N941WR

N941WR

Legacy Member
I?m still a year or two away from my first flight and it dawned on me that I haven?t flown anything since before starting on my -9. Four years w/o flying anything is a long time.

Last night I rented a Decathlon and flew for 1.5 hours. (6 landings, pwr on/pwr off stalls, slips, steep turns, etc. Next flight we will play with loops, rolls, and spins.) One more flight and the CFI said he would have no problem signing my BFR. After that I expect to fly an hour or two a month until the -9 is completed and then take some transition training before my first flight. Note, I did not say the airplane?s first flight as I?m not ready to make the first flight pilot decision yet.

What did the rest of you do to prepare for your first flight? (I do plan on using our chapter?s EAA Flight Advisor just as I?ve been using the Tech Inspectors.)
 
You're on the right track

I would continue as planned. Then get the transition training closer to the time of your 1st flight. It might be hard to find a 9 taildragger for transition training, but an RV6 or 7 will give you the practice you need to be comfortable flying the 9. I had 600 flight hours before building. I didn't fly that much during the three years that I was building; 32 hrs in building year 1, 12 hours in year 2 and 9 hours in year 3. Transition training for me was 7 hours in an RV6A two months before my first flight in my 9A. Just plan your first flight well and use your pre-flight check list "as if your life depends on it". Lots of adrenaline can cause you to forget stupid things. Don't ask how I know. My 1st was un-eventful. Jack
 
Is it a dumb idea to consider learning to fly in a 9A?

My practical side suggests that the 9's would be an excellent training platform and the rental rates are "very affordable" compared the the flight school rates.
 
Flight Training

Bill,

If you could get out to Missouri to fly with Bob Lynch I'd recommend that highly. He can train in either a 6 or a 6A and I took a couple of hours of training in his taildragger even though I'm building the 9A. He taught me the attitude for landing both the conventional and tricycle gear versions and I found it helpful. I'm planning to take more transition training as I get nearer to finishing.

Should you find anything close to you, e-mail me, I'm up in Virginia and travel to and through NC regularly.
 
Decathalon vs. -9

Don & Jack,

Thanks for the comments. The good thing about the Decathlon is the speeds are the same as the -9, it has an electric fuel pump, and spring landing gear so it is "close" to what I think I will experiance in the -9. Again, I'm still a good way off from flying my -9.

Unlike the -9, the Decathlon is draggy and slows down quickly. It likes to slip, something I never hear RV pilots talk about but I suspect they are good slippers.

(How draggy? Last night the control tower asked us to turn base immediately and land in front of an incoming Saab SF340. We were at 1000' AGL, on right downwind and not quite to the end of a 5,300' runway when we turned right and slipped it all the way down to the runway. I found myself 10' off the runway going 80 mph so another slip brought our speed down, kicked it straight, touched down just past the 1/2 way mark and made the next turn off. I'm thinking I like the Decathlon.)

Don, I'll keep you in mind as I get ready for the transition training and let you know.
 
Bill,
Have no fear; RVs are great "slippers" with or without flaps.
Mel...DAR
 
cobra said:
Is it a dumb idea to consider learning to fly in a 9A?

My practical side suggests that the 9's would be an excellent training platform and the rental rates are "very affordable" compared the the flight school rates.
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If you can find a CFI with an RV9A for training purposes, I would think it would be a good idea. Most of the CFI RVs are used for transition training and doubt they would let you use them for all the required solo time. They are a little more complex than the typical high wing trainer, but not significant, IMHO. My guess is that you will have to use a combination of airplanes if you want some of your training in an RV. Unless of course you build it yourself. Jack
 
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cobra said:
Is it a dumb idea to consider learning to fly in a 9A?

