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avengingangel

Well Known Member
i'm changing my 3 yr old odyssey pc680 I currently use to a full river battery. i will see it tomorrow but supposedly has the same dimensions in every way and has slightly more cca.
Just wondering if anyone has any experience with this company.
 
just noticed these batteries are made in china. you know i have the fancy pamphlet for these batteries in front of me. it's got a symbol on it that would make you think it was an american company. nope, made in china.

it's the bigger picture here than just changing a battery that concerns me.
 
No info on the batteries, but...

Nice logo they have. What about the red, white and blue logo with the eagle's head made you think they were made in America? :eek:
 
avengingangel said:
i'm changing my 3 yr old odyssey pc680 I currently use to a full river battery. i will see it tomorrow but supposedly has the same dimensions in every way and has slightly more cca.
Just wondering if anyone has any experience with this company.
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Your three year-old Odyssey is just entering the prime of its life--not unusual to get 6-7 years out of a PC-680. :)

I would take your battery over the new Chinese one any day.
 
Sam Buchanan said:
Your three year-old Odyssey is just entering the prime of its life--not unusual to get 6-7 years out of a PC-680. :)

I would take your battery over the new Chinese one any day.
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I would have hoped as well. After a year of worsening starts I put a load test on it yesterday and it showed 9 volts.

I'd rather take anything made in the states over chinese built too, that's why I'm questioning it. Actually in a quick search i couldn't nail down exactly where odyssey was made either. I'll have a better look now just for curiousity sake.:)
 
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From the Odyssey Battery website:

"ODYSSEY batteries are manufactured to strict quality standards in two facilities globally: Warrensburg, Missouri USA and Newport, Wales United Kingdom"​
 
avengingangel said:
I would have hoped as well. After a year of worsening starts I put a load test on it yesterday and it showed 9 volts.

I'd rather take anything made in the states over chinese built too, that's why I'm questioning it. Actually in a quick search i couldn't nail down exactly where odyssey was made either. I'll have a better look now just for curiousity sake.:)
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Be sure your charging system is up to spec and that you don't have a keep-alive circuit pulling it down all the time.
 
Sam Buchanan said:
Be sure your charging system is up to spec and that you don't have a keep-alive circuit pulling it down all the time.
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my alternator shows on my grand rapids to be producing 14.2 or 4.
i'm pretty sure my master turns everything off.
It wouldn't make sense for there to be a current draw when I think of it because whether the aircraft sat for a week or 6 weeks this winter it still seems to have had the same trouble, just never enough ummpf. Just always seemed weak. but it's certainly worse this spring then last.



.
 
Have you checked the battery voltage measuring directly on the battery terminals while cranking? If cranking is weak but battery voltage does *not* drop significantly, you might have a loose/corroded connection somewhere. It can be on the + side or the ground return side. I'm using a relatively cheap Asian battery on my O-320 (rated at 20AH, but same size as PC680), & I can almost taxi on the starter. Around $80 delivered when I bought it; I think that they may be cheaper now. I'll try to find the name/model if you want it.

(If shopping for an SLA battery, remember to check the cranking amps, not just the AH rating. Some SLA's are optimized for things like UPS's, where current demand is lower but longer than is required of a starting battery.)

Charlie
 
I have found that the Odyssey batteries like to be charged at around 14.5 volts. They seem to last longer and have much more "oomph" for starting.

Vic
 
avengingangel said:
I would have hoped as well. After a year of worsening starts I put a load test on it yesterday and it showed 9 volts.

I'd rather take anything made in the states over chinese built too, that's why I'm questioning it. Actually in a quick search i couldn't nail down exactly where odyssey was made either. I'll have a better look now just for curiousity sake.:)
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It would appear you have an electrical drain (parasite load) with the engine shut down. The Odyssey generally will hold a charge for months. I had a parasite load with the Subaru engine to keep the ECU memory alive and it would discharge the battery in 2 weeks.

I have not flown in six weeks (escape from midwest winter) and yesterday the battery voltage was 12.9. I hooked up the Odyssey charger just to make sure it was still fully charged and it was. No parasite load whatever with Lycoming.

A new battery will not cure this problem. I'd check the electric system thoroughly to see if something is powered with the master switch off. It could be a memory item or even an electric clock.
 
David-aviator said:
It would appear you have an electrical drain (parasite load) with the engine shut down. The Odyssey generally will hold a charge for months. I had a parasite load with the Subaru engine to keep the ECU memory alive and it would discharge the battery in 2 weeks.
I just cant agree with that. If there is a parasite load then the difference in starting will be tremendous after 1 day compared to 6 weeks. I'm not using an automobile engine either.

