R

rhsanborn

I'm New Here
I'm trying to gauge the feasibility of an idea. I'm 22 years old, just finishing up college (degree in Anthropology) and starting a new career (Systems administrator of medical records systems) and have recently stumbled upon Van's aircraft via the web. Flying is something I've been intrigued by for a long time, and have never pursued it mostly because of the assumed costs. After some research, those costs still seem substantial, but feasible. So, to my questions.


I understand that it probably isn't as docile as a Cessna, but, given the proper lead and preperation time, how feasible is it for one to get one's license, build the plane, and have an RV-7 as a first plane? Given the time to raise money, then to build, I think it should offer ample time to train, practice and become licensed, but is that preperation enough?


Sincerely,
Randall
 
Ah Grasssshoppppaaa.....

Ah Grassshoppaa..... You can do anything..... No really.... You must ask yourself these questons....
1. Money.... Talk to some seasoned RV pilot/builders... see what really happens..
2. Eye Hand Coordination. Anybody can fly a 172..... it does take a bit more skill to fly an RV proficiently...Do we have it or do we have the patience to practice and get it.
3. Do your friends run the other way when they see you with powertools?
4. Would you like the best feeling in the world of building and flying your own airplane...
5. Am I willing to commit some serious time and education towards this goal...
6. Am I smart enough to ask questions when I have one... even if it seems dumb.. we've all been there.....
7. Do I want to be part in one of the best botherhood's in the world?
8. Am I man enough to wear a pink shirt with a hot Hula girl on the back?
9. Do I have the maturity to use the airplane in a safe manner without jeapordizing the health and well being of others?
10. Can I build it at my house or a location nearby?
11. Am I willing to accept the first "free ride" from a fellow RV'r? heh heh heh...... 60 grand later grin.......
12 Will your friends put up with you talking airplanes allllll day long? (If not.. you did not need them anyway)
13. Do you have somebody that can give you a second set of hands... for say bucking a couple thou rivits?
14 Are you willing to join the EAA?
As long as you can answer numbers 6 and 9 with yes... I say GO FOR IT!! Welcome to the brotherhood...(you can work on the others later)
Best
Brian Wallis

did anybody else find his degree and job together as funny or ironic? heh heh....
join a chapter, pal around with a mechanic, get some rides here and there, build a toolbox or other starter project, order the tail.... build the tail at a workshop event, and the rest is history..... you can do it....
 
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FLYING?

HAVE YOU SPENT ALL YOUR DAYS LOOKING UP AT ANY AIRPLANE FLYING?
HAVE YOU BEEN FACENITED BY ANYTHING THAT FLIES ALL YOUR LIFE?
HAVE YOU SPENT MOST OF YOUR FREE TIME AT AN AIRPORT? RC AIRFIELDS COUNT.
HAVE YOU BUILT 100RDS OF MODLE AIRPLANES?
DO FRISBEES CAPTIVATE YOU? BOMERIANGS?
IF YOU ANSWER YES YOU MIGHT HAVE THE STUFF TO BUILD AND BE A PILOT.
 
Being in your position 3 years ago, I had similar questions. I had 8 hours of training time under my belt and real desire to get into aviation, but the 172 / Cherokee seemed a bit vanilla to me. I saw Doug's Site and began reading it daily, and then after much research and seeing one in person, I decided that I wanted to build and fly that plane.

So the actionable items were:

- More flight lesson's to see if I really enjoyed flying (but no ppl yet) - Sept. 2006 - present
- Stalk VAF on a near fulltime basis - Sept. 2006 - present
- Buy a house with a two car garage - Dec. 2006
- View every page in Checkoway's build log to see if I could do it - Mar. 2007
- Fly in Pop Owen's RV-6 - June 2007
- Go to Oshkosh 2007 and be immersed in RVism- July 2007
- Build a shop in the garage - July 2007
- Payoff ALL debt (except the mortgage) - August 2007
- Empennage Kit Arrived late Sept. 2007
- Today - Emp almost done, QB kit scheduled for Feb.

The three major things I think people underestimate in this undertaking -
1.) Cost - To build a RV7 in 3-5 years, I would be ideal to be generating about 20-25k in disposable income a year during that period, or have great credit and no fear of all that interest. On top of that you need a place to build it hence - a house with mortgage is typically required.
2.) Dedication - If you have eat, dreamed, lived various other hobbies or sports, and have that adictive personality, you should be successful - at least if you can stay focused for several years. (For instance- in college I decided I wanted to race sailboats, but didn't know how to sail, so I spent 200 days a year on the water for 4 years and was the team captain / somewhat close to all-american by the very end)
3.) Technically aptitude - this might not be too major, but I feel it would really help to have a technical thinking mind to master all of the various tasks that will come your way.

