K

kenpilot

Active Member
I have a very specific question about the RVs: What is it exactly that limits the baggage area to 100lb. I've heard vaguely that it's a structural limit, but how so? Is it the strength of the floor panel? Fuselage?

Sorry if this has been posted before. I searched but only found larger W&B topics. My question isn't about CG. I'm about to make a long flight, and I'm under max weight and within CG limits, but I have 130lb of baggage.

As a sort-of secondary question... Am I damaging anything by climbing back there during the condition inspection, since I weigh more than 100lb?
 
kenpilot said:
I have a very specific question about the RVs: What is it exactly that limits the baggage area to 100lb. I've heard vaguely that it's a structural limit, but how so? Is it the strength of the floor panel? Fuselage?

Sorry if this has been posted before. I searched but only found larger W&B topics. My question isn't about CG. I'm about to make a long flight, and I'm under max weight and within CG limits, but I have 130lb of baggage.

As a sort-of secondary question... Am I damaging anything by climbing back there during the condition inspection, since I weigh more than 100lb?
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assuming a 6 / 6A
Will you be within CG at minimum fuel?
On mine (o-320, composite prop), I have placarded the baggage as 80 pounds max because at minimum fuel 100 pounds puts the CG aft of max.

So unless you have something heavy up front (or a steel crush plate), I'd double check that you can even do 100.

Fortunately I'm typically solo when doing a cross country, so I can put heavy stuff into the co-pilot's seat, and (well secured!) in the passenger floor area.


for condition inspection (etc.) I recommend making a plywood floor to lay into the baggage area ... otherwise you are likely going to dent the baggage floor panels.
 
Bill Boyd said:
Not unless you're going to pull 3G's while you're back there inspecting...
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My RV10, completed in 2011, has a Vans recommended baggage area limit of 150 lbs. I have never received any mail, SB, etc., from Vans changing that, although newer kits have a 100 lb recommended limit. I think Vans simply lowered the limit because they feared that too many owners were flying aft of the recommended cg limit.
 
Thanks for the reminder about zero-fuel. I was only calculating expected usage. Fixed that in the spreadsheet now. But yes, I can remain in CG limits even at max weight with 130 lb in the baggage area, but only because I moved as much weight as I could forward. FYI, here's my W&B for the upcoming trip.

The bottom-most item is a large flat box that distributes the weight across the entire floor. (And yes, I used plywood during the inspection when I climbed back there.)

2024-06-30 00_41_11-N28RV Weight & Balance.png
 
Merrill's spot on. Assuming you don't have a passenger, you can even remove that seat and put a good chunk of that weight right beside you. Just make sure nothing interferes with the controls, even if the load shifts in flight. If you do have an adult passenger AND 130 lbs of baggage and full fuel, I'm guessing you're going to be near or over gross weight.

Maybe it's just me, but there are some things you just gotta accept. If Van's states that 100 lbs. is the baggage area limit, or that the max gross weight is 1800 lbs, there's testing or calculations behind that. If you put 110 lbs. back there, your plane isn't going to explode on takeoff like a SAM hit it. But you're cutting into safety margins that are there for a reason.
 
mdevans9 said:
Just wondering, why not strap 30 lbs. (or more) in the passenger seat?

Merrill
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I am. In lieu of a person there, I have 120lb of cargo.

D-Dubya said:
you can even remove that seat and put a good chunk of that weight right beside you. Just make sure nothing interferes with the controls, even if the load shifts in flight.
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Hey, that might just be the answer staring right at me! I can't just leave the seat behind. I'm not just flying to CO; I'm moving there. Anything that doesn't fit in this trip is headed to Goodwill. But... I hadn't considered just pulling the pin and laying the seat back down sideways. I bet that will allow a lot more to be at that station. Thanks!
 
kenpilot said:
I am. In lieu of a person there, I have 120lb of cargo.


Hey, that might just be the answer staring right at me! I can't just leave the seat behind. I'm not just flying to CO; I'm moving there. Anything that doesn't fit in this trip is headed to Goodwill. But... I hadn't considered just pulling the pin and laying the seat back down sideways. I bet that will allow a lot more to be at that station. Thanks!
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That's how I travel to Oshkosh, take out the seat and you can put big bulky stuff in that space and put the seat cushions in the rear compartment. Also dont forget the space behind the seats forward of the flap torque tube.
Figs
 
The "WHY" of this is an interesting question. We all just know and parrot back that it's a structural limit but very few people (myself included) ever both with the why on stuff like this.