My practical side suggests that the 9's would be an excellent training platform and the rental rates are "very affordable" compared the the flight school rates.
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Van's sells the 9A as a good training platform on their website--and for the most part I would agreee. At the same time, I'm not sure I entirely agree, in part because the 9 flys too well. For example, the very benign nature of stalls and the relative lack of need for rudder in the 9 can probably lead to some poor technique that if ever tried in another aircraft could lead to much different results. To elaborate on my too examples above: in most training aircraft a stall will lead to some wing drop which, in most cases, should be handled with rudder first, NOT aileron. That can be a hard lesson to learn even in a C150/152. It would be a really hard lesson to learn in a 9 that (a) does not demonstrate much wing drop and (b) has very effective ailerons even in the stall. The second example is that many of the RVs (including the 9) can be flown almost with your feet on the floor and very little attention to rudder (except in some very dangerous situations--like the cross-control turn to final that can lead to the stall-spin scenario). Training without need to pay attention to rudder is probably not a good thing.

That said, if you have an instructor who will find ways to make sure you learn these and other important lessons, the 9 would be a great (and probably cost-effective) way to train. One last comment--it will be a good plane to learn to fly in IF you can find a CFI willing to do primary training in a plane that you built. I'm sure you'd be able to find one--it just depends on where and how wide of a selection you have in choosing one.

Good luck.
Steve
 
Back to Bill's question

I think a couple of us just hijacked Bill's thread, the answer to which is of interest to me as well. So...

What does Bill (and the rest of us builders) need to do to prepare for 1st flight?
 
Jim Younkin showed me how to lose a couple of thousand feet in his 9A a while back. We were two thosand feet AGL and nearly at the end of the runway. He made several S turns at around 55 KTS that were pretty steep. The plane stayed rock solid and dropped like very big ROCK. We still had to fly down the runway a ways to get closer to the turn off. Every time I get to fly in a 9 I a little more impressed and sold on this plane. BTY, He should be getting fairly close to finishing his RV-10. I wonder if he will install an auto-pilot. ;)

P.S. I finished installing the trailing edge rivets in the right flap last night and it came out nice and straight. Whew! Only one more to go.

Jim Wright 90919 RV-9A wings Arkansas
 
My suggestion... Get some time in an airplane with similar systems and a similar sight picture. A Piper Tomahawk comes to mind. Believe it or not, my 300 hours in my old Tomahawk gave me the perfect sight picture and systems training for my RV-6. The pattern speeds are/were the same too.

Sure, there are differences, but to me, the critical issue is whether you can land the thing, and getting checked out in a Tomahawk would help.

Another suggestion is to select a variety of aircraft with different characteristics and fly each of 'em for an hour or two. A C-150, a Taylorcraft, a Grumman AA-1, a Piper Cherokee, a Cherokee Six, etc. The idea here is to widen your experience base, so your flying skills are flexible enough to adapt to the unique feel you'll get with your RV..
 
Get transition training then fly it around the pattern

Fly as much as practical just to keep your talent alive. Get transition training shortly before it is time to fly your own just to learn its characteristics and you can relax. It is not some rocket ship that requires super human skills to fly - it is well designed and developed for flight by regular pilots. Check everything carefully before flight, set the pitch trim to neutral, verify oil pressure, oil temperature and fuel pressure are good then take off, hold as much right rudder as you need to keep the take off straight, keep working the pitch trim to keep it feeling natural for the flight regime you are in, fly around the pattern one time and land, don't let it get too slow and if you are flying an "A" make a special effort to hold the nosegear off and don't panic if the nosegear shakes like the tire is flat when it settles on, just retorque the caster nut to get the right breakout force before you fly it again. Take the cowling off and thoroughly inspect the engine compartment before you do it again. On the first flight I just wanted to get it airborne, fly it using all of the flight controls, land it without hurting it or me. Build on that. The greatest moment of self actualization I had after all those years of building was the instant the tires left the ground after rotation - after that it was all natural.

Bob Axsom
 
this sums it up well

Bob Axsom said:
It is not some rocket ship that requires super human skills to fly - it is well designed and developed for flight by regular pilots.

Bob Axsom
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Bob is right on. Follow his advice on preparation and you are good to go.
 
one pattern and land

...fly around the pattern one time and land...
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I've heard it's a good idea to go up high above the airport and do a bit of slow flight just to be comfortable with the slow flight characteristics before the first landing. I guess if you get enough transition training in the same model, then it might not be necessary.
 
