[Jeff R]

Like maybe a few of you, I am rushing to get in a kit order by Thursday before the prices go up. In my case, I will be ordering the finishing kit. It is really a bit early for me to be ordering it, as I am just now working on the riveting the lower floor of the center fuselage of my RV-9A, but with the interest rate being so low, I will certainly save some money by ordering now, even though I don?t really have the storage space.

Anyway, to order the finishing kit, you have to tell Van?s some information about the engine you are going to use. Well, I haven?t really decided on an engine yet. I was speaking to one of the Van?s engineers and he was highly recommending their standard O-320 configuration. I was asking about fuel injection and he said if I did that (and he questioned why I would want the added complexity of it and with it being harder to do self-maintenance on) would require a larger engine cowl. I mentioned an idea of using a low compression O-360 and he dismissed it, saying it was less fuel-efficient than a higher compression engine, and that with alcohol in auto fuels now, the risk wasn?t worth having the capability to use mogas.

Still, I hate to make a decision now that will limit my future options. My current thinking is to follow Van?s advice and use a 0-320 with a carb but with electronic ignition, though I would still like to keep open the option of using a -360, and to keep the option of fuel injection with either engine.

I have rambled a bit, which demonstrates my level of uncertainty. But, does anyone have any thoughts on this subject? If I get a cowl for a fuel injection engine, won?t it work fine if I go with a carb? When I order, can I tell Van?s I will use an IO-360, vertical induction, parallel valve, Dynafocal I, Fuel Injected Lycoming? Will this choice maximize my future options without preventing me from using any standard ?320 or ?360 engine?

Thanks for any suggestions or insights.

 

[airguy]

Keep in mind as well that the Van's guys (God love 'em, but....) are absolutely NOT going to recommend or give advice for anything other than bare-bone stock as on the plans. They have no idea of what level of mechanical expertise any particular builder is capable of, so they will always default to the lowest common denominator - which means bare-bones stock simple with no frills and no changes - and for heaven's sake no extra power above the design limits.

I'm personally already set on my engine choices, first choice will be a DeltaHawk turbodiesel assuming they are a viable candidate when I am ready for an engine. Second choice (and looking more likely every day) will be a Superior XPIO360. Yes, I know that's more power than Van's recommends, and it means I'll get cancer and all my babies will be born naked and my airplanes wings will fall off as soon as the crate arrives at my shop. Extra power does not automatically mean structural failure - it simply means the limiting factor in aircraft speed is now the pilot, instead of aerodynamic drag. Remember the first rule of aviation - "Don't do anything stupid." The Superior engine will run fine on Mogas with 8.7:1 compression pistons, so you're not limited on fuel options.

My engine choice (either one) is also fuel-injected (again with the cancer, but this time my dog is going to run away and the transmission in my truck is going to die). Fuel injection gives you a large fuel-efficiency gain and allows deep-LOP operations with a properly balanced set of injectors and engine monitoring system. Yes, it's higher workload and more technically advanced and there's a greater possibility of doing damage to the engine if you don't know what you're doing - but that's the PILOTS responsibility and the design should be tailored to your abilities. Van's will automatically default to the lowest common denominator, meaning a pilot who is just barely able to keep the greasy side down. If a pilot is not capable of monitoring an engine in flight, then by all means go bare stock simple O-320. If a pilot is comfortable operating the equipment he installs in the aircraft in a proper manner (including airspeed control with a larger engine) then by all means - install the equipment you want.

On top of the engine choices, I'm also going to put an IFR panel in the plane (cancer, dead dog, dead truck, tree falls on my house and I lose the winning lotto ticket in the ensuring fire) because I'm quite comfortable in that environment, I intend to use the aircraft for a lot of XC travel, and I simply can't conceive of having an aircraft for personal use (especially one I BUILT for my own use) that was not configured specifically FOR my use.

Bottom line - build what you're comfortable flying.

 

[Mel]

If you're not ready, DON'T DO IT!

Jeff,
Please don't rush decisions to save a little coin. The price increase is a very small amount compared to what you are investing in this airplane. Wait until you've had time to make the right decision.
BTW, Van's advice is almost always right on. He knows his designs better than anyone else.

 

[DevDad]

Jeff,
Please don't rush decisions to save a little coin. The price increase is a very small amount compared to what you are investing in this airplane. Wait until you've had time to make the right decision.
BTW, Van's advice is almost always right on. He knows his designs better than anyone else.

