F

flyboy

Member
If I build a Vans, fly it for a year, then sell it, what is my liability? If someone crashes because I might have missed a couple of rivets, am I liable?
 
Short answer, YES! If something happens that can be traced to your negligence, then you would be liable, and rightly so. You are the manufacturer and your name remains with the airplane for its' entire life. Now, having said that, to my knowledge, no builder has ever been successfully sued over this. It all comes down to the "deep pocket" theory and most builders don't have the deep pockets that lawers are looking for.
Mel...DAR
 
This subject comes up alot on a number of forums.

To date, no homebuilder has been sued.

Unless your net worth is in the BaZillions, you never will.
Lawyers make the call, if there isn't enough money for them to go after, they won't. Remember, they get 1/3 of the settlement. High 7-digit minimum. These cases take years to settle or see court.

Having a liability waiver may help if the purchaser survives.
The waiver means nothing to a grieving family.

Still, no one hase been sued.


Greg Piney
RV-8 Gonnabe (Real Soon Now)
Setting up Shop
Purchased Tools (OUCH!)
 
I do know of a couple of cases where the builder was sued, but not successfully. Speaking of a liability waiver, always get one signed. At least it shows that you had warned the buyer. One little thing that I do is have the next of kin sign the waiver as witness. They are the ones likely to sue.
Mel...DAR
 
Thanks, I was hoping someone would quote some law that said 'no case can be brought against an experimental builder' but there may be no law. It sounds like the deep pocket theory rules. Really it's like my favorite lawyer, Johnny Cochran, said, 'The color of justice is green.'
 
I think you may lose if any of the following is found;

1. the lawyer can prove that you built for profit
2. you are an licensed A&P


I've heard from the EAA many builders have been sued (no one has yet to win against a homebuilder) ... but you still will have to fork out some cash to defend your self.
 
homebuilder liability

If I build a Vans, fly it for a year, then sell it, what is my liability? If someone crashes because I might have missed a couple of rivets, am I liable?
Click to expand...

Not being an attorney, I have no idea how grounded the following article is in law, but it was written by an attorney and is interesting reading:

http://www.aviationlawcorp.com/content/liabhomeblt.html#myths

Be careful out there.............. :)

Sam Buchanan
 
You can tell it's written by a lawyer. An article about disclaimers that includes a disclaimer at the bottom. That's awesome. It seems like good advice, nonetheless. (This post is only an opinion written by somebody that's doesn't speak legalese.)

Dave
 
What does having an A&P have to do with it? Just because you are a mechanic doesn't make you an better or worse manufactorer. I could see the proof of building for profit. But there is almost no way to PROVE that, otherwise the FAA wouldn't have certified the airplane in the first place.
 
Those are some interesting ideas. I'm a long way from an A&P, but have been in the flying part professionally (paid to fly) for a long time. I bring the question because some of the Vans for sale are because of health reasons. If I build, then get poor health (or other interests) it would be nice to be able to sell the airplane without fear of losing all assets at a time when I have very little earning power due to age. However, it appears that the builder, me, would probably have the same liability that Cessna or Piper would, without the really deep pockets.
 
Form a Corporation to own the plane.

A lawyer I know that built an RV8 set up a corporation to own the aircraft. The sole assest of the corporation is the plane. If he were to sell the plane, he would sell 100% of the stock of the Corporation - ownership of the plane and liability remains with the Corporation. He told me this was also a good strategy to avoid sales tax since Stock sales are not taxed. Of course this a cost to form the Corp and there is usually an annual fee. The costs vary from state to state. This may not provide complete protection, but it adds a layer of protection from liability.
 
Mel said:
Short answer, YES! If something happens that can be traced to your negligence, then you would be liable, and rightly so.
Click to expand...

Hi Mel,

I'm not sure I agree with this exactly. If it's proven that something you did cause the accident, then that part is hard to deny. However, this is an AMETEUR built experimental plane. By it's very definition, you aren't expected to be an authority on construction.

I believe they'd have to show that you were knowingly negligent, in order to make any sort of case. After all, during the time you owned the plane, you (I'm assuming) flew it yourself, as well as taking your family and friends flying. Would anyone do that "knowing" there was something wrong with the plane?

I know that you can sue for anything these days, and agree with you that lacking deep pockets helps prevent it. That's about all that the good I've gotten from not being rich though :D

Rusty
 
I can't see that who ones the airplane (corp or private) affects in any way who built it, or who gets sued.
 
Excellent article. However, it didn't go into specifics about how to sell an airplane or how to write a disclaimer. Does anyone have any suggestion or examples of wording to use in a disclaimer or transfering all liability to the new owner? I had thought about selling all the parts and pieces of the airplane but that doesn't seem to fly either acording to the article.
 
exculpatory agreements

Tom McCutcheon said:
Excellent article. However, it didn't go into specifics about how to sell an airplane or how to write a disclaimer. Does anyone have any suggestion or examples of wording to use in a disclaimer or transfering all liability to the new owner? I had thought about selling all the parts and pieces of the airplane but that doesn't seem to fly either acording to the article.
Click to expand...
Here's another article: http://www.avweb.com/news/avlaw/181900-1.html

If I should ever sell my homebuilt, I'll invest some cash to get a really good lawyer to write an exculpatory agreement, and probably video the guy/gal reading it and signing it. I'll have all kinds of scary phrases in there like "serious risk of death". As someone else mentioned, it would be an excellent idea to have the wife/husband/partner/child/maid/dog sign it as well.

I have also read that it is possible to get insurance to cover the rare case that you do get sued. The main advantage there is to have someone with deeper pockets than you with some skin in the outcome, and of course to cover legal fees, since you will probably win.

Another option is to try to find an international buyer. I know few, if any, countries that allow people to sue for clearly "high risk" activities as easily as you can in the US. Most people outside the US wouldn't even consider suing.
 
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Lots of experimental airplanes have been sold by the original builder. There must be a good disclaimer somewhere. I do know from personal experience that a well connected law firm can sue over just about anything, and initially get the favor of a judge. However if the defendant has an equially well connected-expensive-firm, it is very possible to prevail. It's just darned expensive.

If I do build, I would have no intention of selling, but you never know. I don't believe it's possible to hide behind a corporate veil. A good attorney can get through. I wonder if anyone has opted to donate their airplane to charity? Surely, no liability there.
 
I have sold two amateur-built airplanes in the past, and I have three lawyers in the family, so I guess I have an opinion on the subject based upon actual experience and free professional advice.

Point one that has been made - You can be sued for any reason by anyone. Period. No escaping it. It doesn't matter what contract clauses you have, if someone wants to sue you, they can and will. of course, this is true today even without building an airplane. Forget to shovel the snow from your sidewalk and the pizza delivery guy falls? Guess what, you're liable.

Point two - just because they sue you doesn't mean you'll pay them anything. Deep pockets and tight contract clauses help to dissuade a lawsuit. As has been stated, if there's no money to be had, most lawyers won't pursue it. Setting up a corporation doesn't really protect you if you are the builder. You are still liable as long as the airplane is flying. If you are a buyer of an airplane, then the corporation can help to shield your assests, but they don't do anything for you as a builder.

Solution? Sell your airplane with a good, reasonable sales contract and don't worry about it. Unless someone can prove that you knowingly deceived the buyer about defects that you knew could cause an accident, and if you have enough money to make a lawsuit worthwhile after several years of litigation, then the likelihood of you being successfully sued is quite low.
 
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