J

jscottpilot

Active Member
I am trying to tighten the landing gear bolts with the special nuts inside the bulkheads in my RV8. The clearances are so tight you cant get a socket on them and the wrench slips when I try to tighten them. Any ideas on how to tighten them?
 
The same way you get to Carnegie Hall......

Actually, consider taking a grinder to you socket so that it fits down inside the little well. Universal joints also help, and I have even used one of those flexible extensions. If I were building again, I'd modify the gear towers to have a big opening with close-out panels, as many have done - really improves the access!

Paul
 
Not that I plan on it, but is it possible to put the bolts in from the top and torque the nut on the bottom? I'm sure if it was acceptable, we would of heard of it by now.
 
I put the bolt heads inside the towers and the nut on the outside. Still a lot of cursing, but after grinding a few tools it all worked out, barely!
 
I feel your pain

I just went through this about 2 months ago. I feel your pain. I ended up removing several of the #8 screws and a couple AN-3's that where interfering with where my wrench wanted to go. I held the nut steady and had a trustworthy person torque the bolt head on the outside. I called Van's about this and they said that would be alright given the difficulty. After hours of dealing with feeling around for threaded studs to get the nuts onto I finally got it finished and replace the #8 screws I removed earlier. Things are really tight. If your fuse in inverted like mine during this time, you'll be dropping washers and nuts a lot and they fall to the top of the gear tower. Have a couple of neodime (aka rare earth/ really strong) magnets handy to suck those puppies back out. That was really handy for me.
Brad Vier
RV-8 FWF
 
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We went to a pawn shop and bought a several box end wrenches (don't remember the size - I'm at the office now). We cut them about 2 or 3 inches up from the box end and then used a torch, vise and hammer to bend them 90 degrees as close to the box end as possible. We then cut a slot in the box end so that we could get it past the #8 ends and on the nuts.
Then the fun starts - You, or the smallest friend you have, crawls in and puts the wrend on the nut and your buddy torques the bolt from the bottom.
Haang in there.

Geoff Kimbrough
RV-8 N6978C Flying
Stearman N1707M for sale
Katy
 
Even with the cutout its a bear and I never seem to do it the same way twice. I grab every modified wrench, crow bar, swivel joint, extention, flathead screwdriver, and socket I can find..... and anything else I can jamn in there to get that darn nut to stop turning. Its brutal and a terrible design for maint.. Its without a doubt the worst part of working on the 8 and there is no close 2nd. I find it takes 3 people. Me, the bolt turner, and one person to calm me down from cursing it.

Im afriad there is no good answer. Its just plain brutal. When Im asked to come help someone. I bring a creeper and a pillow and I get to turn the bolt and listen to the cursing form the cockpit. There is something theraputic about listening to someone else who is suisidal from the cockpit trying to get those darn nuts to stop turning. Misery loves company I suppose. I know its evil.:mad:
 
I managed to get them all tightened. I had to grind down a socket to get one of them tightened. I had to use various brands and lengths of wrenches to tighten the others.
 
I was able to get them tightened after loosening one of the an3 bolts in the front, then was able to get a flex socket on the nut. The back one I was able to jam a screwdriver in to stop it from turning.

Not a very well thought-out area.
 
I took two sockets and welded a (90 degree) rod off the top of each of them. I slipped a tube on one of the rods. Once I put both sockets in place, I then slide the tube across both of the rods that were welded to each socket.

The tube connects the two sockets together and prevents the nuts from turning. When I was certain this would work I put a dab of PRC on them and the whole setup will stay in the airplane.

Just another idea.

Paul
RV-6 Flying
RV-8 Finishing
 
Good Idea

That looks like a great Idea. Definately got my gears turning since I put my gear on once and need to put them back on now. that sure would make checking the torques easy in the future for inspections.
 
Hmmm

I doubt if they would be able to take the torque. The bolts are 3/8, and the specified nuts are steel locking nuts. Also, the order of assembly would not allow for the pre-installation of nut plates, since the holes are drilled in final assembly, and you would not be able to install the rivets.

Hmmm... I suppose you could install the rivets...but I would still check the allowable torque on that type of fitting.
 
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Well, there is a 3/8 nut plate listed.

Could it be installed with a couple of 4-40 screws drilled/tapped into the mount??

Would allow for changing out later, if the nut got damaged, or locking feature wore out.

I have no idea what kind of torque is used here, or what the nuts will take, just floating an idea or two out there.

There are also keepers made for nuts, common on car headers, that might be usable, here ia a link. to one vendor. Probably lots more out there.

They list NASA as a user:D
 
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Why is "landing gear" the first QB fuselage step?

All this traffic re: gear attaching machinations has me wondering why the buildrrs manual has you fit/drill the gear then remove it and continue with the fuselage build out.
I made that inquiry of Vans and they replied:
-Common bolts are used thru the wings and gear attach. If the gear is on, you can't get the wings on.
Forwarded by: "Support" <support>
Forwarded to:kens-

I read that slowly and it still reads "you can't put the wings on if the gear is on."
WTF, over.
Don Stiver
RV8 QB
Emp & Wings done
Staring at the Fuselage.
 