I plan to have about 150 hours before my first flight, so can't answer much about the flight time piece.

If you can swing it in your head and in your wallet- then just go for it.

Chris
 
Welcome! I figured I'd chime in, because I am in almost the same situation.

The story on me:
22, Engaged, 19 Month Old Daughter, Web Designer and Search Engine Optimization Specialist, Work/Stay At Home Dad, 150ish Hours, PP-ASEL Since 2002

I have been dreaming of building an RV-7(A) since back when Dan C. was updating his site everyday with his progress. I watched his site EVERY SINGLE DAY from workshop set-up to the first flight. After his plane was flying, I was still checking in on builder sites every now and again, but it just wasn't going to happen at that time.

Anyway, I was working for myself, doing reasonably well, but not in the position to put a ton of money into a project. If I put $10K into a plane over the course of 6 months or so to get going, and then had a bad month, the little lady wouldn't be so pleased. So, now that I'm getting ready to actually get started, I've done some things to make it happen.

Preparations:
- I spend HOURS on here, each and everyday. I am learning from the experienced builders: techniques, cost-saving ideas, mistakes, and dedication.
- Helping local builders: I try to find a builder to help as much as possible. It seems to be much easier to find people, and become a legitimate part of the community when you've got a kit in your garage, so this is tough for pre-build dreamers like me.
- Financial Stability: I took a job (full-time, benefits, etc.) that makes sure that my bills are paid, that the baby is fed, and the lady is happy. I still work from home, and still have time to do my own projects on the side, which leads to more extra income, and money to put into the project.
- Downsizing/savings: We're not in a position (due to being credit-retarded in college) to buy a house. So, we found a smaller home to rent, which will save $500-1000 including rent, lowered utilities, etc., from what we are paying now.
- Being realistic: I know that if I keep my nose to the grindstone, my side-work can cover the project in 15-18 months; kit, tools, panel, engine, extras, etc., so I'm trying to better manage my time throughout the day. With that said, that takes time away from the project. I expect to put in serious hours, but making money to fund the project comes before working on it. Otherwise, I won't have anything to work on!

So, I'm going to be getting started soon. I am willing to take the time to save the money to get started right. I'd like to order tools, empennage, and wing kit all at once, which means it may be a few months before I am in the position to put the $10-12K into making that happen. Initially, I was really focused on finding deals, deals, deals, and while I feel there is some merit to that, I feel like it is important to not stretch at the start. If you can find the discipline to get going in the right way, the project appears to actually be possible.

Good luck! We all need it!
Mike
 
Join EAA and get involved with the local chapter.

Ted Gauthier is a DAR and RVator based at PTK. His contact info is on the DAR list here on VAF. I don't know Ted, but I do have several friends that he assisted them with their RVs. Nothing but great things to say about Ted. I would think he would be a good source to ask questions and get introduced to the local builders and perhaps find somebody willing to give you a ride in a RV.

You may also want to join the Ohio Valley RVators. (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/OhioValleyRVators/) There are many Michigan RV'ers in the group. I know of two that are building RV7's in the Detroit metro area. I'm sure that there are more.

I would recommend getting to know several builders and perhaps help giving them a hand for awhile. This way you can test the waters to see if building is really what your are interested in doing.
 
Jaypratt said:
HAVE YOU SPENT ALL YOUR DAYS LOOKING UP AT ANY AIRPLANE FLYING?
HAVE YOU BEEN FACENITED BY ANYTHING THAT FLIES ALL YOUR LIFE?
HAVE YOU SPENT MOST OF YOUR FREE TIME AT AN AIRPORT? RC AIRFIELDS COUNT.
HAVE YOU BUILT 100RDS OF MODLE AIRPLANES?
DO FRISBEES CAPTIVATE YOU? BOMERIANGS?
IF YOU ANSWER YES YOU MIGHT HAVE THE STUFF TO BUILD AND BE A PILOT.
Click to expand...

Hi JAY / RANDALL -

IN MY CASE YES TO ALL.....JAY, BUT OUR INDIGENOPUS ABORIGINES IN DOWN UNDER OZ WILL TELL YOU THAT BOMERIANG IS SPELT BOOMERANG!

COUPLE MORE......