I'm going to guess that it's simply that if you exceed the limit, you're likely to bend the floor, but that's just a guess on my part. If you care to have a look, you'll discover that Cessna has a similar limit in the baggage area of all the prop singles and they go so far as to say how the weight must be distributed within that area.
 
Desert Rat said:
The "WHY" of this is an interesting question. We all just know and parrot back that it's a structural limit but very few people (myself included) ever both with the why on stuff like this.

I'm going to guess that it's simply that if you exceed the limit, you're likely to bend the floor, but that's just a guess on my part. If you care to have a look, you'll discover that Cessna has a similar limit in the baggage area of all the prop singles and they go so far as to say how the weight must be distributed within that area.
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I can guarantee that you wont bend the floor at about 2g, cause I spent a lot of time back there during the build, and I'm 180 lbs :D
 
kenpilot said:
I have a very specific question about the RVs: What is it exactly that limits the baggage area to 100lb. I've heard vaguely that it's a structural limit, but how so? Is it the strength of the floor panel? Fuselage?

Sorry if this has been posted before. I searched but only found larger W&B topics. My question isn't about CG. I'm about to make a long flight, and I'm under max weight and within CG limits, but I have 130lb of baggage.

As a sort-of secondary question... Am I damaging anything by climbing back there during the condition inspection, since I weigh more than 100lb?
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Do yourself a favor. Buy some plywood and cut panels. One spanning most of the baggage are. Two spanning the seat pans. Two spanning the angled area of the stick cover panels. Lay towels down then the boards. They distribute local loads. I found some little bends in panels after the first time I stepped in the baggage area. I also bought a kiddie mat to lay on. Pool noodles around the flap bar help reduce pain of laying down back there.
 
wirejock said:
Do yourself a favor. Buy some plywood and cut panels. One spanning most of the baggage are. Two spanning the seat pans. Two spanning the angled area of the stick cover panels. Lay towels down then the boards. They distribute local loads. I found some little bends in panels after the first time I stepped in the baggage area. I also bought a kiddie mat to lay on. Pool noodles around the flap bar help reduce pain of laying down back there.
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This, or something similar. A couple of hundred pounds of distributed load (you) isn't gonna hurt the baggage floor. A couple of hundred pounds spread over a few square inches (your feet, knees, elbows, etc) may damage something.
 
Desert Rat said:
Cessna has a similar limit in the baggage area of all the prop singles and they go so far as to say how the weight must be distributed within that area.
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My old Piper Warrior also had a baggage area limit that was related to failure of the floor structure rather than to W&B.
 
Kyle Boatright said:
This, or something similar. A couple of hundred pounds of distributed load (you) isn't gonna hurt the baggage floor. A couple of hundred pounds spread over a few square inches (your feet, knees, elbows, etc) may damage something.
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Yep. Some of the Boeing floorboards were designed with the worst case load being a stiletto heel. That put more stress as a pont load on the floors than any other loading condition. And you can almost bet the loads engineers didn't think about that until the first high-heeled passengers loaded onto a early passenger jet. Back when it would have definitely been a woman dressed to the tees rather than a presidential cabinet member.
 
Desert Rat said:
Likewise, but for that to be a valuable metric I would have to be 600 lbs and evenly distributed across the entire floor area
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Assuming 100 lbs of baggage is allowed to be carried at 6 G’s during aerobatics.

It isn’t.

Normal category limits are 3.8 G’s

And as others have pointed out, the specified limit is expecting a distribution on the entire baggage floor. Not a point load in one spot.
 
riobison said:
Does this plywood suggestion (plywood protection) apply to just the 6s or the 7s and 9s as well?

Thanks
Tim
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I'm not aware that the floor in the 7 or 9 is any thicker gauge than it is in the 6. So I'd recommend it for all three.
Look at the number of ribs on the wing walk area, and compare that to the baggage area.
 