I like Chris' idea and think that's a good way to go if they will hold their shape under the torque load. Might open the slots up.

Let us know how they fair when tightening.

Ted
 
APACHE 56 said:
All this traffic re: gear attaching machinations has me wondering why the buildrrs manual has you fit/drill the gear then remove it and continue with the fuselage build out.
I made that inquiry of Vans and they replied:
-Common bolts are used thru the wings and gear attach. If the gear is on, you can't get the wings on.
Forwarded by: "Support" <support>
Forwarded to:kens-

I read that slowly and it still reads "you can't put the wings on if the gear is on."
WTF, over.
Don Stiver
RV8 QB
Emp & Wings done
Staring at the Fuselage.
Click to expand...


You are mixing models. 8 sissy wheel has weldements that carry through the wing. 8 has gear boxes, wings easily removed without touching any gear bolts.
 
Ted RV8 said:
I like Chris' idea and think that's a good way to go if they will hold their shape under the torque load. Might open the slots up.

Let us know how they fair when tightening.

Ted
Click to expand...

I think the edges of the weldment will keep the slots closed. I am planning on doubling them up though (2 - 1/8 plates) I will also be installing the plates on top of spacer washers so that the gear nut washers can move.

Chris
 
I also am concerned about the slots opening up.

Basically, any material you can cut a slot in with a hack saw, will probably be too soft to make a good wrench.

Having it captured with the weldment certainly is going to help
 
I kept grinding the outside of a socket until it would easily slip over the nut. I also cut a short length of 3/8" barstock and ground the corners a little until it would slip down into the socket. Put the socket on the nut, the barstock in the socket and a 3/8" wrench on the barstock and get your helper to apply the torque.

After getting the tools right and with a little practice I can get the bolts torqued in less than 15 minutes.

Oh, and I take the front seat back off so I can stretch out in the cockpit and get a workable angle for my arm.

Here's a link to a thread with lots more info including a picture of the tools I use. http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showpost.php?p=181281&postcount=11

Somebody suggested using an extension with a universal joint to hold the socket in place. That might be even easier.
 
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Ldg gear bolts

It was long and not fun, but I got mine alone - tape box end wrench on bolt end w side of wrench against some hard stop. Used multiple extensions, ground down sockets, crowfeet and was able to torque. Do not like to think of doing again at 10 hrs when that day comes. Bill
 
smaller nuts

Finley Atherton said:
Please excuse what is most likely a silly suggestion as I know nothing about the landing gear attachment bolts in an RV8. How about using MS21042 nuts which would allow the use of a smaller socket? http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/hapages/an363.php.

Fin 9A
Click to expand...
That's exactly what I did, and it worked great. No problem getting a socket on. I'm pretty sure I read that suggestion somewhere here on VAF, but not 100% sure.
 
Finley Atherton said:
Please excuse what is most likely a silly suggestion as I know nothing about the landing gear attachment bolts in an RV8. How about using MS21042 nuts which would allow the use of a smaller socket? http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/hapages/an363.php.

Fin 9A
Click to expand...

rv8ch said:
That's exactly what I did, and it worked great. No problem getting a socket on. I'm pretty sure I read that suggestion somewhere here on VAF, but not 100% sure.
Click to expand...

I'll tentatively take the credit here. I suggested in another thread that these nuts be used for the difficult to reach lower wing attach bolts on the A models. The low profile MS21042 nuts are a handy substitute for the Nyloc nuts. I stand to be corrected, but my understanding (which has been confirmed by licenced aircraft engineers) is that these nuts are at least as strong as Nylock nuts. These nuts were the standard ones used on the Vari-Eze/Long EZ and I would guess over a whole aircraft, you may save a couple of pounds weight using the lighter MS21042 nuts rather than Nylocks??

Fin9A
 
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Univair made a kit that replaces the U-bolt that holds the landing gear on a citabria. The bolts it comes with are "internally wrenching" high strength aircraft bolts. they had a cone shaped head with a hex key opening and were torqued in place just like these bolts are.

I plan to get bolts like these, fitted from inside the fuselage with the threads pointed down. Then you could reach into the gear tower with a big allen key (or even cooler, fabricate a double ended key that locked into both bolts at the same time) and torque from the outside. the only problem I can see with this approach will be interference with the gear leg fairing. I talked with my A&P/IA and from a "AC43.13" point of view it is an equivalent connection but should be much easier to maintain.

Has anyone tried this before?
 
Pretty critical area to be second guessing Van's engineers with different attatching hardware.

I'd want their seal of approval before trying any of these alternates.

Just my two cents.

Ted

Ted
 
My airplane, like "Bubblehead's" on page 3 is also in Conditional check and "also" was bought by me flying. I saw a lot of talk about this a year ago, and at the time, there was also speculation whether the airplane should be on jacks or not when torquing. I see when the plane is on jacks, the gear struts do indeed bend in, which would "seem" to me ( if the weight is on the wheels) to put pressure on these landing gear bolts and thus prevent proper torquing.

BUT- I wasn't a builder. Any thoughts out there?
 
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