I wasn't flying at all during my 18 month build time, except transition training with Mike Seager. I did my BFR with Mike during the transition. I have about 700 hrs of Cherokee time, 100 Tail dragger and now over 100 in RVs.

Do a thorough ground run and check of the engine and fuel systems. I don't advise high speed taxi tests, as too many people become airborn prematurely. When you are satisfied everything is a go, then go for the flight of your life in your newly finished airplane.

I took off from my home runway at Air Troy and went over to East Troy (two miles away) to do the flight test.

I ran my first flight about two hrs, circling over East Troy airport at about 3000 msl. I wanted to run the new Lycoming in so I ran at 2500 rpm and about 25 mp, leaning to about 1310 deg F EGT. I kept a good eye on engine parameters and flight controls. Should anything not look right, I could always land immediately. Everything looked great and the first test flight was a perfect success.

I then did some slow flight to see how slow I could fly before hitting stall speed. When I was satisfied, I made my first approach to landing, observing all the speeds as I made the first touchdown. I had a 5000 foot runway (I'm used to 1700) to play with so I let the plane float about a foot off before I knew she was ready to come down. A perfect flare to the end of a perfect 1st flight.

Checking the oil and the belly for any signs of leakage or anything else amiss, I fueled up for one more flight before returning to Air Troy Estates for the day.

Once I had two landings to ensure I could handle the shorter runway at Air Troy, I returned home for the first cowl off inspection. Everything was perfect, but then, that's the way I built it.

I ran Aeroshell Oil 80 (straight mineral oil) for break in. I changed the oil and filter after about 1 hr of ground test and setup. I changed the oil and filter again after 25 hrs phase I testing. After our 25 hr shake down flight out west I changed to Aeroshell 15W50. I change oil and filter every 25 hrs. I put 8 quarts in (1/2 Qt goes in the filter, so I register 7.5 on the dipstick) and at 25 hrs I have about 6.5 qts registering on the stick.

Good luck with your first flight. It is the best!!!

Roberta
 
First Flight

Unlike some others, I am not hung up the the "I built it, I'm going to be the first to fly it," thought. I am going to have a very experienced person do the first couple of hours in my 7.

Now the important part, GET TRANSITION TRAINING!!!! As I write this, I am sitting in the Portland airport returning home from transition training with Mike Seagar. I now consider this the most important money I spent on the project.

I am writing a review of my training experience that I will ask Doug to publish on the opening page of his site. Hopefully, this will give some insight to others on the process and importance of training.

Darwin N. Barrie
Chandler AZ
 
The Mike Seager Experience

Darwin, do what you think is best but there is only one first time and it is special. I agree with the implication about the Mike Seager experience it was special! Now the other part of the experience - what did you think of Vernonia? My drive out there from Portland, staying in the Inn and eating in the log cabin style restaurant and talking to the locals was an experience that I will not forget. Did you get a chance to drive the special road along the bluffs, forest and the beautiful waterfalls south of the Columbia River between Portland and the town of Hood River? I've never seen anything like it.

Bob Axsom
 
Darwin, I don't think it's a hangup to want to fly your plane for the first time. I also don't think it s a hangup to want to have an experienced pilot test fly your plane. A pilot has to decide what they are comfortable with and if their personal experience allows them this latitude. The smart pilot knows in their own head what is the safe and prudent thing to do and if they are completely competent to do it.

Some people listened to their hearts when they should have listened to their heads. If it's in your head and in your heart to fly it, go for it. If you don't have both, let an experienced person fly it. No foul there.

Enjoy,

Roberta
 
Getting ready for my first flight meant scraping off 8 years worth of rust. I had sold my share in a 180 Cherokee because of partners who liked to tinker and who rarely added to the reliability of the airplane. I didn't intend to quit flying but time went by and life just kept happening.