I have not flown in six weeks (escape from midwest winter) and yesterday the battery voltage was 12.9. I hooked up the Odyssey charger just to make sure it was still fully charged and it was. No parasite load whatever with Lycoming.
I would hope that the battery would still be strong after 6 weeks.
I've had lots of batteries over the years and they may show a full charge but when a load is placed on them, there junk. That's how I test a battery.


A new battery will not cure this problem. I'd check the electric system thoroughly to see if something is powered with the master switch off. It could be a memory item or even an electric clock.
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The point with my master is to shut the hole system down. Or at least any aircraft that I have owned. My clock turns off with the master. the grand rapids engine monitor has it's own memory. I certainly will check and triple check again.
i'm open to all advice here, but maybe I just have a poor battery. And i did notice it getting worse over the last year.
Also, I bought the bird a year ago so it being slow to grank over the compression stroke to me may have been the nature of the beast, but it would start easy except for hot. Which I contributed to a poor FI hot start procedure but maybe thats not the case.
But this spring it cant even make it above the compression stroke.

Hi Charlie- I just placed a load directly on the battery through a resistor and measured it which i think would basically be the same as you mentioned.
 
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I'm going to go into town and pick up this fullriver battery after i'm done working on my tractor here today, then i can play with the bird.

good points you have raised but i just cant put them together but i will double check all again.

I'll know right away when i push the button if it's the battery depending on how engine turns over. or in a weeks time when i return to it and it wont turn worth a shiit then i'll have to have a closer look, yes.

Now if it is the battery I'm more interested in why the battery dumped?

The new battery is 10 minutes away from me as is the bird, so I'm not ordering anything in and having to ship it back either, not a big hassle.

here goes.
 
avengingangel said:
I'm going to go into town and pick up this fullriver battery after i'm done working on my tractor here today, then i can play with the bird.

good points you have raised but i just cant put them together but i will double check all again.

I'll know right away when i push the button if it's the battery depending on how engine turns over. or in a weeks time when i return to it and it wont turn worth a shiit then i'll have to have a closer look, yes.

Now if it is the battery I'm more interested in why the battery dumped?

The new battery is 10 minutes away from me as is the bird, so I'm not ordering anything in and having to ship it back either, not a big hassle.

here goes.
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If the charging system is weak, it may take several weeks for the problem to reappear.

Before replacing the PC680, I would put a verified full charge on it and see how it cranks the plane. I know you really, really want this to be a battery problem :) but if it isn't you will be having this conversation again later.
 
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Sam Buchanan said:
If the charging system is weak, it may take several weeks for the problem to reappear.

Before replacing the PC680, I would put a verified full charge on it and see how it cranks the plane. I know you really, really want this to be a battery problem :) but if it isn't you will be having this conversation again later.
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for sure keep my fingers crossed.lol. I will put a good charge on it and then take a true reading.
If we have to go hunting (well I.lol)for a weak charging system that is going to get a bit more complicated.
i have that fullriver battery here in front of me. the lad said just take it with and if i dont want it just bring it back. he's a friend. looks impressive, actually I think it looks cooler than your odysseys,lol. yellow with gel insulation around the terminals not plastic eeew.lol. And with what resembles a red white and blue striped flag with an eagles head.....awesome made in the good ol usa. no fine print says made in china by some woojun guy.
I'm still a little amazed that when I removed the centre stack and starring back at me was this motorcycle battery, what the. this thing starts this 540 engine, wow. I figured i'd be looking at what i thought resembled a standard battery. I guess I gotta get with the times.
 
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Ok, so i pulled the odyssey battery. i really like the way the builder of this bird has done certain things. Pulling the battery in my 4 and rocket are night and day. Just simple things such as placement of battery and service. I guess after you build 5 or 6 rv's you can say, hey this would for easier access if i built it this way.
Anyway i put the odyssey on charge mean while tried fitting the fullriver in but slightly different in fit.(top of casing). No problem, i returned the battery.

Alright my pc680 shows full charge now, 12.5+volts. When i apply a load it shows 10 volts and holds, which makes me think now that the battery is ok. ?

I'm going to put the battery back in this morning and see how the engine cranks.
if it cranks more proper then yes it certainly could be a weak charging system or parasite load somewhere.
I will be very interested in seeing how it cranks.

however if it doesn't crank worth a **** then? test the starter and see how many amps its drawing and,, well i guess we'll wait and find out. step by step.

some info.. io 540 aerosport, 1 lightspeed 1 mag, Ls starter.
 
You may have thought about this already, but do check your ground cable from the engine to the firewall. Over time these can corrode if not properly protected and affect starting.

Vic
 
hi Vic, yes I have looked at my ground, it looks ok, however i will pay more attention to it on my return. The aircraft is about 5 yrs old and always been in a high and dry hanger but good reminder.

well I went to the airport with charged odyssey battery in hand. I decided to swing in to my on airport air support service, friends of mine. Thought i would get another opinion because the local aircraft guru had returned from snf. Maybe thought he could check the battery too.
So i walked in with battery in hand and he kind of gave me a look like, ok, theres half the battery wheres the rest.
Now granted the man can rebuild a beaver from the ground up but he is like me and unfamiliar with this new tech in batteries, because like I said earlier i couldn't believe it when i saw a motorcycle battery stairing back at me,lol.