HAVE YOU EVER:

SOLD YOUR INNER CITY URBAN HOUSE TO BUY A FARM NOT FAR OUT OF THE CITY WITH A PADDOCK BIG ENOUGH FOR AN AIRSTRIP?

CONVINCED YOUR WIFE THAT YOU WERE BUYING THE FARM TO GIVE THE KIDS MORE SPACE AND TO HAVE A GOOD VIEW?

CONVINCED YOUR WIFE THAT THE BIG SHED YOU NEEDED TO BUILD WAS FOR FARM MACHINERY?

FILLED THE MACHINERY SHED WITH REMOTE CONTROL AEROPLANES?

CALLED IT A HANGAR?

AND THEN ORDER THE BEST KIT PLANE IN THE WORLD BECAUSE ITS JUST WHAT EVERY FARM MACHINERY SHED (SORRY, HANGAR) NEEDS?

GET AMONGST IT RANDALL, START WITH AN EMP KIT!!!

CHEERS,

JON.
 
Which angel will you listen to?

On one shoulder is the one saying, "How much money? How much time? Is this realistic? Will I fail?"
On the other shoulder is the one saying, "How cool will it be to...! I've always wanted to...! "I want to be one of the guys who did it!"
Only the horsepower of passion will get you past the dark hours of rivet driving reality: in the end, you could always do something else that's more practical, but you will never do anything else more glorious.
Clay "Cookie Monster" Cook
emp done, tanks in progress, QB fuse waiting.
 
Only One Way To Find Out

I bought my -4 emp kit when I was 28 (1984). No on-line support and other aviation interests took over and I shelved the project until late last year and now I'm going strong, committed to finish. Meanwhile, in 1994 I started building my garage w/apartment, then my 3400' house. Took 8 years between the two of them, but I discovered I could stick with a one-nail-at-a-time project.
Buy the emp kit and see if "it's" in you. If not, maybe later.
 
I'm 25, fresh out of college, been married and in a home of my own for a year, and started my RV-7 build in June 07. No kids in the picture, which makes things easier. Also, I'm in it for the long haul - if it takes me 10-12 years to be able to afford everything for the plane, no sweat, I'll only be 35-37 by that point - still many many years of great flying to be done. I have many years ahead of me - I don't have many dollars in my bank account. My current mission is to get a basic to beat all basic VFR aircraft in the air. Things can always be upgraded.

I don't have my license yet and have very little (less than 5) hours even riding in general aviation aircraft.

Someone told me, "be prepared to experience every emotion through the project - if you can keep forging ahead even through the anger/hate/broke/sad/stress emotions, you'll make it."
 
Wow, great. I think this is something worth going after then. And, considering costs, I think that you are right DaX, that putting together a VFR plane, perhaps with a slightly lower HP motor will get it in the air sooner, while allowing for upgrades to be done as funds allow.
 
Why Not

Thought I'd mention... Not only is it one of the most worthwhile projects out there, You'll get to meet people you will call friends for the rest of your life. Probably the best part of the whole deal. You will be amazed at the skills some of these folks have. Amazing. You will learn more about airplanes than you ever thought possible. Takes more committment than you may think, and don't let anyone fool you...70 grand is what you will most likely invest.

Jump on in!!

Chris
 
Not too far

Randall,

I've got a RV9A project down in Redford, not too far from White Lake. empennage and wings completed, working on the fuselage. Your welcome to come by and take a look, if you'd like. Build time is somewhat limited right now, but we're working most Sundays.
 
You can do it now, or do it later. The "can I do this" will always be there regardless of your age. I'm not suggesting getting in over your head on it, but don't wait 15 years like me to get started either.
 
Go for it man..

If you can afford it, rock and roll.. ;)

I really want to build a plane.. Just can't decide..

Pitts M-12 or RV...

I think I'd have a better chance at building the RV - as I would order the QB kit.. Wish Pitts had one..
 
