n5lp

n5lp

fugio ergo sum
I've had a few calls from the FAA. The reason I get these calls is that I like to go look at interesting stuff.

Our area has its share of wild fires and the qualify as interesting stuff. I have been criticized on this site for taking wild fire photos but I continue to do it and I enjoy it. The photos are appreciated by local fire officials and sometimes I get a call requesting me to check out something suspicious regarding fires or possible fires.

The first step for taking fire photos is to check the TFR. This morning I checked the TFR for the latest fire and it was a surprisingly small 10 NM diameter up through 9,000 feet. Fine, no problem.

I took off and started my climb to 10,000 MSL while waiting for the TFR depiction to come up on my Garmin 496. When it did come up, wham, it showed me well inside the TFR. Well I hightailed it out of there while continuing the climb. If I'm busted I'm busted, so might as well go ahead and get the pictures. I could not figure out how a 5 NM radius could have gone to a 25 NM radius TFR the short time between my check and me ending up inside the blasted thing.

When I got back on the ground I checked into it further. According to the depiction on the GPS it would not be legal to even operate out of the Carlsbad Airport.

It turns out the TFR had not changed; it was the depiction that was wrong. The image below shows the area of interest. See the larger circle with ticks on it that is centered on the TFR, that is what showed up as a TFR on the GPS. This is bad for several reasons. One is that it unnecessarily gives fairly innocent pilots heart palpitations. Another is that you can't see where the actual TFR is.

I hope this will not be how things work in the future. Does anyone know how this stuff ends up on my GPS and who is responsible for the inaccuracy?


TFR.jpg



Now my excuse to throw in a few of those fire photos.

DSC08535.jpg


DSC08530.jpg

DSC08514.jpg
 
I have had this happen too. I also recently had a fire TFR never show up on my 496. My 496 was actively receiving weather at the time.

This doesn't answer your question, but I can relate.

Guy
 
Larry,

TFR information goes from the FAA, to Jeppesen, to WxWorx, to XM, up to space, and down to your receiver. I just looked at the raw feed that comes from Jeppesen, and it shows that TFR AZ CNM 1/8507 has a type of "Fire" and is a circle of 25.0 nm radius centered on at N 32.233333 W 104.716667. So, your GPS is showing the TFR correctly in terms of the data that it's receiving.

There is also some text associated with this TFR, which unfortunately doesn't get broadcast over the air:

!FDC 1/8507 ZAB NM.. TFR, 25 SW CARLSBAD, NM APRIL 24, 2011
Pursuant TO 14 CFR Section 91.137(A)(2)
To provide a safe environment for firefighting aircraft operations

Effective immediately until further notice 1200-0500 UTC DLY

SFC- 9,000 MSL

Aircraft flight operations prohibited within 25 NMR OF 321400N/1044300W OR THE CARLSBAD /CNM/ VORTAC 255 DEGREE RADIAL AT 25.0 NAUTICAL MILES

SOUTHWEST COORDINATION CENTER TELEPHONE 505-842-3473 OR FREQ 135.850/LAST CHANCE FIRE, is in charge of the operation.

ALBUQUERQUE /ZAB/ ARTCC TELEPHONE 505-856-4580, is the FAA coordination facility.

******CAUTION: This TFR Overlay Display System (TODS) is updated Monday thru Friday 1100-0030 UTC and Saturday thru Sunday 1230-1930 UTC. CONFIRM DATA CURRENCY THROUGH ALTERNATE SOURCES AT OTHER TIMES. For interpretation of this TFR contact your local FSS.******
Click to expand...

fly safe,
mcb
 
mburch said:
... I just looked at the raw feed that comes from Jeppesen, and it shows that TFR AZ CNM 1/8507 has a type of "Fire" and is a circle of 25.0 nm radius centered on at N 32.233333 W 104.716667. So, your GPS is showing the TFR correctly in terms of the data that it's receiving.

There is also some text associated with this TFR, which unfortunately doesn't get broadcast over the air:



fly safe,
mcb
Click to expand...

Thank you Matt. It appears the problem is with Jeppesen then. The data in the raw feed is clearly wrong.

Here is the FAA Notam:

NOTAM : 1/8507

FDC 1/8507 ZAB NM.. FLIGHT RESTRICTIONS 25 SW CARLSBAD, NM. EFFECTIVE 1200-0500 UTC DLY UNTIL FURTHER NOTICE. PURSUANT TO 14 CFR SECTION 91.137(A)(2) TEMPORARY FLIGHT RESTRICTIONS ARE IN EFFECT WITHIN A 5 NAUTICAL MILE RADIUS OF 321400N/1044300W OR THE CARLSBAD /CNM/ VORTAC 255 DEGREE RADIAL AT 25.0 NAUTICAL MILES AT AND BELOW 9000 FEET MSL TO PROVIDE A SAFE ENVIRONMENT FOR FIRE FIGHTING. SOUTHWEST CORDINATION CENTER TELEPHONE 505-842-3473 OR FREQ 135.850/LAST CHANCE FIRE IS IN CHARGE OF THE OPERATION. ZAB IS THE FAA COORDINATION FACILITY.
 
Again today!

The fire the engendered the TFR I had all the trouble with is essentially out and is 100% contained so the plan today was to do aerial recon on what is left.

I very carefully got a briefing from Weathmeister and found there were no TFRs anywhere nearby, as expected. So once again I took off and was in the climb when bam, the Garmin showed me in the middle of a TFR. The depiction was showing a correct version of the latest TFR that had been in place. This time I didn't worry about it too much, inasmuch as I went again and took my pictures from inside the charted TFR, by I still was uneasy.

When I got on the ground I once again checked Weathermeister; no TFR, then I checked the FAA site; no TFR.

It is very disappointing to me to find that what was one of the big selling points of the Garmin x96 series is completely unreliable, to the point of being worthless.

I think Jeppesen/Garmin need to contact Dan to find out how to make this stuff work.
 
More problems

The TFR for our last nearby fire in Carlsbad Caverns National Park was cancelled yesterday. Today the TFR was still showing up during my recon flight. Kind of unnerving to be flying right in the middle of a displayed TFR.
 
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