Fast forward to 2004 and completion quickly coming up on my RV-9A. A call to Mike Seager and everything was set. I would work my way to Vernonia and get factory 9A training. To get ready for this I got a medical and went to a local FBO for a bi-annual in an Archer. After this I rented it a couple of times to build some confidence and it was off to Vernonia. Much to my dismay Mike did not tell me that I was the best that he had ever flown with. He did however sign me off after 5 hours and I came home ready for a lifetime of enjoying my RV.

At this point My wife helped me to put the ego aside and have somebody else do the first flight. We found a 24,000 hour ATP, 747-400 captain who does first flights for RVers and he did the honors. Once the airplane was pronounced okay by him I went up the same day. It was still thrilling to fly it for the first time, and is still a thrill to fly now.

As for Vernonia... While waiting for my turn to fly I walked the grass runway and looked around. Upon closer inspection I noticed that the runway was not grass at all. It was made up entirely of very small strawberry plants and had flowers with the berries starting to form in the middle. Does it get better than this? Vernonia was great.

Regards,
Bryan 9A "Flyin The Flag"
 
Prep

Weeks before my first flight I got several hours of dual in a local Super Decathelon. It was very helpful. I think it's a good game plan.

After 20 hours in the RV-8 I went back to the SD for more spin training and it seemed soooo slow on the take-off roll compared to the RV. Made me smile... :D
 
As John said on the first page; First, get involved with an EAA Flight Advisor! He/she will guide you through all facets of preperation.
Mel...DAR
 
first flight

Here's what I did.

I kept current by flying a couple of hours per month on 172's and Cherokees that I co-own. The Cherokee is the most similar to what I built (9A), so I flew it the most.

I couldn't find any local folks willing to do transition training, so I opted to bring an experienced safety pilot along for the first flight. The theory was that if anything goes wrong, two heads are better than one.

I highly recommend this, even if you have transition training. A lot happens on first flight-- in my case some funny temperatures and overvoltage alarms. It's nice to have someone else fly while you are debugging instruments. No one else knows the airplane better than you.

Before the flight, I did a ground briefing with the safety pilot which also served as a complete review of the aircraft, instruments and procedures for both of us. It helps lower the stress levels as well, because it's actually quite relaxing to be focused on these details beforehand.

The '9A is very easy to fly, with the only major differences in flight characteristics being the climb rate and speed. Other than that, it handles like a 172 or a Cherokee... no surprises. Slowing it down for final is the challenge, [forward slips need a *lot* of rudder pressure] but touchdown is gentle. Not like the other RV's I've landed, which need to carry some power to optimize the landings.

In my opionion, here is the optimal set-up:
-be current
-have transition training
-use a safety pilot/instructor
-do a complete ground briefing beforehand
-do not have an audience (friends, family) in attendance
-choose a quiet day (minimal traffic)
-make sure the weather is better than 'ok'
-be prepared for anything

In my case, about 10 minutes after take-off, I realized 'hey, I'm actually flying this thing'. I was so focused on details and procedures that I *almost* forgot to enjoy it.


127_2771_2_1.jpg
 
mark manda said:
I going to stay at a Holiday Express Inn tonight!!! :D
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Congratulation Mark! Getting that inspection done and seeing that slip of paper after all the building time is a remarkable feeling!

Now calm down, and when you can write a coherent sentence with all the words in the right order, you'll be ready to get ready to fly! :D :p

Paul
 
Safety Pilot

vlittle said:
...I couldn't find any local folks willing to do transition training, so I opted to bring an experienced safety pilot along for the first flight. The theory was that if anything goes wrong, two heads are better than one.

I highly recommend this, even if you have transition training. ...
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This might be ok in Canada, but it's not really "legal" in the US, unless you kind of stretch the meaning of "required crew". Van's did an article on this in RVator, and he was very strongly recommending that you not do it. I can understand your reasoning, but I'm not sure the FAA in the US would in the event of a mishap.
 
Congrats, Mark!! Actually, I stayed at the Vernonia Inn, in Oregon, before my test flight.

Roberta
 
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