brianwallis said:
Ah Grassshoppaa..... You can do anything..... No really.... You must ask yourself these questons....
1. Money.... Talk to some seasoned RV pilot/builders... see what really happens..
2. Eye Hand Coordination. Anybody can fly a 172..... it does take a bit more skill to fly an RV proficiently...Do we have it or do we have the patience to practice and get it.
3. Do your friends run the other way when they see you with powertools?
4. Would you like the best feeling in the world of building and flying your own airplane...
5. Am I willing to commit some serious time and education towards this goal...
6. Am I smart enough to ask questions when I have one... even if it seems dumb.. we've all been there.....
7. Do I want to be part in one of the best botherhood's in the world?
8. Am I man enough to wear a pink shirt with a hot Hula girl on the back?
9. Do I have the maturity to use the airplane in a safe manner without jeapordizing the health and well being of others?
10. Can I build it at my house or a location nearby?
11. Am I willing to accept the first "free ride" from a fellow RV'r? heh heh heh...... 60 grand later grin.......
12 Will your friends put up with you talking airplanes allllll day long? (If not.. you did not need them anyway)
13. Do you have somebody that can give you a second set of hands... for say bucking a couple thou rivits?
14 Are you willing to join the EAA?
As long as you can answer numbers 6 and 9 with yes... I say GO FOR IT!! Welcome to the brotherhood...(you can work on the others later)
Best
Brian Wallis

did anybody else find his degree and job together as funny or ironic? heh heh....
join a chapter, pal around with a mechanic, get some rides here and there, build a toolbox or other starter project, order the tail.... build the tail at a workshop event, and the rest is history..... you can do it....
Click to expand...

All I would suggest to Mssrs(???) Sanborn is that s/he may find him/herself planning too far ahead based on his/her current knowledge.

First - if you don't have your license yet you really don't know yet if you love flying enough to make major sacrifices for it. You might learn something different from Brian based on what he has DONE rather than what he SAYS - he bought a really inexpensive trainer to build hours in. Why is that a great idea? Well for him it was even better because he can legally work on it, but for any determined aspiring pilot with enough credit to buy a new Honda can instead buy a used trainer, and start flying today rather than in some imagined future when you have completed building an airplane. From that you can learn many things and, if at the end you aren't convinced you are born to fly, can generally walk away (sell it) with little or no money lost.

Look, you may end up loving building. If so, it will always be there - but you will NOT make money at it (relative to hourly rate plus benefits you will likely make in your current occupation). And, if once you build you find you do not love flying - what a disappointment, and you could be out a serious piece of cash at the point in your life where your savings could have the greatest impact on your retirement.

Both building and flight instruction take a great dedication of time and attention. Trying to do both in addition to your career is inviting such stress as to destroy the joy you seek.

I intend some day to build a plane - but not today. I am nearing retirement and yet still enjoying the benefits of a homebuilt airplane.

So, go fly first. If you love it, and have that knowledge in your heart and understanding of annual costs in the seat of your pants (and can live with it!), then you will be prepared to understand whether or not you should build your own plane.
 
honestly

Yes you can do it. But before you invest your hard earned money into this I would highly recommend you get involved with a chapter. Spend some time doing the RV thing. It aint top gun. Flying is over run with procedures and rules. (All necessary) I mean, you can’t even buzz the local football game without being crucified ..... ok ok that was a joke.:D;) No really it is allot of work in the beginning but it does truly have its rewards. I did just as you, minus the age part. I have been at it for a while and sometimes I wish I had just bought a plane. There are many here that will flame me for that statement with the "satisfaction from you build" stuff. But looks to me groucho and many others are having a ball with someone else’s hard work.
http://www.thedukes.org/rv/video.html
But they are correct. My father always said if it’s worth having its worth working for. These guys and gals have shown me the sheer satisfaction and joy of completing this project. So I will at least do that, if I decide when it’s done (I doubt I will) that it aint all it’s cracked up to be I’ll sell it and put the money in the bank.:(

NOTE the 5 years i spent building this dern contraption are worth faaaaaaar more than tha additional 40 grand it would have taken to just bougt a nice completed one.
everyone here is gonna tell you bascially positive stuff because those that think you cant are doing something else. like washing dishes, hunting, fishing, flyin rc, weed wackin the yard, drinkin in some bar, gaining knowlege on sports facts.put you current favorite pastimes here__________________________they will be here when your done. unless its your mate or children..they sometimes dont have the stamina for the build that you will.
 
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rhsanborn said:
..I understand that it probably isn't as docile as a Cessna, but, given the proper lead and preperation time, how feasible is it for one to ...have an RV-7 as a first plane? Given the time to raise money, then to build, I think it should offer ample time to train, practice and become licensed, but is that preperation enough?


Sincerely,
Randall
Click to expand...

As a 30 year,900 hour pilot, the RV is much easier to fly than my C-150 was. However, the A-model landing gear is not like a Cessna's and many of the landings I made as a student/new pilot would likely have broken my RV. Taildragger's better for handling thumps, but more demanding to get the landing right. The -9's land about 10 mph slower and thus may be better trainers. There is no right answer here, just one or more good ones for you.
 
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