I then decided that even though the fullriver battery I had, had a top bracket compatibility problem I thought why not grab it again and just put it in temporarily to test the speed of crank with what I know because it was tested in front of me and it's a new battery.

on the way down to pick up this battery I ran into a friend who builds and flys. I had the odyssey pc680 beside me in the passenger seat. I asked him what do you know about these batteries. he said there great. He uses, i think he said a 925. he said, that there pointing at my 680, "that's for a rotax engine". He said, a 1200 or better yet 2 of those,(680) is what I needed.

So, i returned with the fullriver battery hooked it up and hit the start button. And first roll i didn't make it over the compression start, but second try it barely made it,,,lol. Same as my odyssey starts basically. My odyssey battery is fine.

I've already survived 2 weak start enduced kickbacks unscaved, i may not be so lucky with a third. So i have to solve this now. I'm lucky it didn't light off on one of my hot starts last year just at the perfect wrong time. Anyway if the aircraft needs a bigger battery there should be no messing around, especially just to save a little wait.

So, for these reasons i will have a better inspection of my main ground, would i be losing amperage on the way to my start, maybe wire size?? maybe my starter is no good, like i said earlier i guess test the amperage it's drawing in a non bench test. maybe it's not pulling enough, so then there is an issue with draw. trying to suck an egg through a straw. Or maybe just a big enough battery. Also, when i say it had got worse in the last year, it ain't no night and day difference. Make no mistake it was slow then. Does it matter if the piece of shiitt put in your hand is fresh or old comparison
The starter is the LS, sounds good. it's only 3 or 4 years old. maybe only 100 hrs on it.

Ok, what do you guys think and what would you do next. Sam, Vic, anyone.

Also, it would probably help if anyone that has a similiar set up to mine chimed in. Basically 540, what starter, what battery? How does it crank?

thanks all.
 
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Be careful when doing this, but I would put a voltmeter right at the starter connection and see what you get when you are cranking. That will eliminate the ground and the battery if it is above 10 volts. If it is above 10 volts, then potentially you have a starter problem. If you have mags, just go ahead and put a small jumper cable on them and connect it to ground so it won't start. If you have electronic ignition, then pull the circuit breaker. It would be good to see what voltage the starter is seeing after it jumps the compression stroke as well.
You might also check the starter solenoid. Check the voltage on both sides of it when you are cranking to make sure it is not the culprit. It's a lot cheaper than a starter.

Vic
 
I recently replaced the aging Odyssey PC 680 in my 9A with a Fullriver HC 20 (the Fullriver is cheaper here in Australia).

The Fullriver is pretty much a direct replacement and installation into the standard Vans firewall battery box was straight forward. There are a couple of minor issues though.

The Fullriver had a small amount of sticky stuff on the case that I had to remove before it would slide into the battery box.

The Fullriver may be a tiny bit taller than the Odyssey. I stacked a thin washer with the spacer on the hold-down bolt on each side to raise the hold-down bar slightly.

The terminals on the Fullriver are more recessed and closer to the side of the battery (closer to the firewall). This gives more clearance between the positive terminal and the hold-down bar minimizing the chance of a short but does put the positive terminal closer to the firewall. There is still adequate clearance and I have a rubber boot over the terminal but I think I will glue a small plastic strip on the firewall adjacent to the positive terminal just to be sure.

On paper the Odyssey and the Fullriver are the same weight at 15.4 lb. However when I weighed them with my basic spring scale the Fullriver was about 1/2 lb heavier. Maybe batteries are the opposite to people and lose weight with age :)

Fin
9A
 
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update

well, the weather hasn't been that great here lately so I've been in no rush to look at this problem but with the first nice weekend we've had since the last time I flew 3 weeks ago i figured better finish this.
Ok, borrowed a meter from a friend today.
good battery showing 12.4 volts.
battery mounted under my radio stack console.
grounds are good, engine to firewall bolt firewall to battery and a ground going fron the engine to engine mount, all good size connectors.
looks like the starter is drawing around 500 amps. I believe it's an lsx and should pull something like 160- 2 something. i will check it.
After about 4 or 5 seconds of very slow cranking I checked for heat at the grounds and the wire, all seemed fine. Except for the connection between the plunger bolt and the starter, well motor itself. it was hot.
So, I pulled the starter and my ame up here wants to take a look at it.
 
i took the starter apart yesterday. it has a number of problems with it that I noticed. Needs a rebuild.

Anyway, thanks for the input all.
 
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