I second the plywood for the floor idea, I have one for mine and just feels more secure when I'm back there, I also have made platforms to slide back behind the bulk head for when I need to crawl back there, more so for my comfort and ease of getting out then fear of damaging anything with my weight. I'm 170lb
 
Is there a reason you dont save yourself a lot of work and just spend the money you will on plywood and ship the items? You must have a friend or know a business with a ups or fedex account that can get you a good rate. A little extra room will make everything more comfortable. Have a great trip either way. We loved living in Colorado!
 
rockwoodrv9 said:
Is there a reason you dont save yourself a lot of work and just spend the money you will on plywood and ship the items? You must have a friend or know a business with a ups or fedex account that can get you a good rate. A little extra room will make everything more comfortable. Have a great trip either way. We loved living in Colorado!
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Oh I'm not buying plywood for the trip, since by bottom-most item is a large flat box that already distributes the weight. In the front is the ice chest, tools, spare parts for the airplane, etc. Shipping the items doesn't make sense in this particular case. It'll all fit, and I still have the pilot seat open with plenty of elbow room.
 
Hope you are also considering effective cargo tie downs & load straps.
Imagine 130 lbs of miscellaneous stuff flying around the cockpit in +2 -1 (or more!) Gs unexpected turbulence!
 
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Jeez guys. Most of us are over 150lbs. Personally, I'm 200lb and wear a size 10. Put all that weight in a small area the size of your foot and it's gonna leave a dent. Just cut a chunk out of that wing or fuse crate to distribute the load. It ain't rocket science. Sorry.
Thankfully my floors are removable so I just smoothed the dents back. Don't make my mistakes. Make your own!
 
rockwoodrv9 said:
We loved living in Colorado!
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With this recent sharp increase in home values in Colorado we sold our place in Basalt for just under 4 times more than we paid for it in 2012. We thought we were brilliant! However I miss Colorado so much I wish I could buy it back.

You will love living in Colorado!
 
At 6ft and 230 pds Im not able to kneel in there. Im on my back, my belly or my side. Being in the back of my RV9 is like working in the front of my old RV 4. A real pain.....
 
riobison said:
At 6ft and 230 pds Im not able to kneel in there. Im on my back, my belly or my side. Being in the back of my RV9 is like working in the front of my old RV 4. A real pain.....
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Do you remove the canopy first? On my Slider -6, taking the 5 minutes (and a helper) to remove the canopy makes all the difference.
 
Amadeus said:
With this recent sharp increase in home values in Colorado we sold our place in Basalt for just under 4 times more than we paid for it in 2012. We thought we were brilliant! However I miss Colorado so much I wish I could buy it back.

You will love living in Colorado!
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Our company was the developer for the RLN in Aspen and the Snowmass Ski area rebuild in 2007-2012. Basalt is a great place to live. We were in Snowmass for most of the time then built a house just outside of Carbondale.

To keep it RV related, Vlad flew into Glenwood Springs to stay with me and give me a ride i think in about 2010. We flew up to Aspen and around Ruedi. My friend from Steamboat - Dave gave me my first flight in an RV. He flew his nice 9A and we flew up all around the area. What a great place to live.
 
blaplante said:
Not sure how many 6 owners still have a chunk of wing or fuselage crate ;-)
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Really? Local lumber yard and every big box store I've been to, always have culled lumber. I've bought everything from 3/4 plywood to 2x12x16s at pennies on the dollar. I know skme locals that buy it and burn it. I'm sorry to sound harsh, but this is easy stuff.
 
wirejock said:
Really? Local lumber yard and every big box store I've been to, always have culled lumber. I've bought everything from 3/4 plywood to 2x12x16s at pennies on the dollar. I know skme locals that buy it and burn it. I'm sorry to sound harsh, but this is easy stuff.
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Sounds harsh.
 
wirejock said:
Really? Local lumber yard and every big box store I've been to, always have culled lumber. I've bought everything from 3/4 plywood to 2x12x16s at pennies on the dollar. I know skme locals that buy it and burn it. I'm sorry to sound harsh, but this is easy stuff.
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Not in Canada. You might save a few bucks but not much
 
wirejock said:
Sorry. I did apologize. Just trying to save someone a big dent repair. If those floors are riveted, fixing it will take a lot more effort than cutting a piece of scrap plywood.
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Having recently installed the step kit on my 16 year old -7 I can attest that removing the riveted baggage floor is no 5 minute job, I actually ended up cutting holes to install the steps as I found that the removal job was much bigger than anticipated. Another one of those jobs when building that is "I will never have to remove this so I will just rivet it down :rolleyes:.
Figs
 
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