewing, too! Crystal clear skies and not too cold to enjoy the view.

Thanks to everyone at NASA that had a hand in this!
 
That be a fast plane!

Wow, that was fun!

Thanks to some good internet gouge, my wife, son, and I watched liftoff, started a stopwatch, then climbed out on the roof here on Maryland's Eastern Shore. T+4 minutes was the Outer Banks, T+8 was Nova Scotia, according to prior night launch event reports. Sure enough, just when we thought we might have missed it, there was a nice orange glow about fifteen degrees off the horizon out of the south. Got to see it long enough to have everyone track it with the binoc's then got to see MECO just before it dipped below the trees.

The clear night, the strobes down low, and those on the jetways gave a nice reference for just what 11,000 mph looks like. That sucker was haulin' some serious chili! :D
 
Just missed it!!!

I just missed it here in Virginia. ...a beautiful star filled sky. I thought I'd heard on the radio something about 9:00pm so I was going with that. I was trying to get my way overtired 6 yr old to bed when I turned the TV on to the NASA channel to hear ".....main engine cutoff..." and see the orbiter separating from the external fuel tank.

...I figured it was too late to run outside now. ..AAAUUURRRGGGHHH! ..oh well...at least I'm still my little girls' hero!
 
Over in the UK we don't get to see much of it, but a few years ago, a buddy in our airline (we fly charter 767/A330 into SFB FL) got asked by Jacksonville if he wanted to watch a launch ! They got the vectors and countdown spot on. Des said it was the most spectacular thing he has ever seen - they were just on the edge of the protection zone when it lifted off. Passengers got a great view as well - at least those on the left !

What we do see is the ISS overhead. You can get a projected viewing time for your location from here,

http://spaceflight1.nasa.gov/realdata/sightings/

Because it is just after dusk or before dawn, the ISS is well lit and with a reasonable pair of binoculars you can clearly see it. In fact, when the Shuttle is docked, you can see that too - quite a sight.

If you are watching skywards in the next 3 days watch for the Geminids, a meteor shower radiating from near the constellation Gemini.

http://comets.amsmeteors.org/meteors/showers/geminids.html

I will be eastbound over the Indian Ocean enroute Indonesia that night so I am looking forward to it :D
 
I got some pics, off the astronomy sight I frequent, for those of us who weren't able to see it. Great Job, NASA!

Roberta

theiss1it8.jpg


theiss2ha7.jpg


theiss3gp1.jpg
 
Here is what it looked like from 12 miles away off US-1 for those of us that live close by.


niteshuttle4smallmi2.jpg
 
Night Launches

I covered the first night launch(STS-8) for AP. Rained like crazy and finally got off the pad about 2:30AM. We watched Nebraska beat Penn State during the delay. The launch completely erased the fatigue and gave us all those chill bumps you get when you witness a really special event. I had the privlidge of covering the Shuttle Launches from 1980 through 1986 and 1989 through 1992. Each one had a personality of its own. Some were on time and some, 61-C, I believe took 5 attempts. As Todd said, this is one of the best parts of paying taxes. One of my sons and I watched the Shuttle soar past the GA/SC border at Tybee Island, GA. During the minute or two it was in view, I was flooded with the memories of my younger years, blessed to live, with all of its faults, in this wonderful country.

GO DISCOVERY!!!!!
 
Shuttle Launches

Don't feel bad Paul,
I've been here at KSC for nearly 80 launches and have only seen maybe 2 or 3 from outside. I watched most of them from a 9" monitor on a console. Now we have HD cameras and monitors so it's not so bad. I'm one of those video guys you said we don't need anymore, hope no one else saw that. Sorry you didn't make it down for the launch. It caught us by suprise too, thought for sure we would be coming back again on Sunday. The Launch videos should be up soon, I'll see if I can post a link for everybody.

mbarnett
RV-8 QB
 
mbarnett said:
I'm one of those video guys you said we don't need anymore, hope no one else saw that.

mbarnett
RV-8 QB
Click to expand...


I LOVE the launch videos!! :D Honest!!! :D

Who in my office would say a thing like that....Oh - maybe you mean the PROGRAM office (that's the great thing about a huge agency - there is always someone else you can blame.... ;) )

Can't wait to see the SRB video - I heard the boats just got back this morning.

Paul
 
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