Bingo. When the price increase date was announced, I filled out my order form, and then ended up sleeping on it, and was glad I did. In your case, I don't think it makes sense to send an order in prematurely to save $180. In the event that you change your mind on engine, it will cost you much more than $180 to swap out the applicable components.

$0.02 Doesn't Get Me Very Far,
Mike

 

[Fearless]

I'm holding off my self

I know what engine I intend to use and would like to order now also because I'm getting ready to rivet the front skins on in the next few weeks. So I will need the finishing kit probably by May but the increase will amount to around $300 more. I'll be in better financial shape later in the year where the $300 will not make that much of a difference. I've already spent that this year in replacement parts for my screw ups. Although I have my engine core I still haven't decided what prop I want to use so I need to hold off on the order until I am firm on that - Sensenich or Catto?

I agree with Mel that it would probably be more prudent to hold off if you haven't decided exactly what you want to do.

 

[mike109g6]

Like maybe a few of you, I am rushing to get in a kit order by Thursday before the prices go up. In my case, I will be ordering the finishing kit. It is really a bit early for me to be ordering it, as I am just now working on the riveting the lower floor of the center fuselage of my RV-9A, but with the interest rate being so low, I will certainly save some money by ordering now, even though I don?t really have the storage space.

Anyway, to order the finishing kit, you have to tell Van?s some information about the engine you are going to use. Well, I haven?t really decided on an engine yet. I was speaking to one of the Van?s engineers and he was highly recommending their standard O-320 configuration. I was asking about fuel injection and he said if I did that (and he questioned why I would want the added complexity of it and with it being harder to do self-maintenance on) would require a larger engine cowl. I mentioned an idea of using a low compression O-360 and he dismissed it, saying it was less fuel-efficient than a higher compression engine, and that with alcohol in auto fuels now, the risk wasn?t worth having the capability to use mogas.

Still, I hate to make a decision now that will limit my future options. My current thinking is to follow Van?s advice and use a 0-320 with a carb but with electronic ignition, though I would still like to keep open the option of using a -360, and to keep the option of fuel injection with either engine.

I have rambled a bit, which demonstrates my level of uncertainty. But, does anyone have any thoughts on this subject? If I get a cowl for a fuel injection engine, won?t it work fine if I go with a carb? When I order, can I tell Van?s I will use an IO-360, vertical induction, parallel valve, Dynafocal I, Fuel Injected Lycoming? Will this choice maximize my future options without preventing me from using any standard ?320 or ?360 engine?

Thanks for any suggestions or insights.

Jeff,
I don't know how you're building has been going-ie how long it has taken you to get where you are now in construction, but on my 9A it seems that the more I build, the more that there is to do. It sounds like space is an issue for you more than money. You still have a lot to build before the finish kit. Instrument panel, wiring, etc, etc. You are going to be very surprised at the amount of time that it takes to do these things, just like how much longer it takes to do the fuse vs the wings/empenage. On your engine selection, before you order your finish kit be absoluetly sure which engine you are going with. Once ordered you are REALLY COMMITTED to that engine. Very hard to change out cowls. Shipping is the issue here. Also you are totally committed to the engine mount as well, which in turn commits you to your nose leg, match drilled to engine mount. I made the mistake of ordering my finish kit too soon. It's been sitting in my hanger for almost a year now, untouched, until I put the canopy on just recently. Really think your engine selection through until you are completely happy with it. You really don't need your finish kit until you have your engine on site, or at least in transit.
Mike H 9A/8A

 

[skyfrog]

Past Price Increase

Jeff,

I checked an archived Van's website from Feb 2006, and the price change to today's prices are as follows:

Emp +$ 45
Wings +$165
Fuse +$150
Finish +$ 90

For $90, I would wait until I was ready to buy. But that's not to say the price increase might be higher. Also, who knows what mods might be made to the finish kit by that time.

I'm probably going with a 150 HP ECI kit with fuel injection.

 

[skyfrog]

He's Quick

Jeff,
I don't know how you're building has been going-ie how long it has taken you to get where you are now in construction

Jeff bought his empennage kit after I did. He's now on the fuselage with wings done, and I'm still on the rudder. At that rate, I'm sure he will be ready for the finish kit by summer. Go Jeff!!