M

mlwynn

Well Known Member
I am about to close my wings and am going to have my local EAA counselor have a look before I do so. It was never clear to me if I should offer to pay him or what is considered proper etiquette. You tech folks put a lot of time and effort into keeping newbies like myself out of trouble--and don't think we don't really appreciate it.

He has been out to my project once before, early in the empennage phase. He didn't do any sort of formal paperwork. Is there a form or something they do to document their visits and my progress?

Thanks,

Michael Wynn
RV 8 Wings (just about done with them!)
 
There is a form that the TC fills out, and you should get a copy. Your DAR may want to see these forms at inspection time as proof of in-progress inspections.

As for paying a TC- the TC program is strictly voluntary. TCs are permitted to charge for travel expenses, and I've had a few buy me lunch afterwords, but there is no fee for a TC inspection.
 
sprucemoose said:
There is a form that the TC fills out, and you should get a copy. Your DAR may want to see these forms at inspection time as proof of in-progress inspections.
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Really? I've had an A&P look at my plane but he's not a tech counselor and I certainly haven't gotten any kind of form. My wings are already closed, too. A tech counselor inspection isn't mandatory, right?
 
ChiefPilot said:
Really? I've had an A&P look at my plane but he's not a tech counselor and I certainly haven't gotten any kind of form. My wings are already closed, too. A tech counselor inspection isn't mandatory, right?
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A TC visit is not mandatory but all the DARs like myself highly recommend them. As a DAR, I feel much better when the builder has a stack of EAA TC forms when I come out to do the Airworthiness Inspection.
 
Everything said before is true. Technical counselors are volunteers. We appreciate offers of gas money and maybe a "cheap" lunch once in a while but it is not necessary. A minimum of 3 TC inspections is recommended, but as a DAR, I like to see evidence of at least 5. Again these are not mandatory, but when we come out for the airworthiness inspection, we get a "warm fuzzy" feeling if the builder has had other "experienced" eyes on the project.
 
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I would like to ask another Tech Counselor question. At what points in the construction should we ask someone to come out and take a peek?
 
Normally the first inspection shoulf be as soon as you start construction. This will give the TC an idea of your building technique and make sure that you are not developing bad habits right off. After the first inspection he will probably suggest when the next one should be. If he sees that you need more guidance, he may suggest more frequent inspections. As a rule of thumb, inspections should be before closing up major assemblies. Another point, if you have access to more than one TC, try to alternate them. Different eyes see different things.
 
Good point Sam. I do this also but failed to mention it. We get far too few calls as flight advisors. People that do call think we can do it in a few minutes over the phone. When they find out that it takes a face to face interview requiring some dedicated time, they don't call back.
 
Just to add to the above comments, it seems that quite a few builders wait to get a TC inspection until they have completed the tail and are well into the wings and fuselage. In some cases, construction is very good, but in others, they would have definitely benefitted form advice in construction techniques.
My recommendation is that first time builders contact a TC before they actually begin any construction at all. A TC can be instrumental in getting a project off to a good start in everything from selecting the proper tools and setting up the shop to identifying a method to get some hands on experience. The TCs will know of local builders who might be willing to receive a visitor who would be willing to let them help and learn. For those who can not attend one of the professionally offered builder's workshop, this would be the next best thing.
As for me, on a TC inspection visit, I may choose to actually help on a portion of the project or instruct someone in the use of their tools; however, the main purpose of the TC visit is to inspect for safety issues. EAA points out that there is a fine line between being a TC and a fellow builder.
As anyone who has gone to a flyin to look at RVs knows, there is quite a difference in the standards that builders build to. Some build to show plane tolerances, while others build to fly. As long as the construction is safe, and the builder is satisfied, I am supportive, but always willing to offer tips to make things easier/better, if I can. I believe it is the TC's role to find out what the builder wants and help him get there while building a safe and reliable aircraft.
 
SmittysRV said:
At what points in the construction should we ask someone to come out and take a peek?
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I think that the ideal time for a first visit is when the HS skeleton is together and you're ready to rivet the skin on. I do like SF3543s idea of getting a TC visit prior to starting, but that is not really an inspection.

Besides having a TC (or more than one) look over the project, have other builders look it over. In fact, never pass on a chance to have another set of eyes look at your work.
 
Mel said:
Everything said before is true. Technical counselors are volunteers. We appreciate offers of gas money and maybe a "cheap" lunch once in a while but it is not necessary. A minimum of 3 TC inspections is recommended, but as a DAR, I like to see evidence of at least 5. Again these are not mandatory, but when we come out for the airworthiness inspection, we get a "warm fuzzy" feeling if the builder has had other "experienced" eyes on the project.
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Wow! That's good info. I had not even considered bothering a tech counselor and didn't realize you guys (DARs) put that much emphasis on them. I figured they were for the less mechanically inclined builder and for those who really don't know anything about stresses and loads etc. Plus, I figured they were probably spread pretty thinly.
I've always been more critical of my own work quality than I believe a TC would have been and I am quite comfortable deciding when some 'marginal' work quality should be upgraded for safety sake or simply for appearance.
After this discussion, I will be employing a TC to help the DAR be more comfortable that my construction is satisfactory throughout.
This was a good and helpful thread for me.

-mike
 
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