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doctornigel

Active Member
I have seen all the great ways that some of you have documented your build on line, thanks to all the effort you have put in. However, I am not very motivated to do an online log, in fact my record keeping is real poor. Is this going to be a problem? I have pics of me building the plane, and my instruction book has lots of wear. Is there a minimum amount required? I am 2 months into the build, I have to spend my time documenting when I can use it to polish.:D Info is appreciated, thanks, Nigel
 
Build Documentation

All I did was take lots of pictures and put them on my laptop computer. When friends or family came out they would sometime take pictures of me in the building process. When the DAR came out for the inspection we talked about the build process being so much fun but he didn't even ask about a builders log and I was prepared to have him scroll through the picture on my laptop.

I also made a complete copy of my builder's plans that stayed at the office untouched and my working copy I check off each build item and made notes on the plans as needed.
 
Paper...

Nigel,

'Back in the day' when I built my RV-6 I used a clipboard, several sheets of lined paper and the occasional photograph in a 3-ring binder. More than enough.

Most entries were similar to this (sometimes less):

2/7/01 1.2hrs Left wing





b,
dr
 
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the FAA Inspector i used for two RV types wanted picts of me working on it and he preferred Calendars. So, each day or two I just made some entries in the daily squares.
 
My record keeping is really poor also. I have a builders log that has big gaps in entries, I also have a calendar that I've marked up with mile stones. But I have a real good set of pictures and all of the important receipts. Those last two things from what I've been able to glean from the FAA docs I've read are the two most important things to have.
 
Just a quick comment; why does everyone seem to put so much emphasis on pictures of you building? When I've looked at photos of obviously "hired help" built planes, they always have a bunch of staged photos with the guy holding a rivet gun or wrench next to the plane. These photos are so easy to stage, I think they are worthless. Looking at some scribbled notes and a 5 minute talk with the builder will reveal whether you built the plane or not. You just can't fake the knowledge of the project you acquire during the build process.
 
sadams said:
Just a quick comment; why does everyone seem to put so much emphasis on pictures of you building? When I've looked at photos of obviously "hired help" built planes, they always have a bunch of staged photos with the guy holding a rivet gun or wrench next to the plane. These photos are so easy to stage, I think they are worthless. Looking at some scribbled notes and a 5 minute talk with the builder will reveal whether you built the plane or not. You just can't fake the knowledge of the project you acquire during the build process.
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Pictures are required by the FAA.
The builder's log serves 2 purposes. To convince the DAR that the aircraft is amateur-built and to show the FAA that YOU built it. Yes, they can all be "faked". But, the DAR can tell if you built the aircraft after talking with you for just a few minutes. The other requirement is to show the FAA that you qualify for the repairman's certificate.
When I do an inspection, I issue a "letter of recommendation" to the FAA for purposes of the repairman certificate application. So far, I've had no problems. The FAA guys seem to like the idea. It gives them a "warm fuzzy" feeling to have someone else's signature on the application.
 
Mel said:
Pictures are required by the FAA.
The builder's log serves 2 purposes. To convince the DAR that the aircraft is amateur-built and to show the FAA that YOU built it. Yes, they can all be "faked". But, the DAR can tell if you built the aircraft after talking with you for just a few minutes. The other requirement is to show the FAA that you qualify for the repairman's certificate.
When I do an inspection, I issue a "letter of recommendation" to the FAA for purposes of the repairman certificate application. So far, I've had no problems. The FAA guys seem to like the idea. It gives them a "warm fuzzy" feeling to have someone else's signature on the application.
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I was refering more specifically to photos that feature the builder actually working on the plane. I have an extensive photo builders log, but other than my hand or foot occasionally in the shot, I'm not in any of them. I'm not a DAR, but of all the documentation you could have to prove you built the plane, I would think a few random photos of a builder standing there with a tool in his hand would have to be the least useful. It's not a big deal, I just always thought that the importance of these photos is a little overblown.
 
I agree.

sadams said:
It's not a big deal, I just always thought that the importance of these photos is a little overblown.
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Most of the time if there are build pictures being taken, I am taking them so it is difficult for me to be in them. I hate posed pictures of myself but I have my wife take pictures of me building from time to time. I have hundreds of build pictures, I'm probably in less than 1% of them but I'll make sure to grab all of these when it comes time to get my inspection.
 
Mel said:
the DAR can tell if you built the aircraft after talking with you for just a few minutes.
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Ain't that the truth. There's been a few times I've walked away from a plane and "builder" at a fly-in and said "that guy didn't build that plane".

I figure I can always use the blood vs. scars technique to prove I built it: "see that blood, that resulted in this scar." I'm sure CSI could match them up.
 
fl-mike said:
Ain't that the truth. There's been a few times I've walked away from a plane and "builder" at a fly-in and said "that guy didn't build that plane".

I figure I can always use the blood vs. scars technique to prove I built it: "see that blood, that resulted in this scar." I'm sure CSI could match them up.
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You've hit upon the real test. Just look at the vertical stab and point out the "dent". A real builder will give all kinds of excuses but a non-builder would go "I haven't notice that."
John
 
One thing for me is I'm pretty much the lone ranger when it comes to building so having someone there to take pictures really doesn't happen. I do have a tri pod and a camera with a timer and a remote shutter button so I use that. Going back in the history of my build I've noticed that I've changed some in my few years of building. I've even got a few of me somewhere back in the day I wore a mohawk. Seasonally my cloths change from winter dress to summer dress and so on.
 
I initialed and dated each step in the plans as completed. Worked for the DAR and the FAA guy that was following him around when he was doing the inspection.

Mark
RV-10/N410MR
 
I've had many pics taken with me in the picture, ya some of them I said to my wife, grab the camera I need some pics and grabbed the gun and posed for a pic. Ya, there are always people that cheat on things, paperwork, pictures, whatever to say they built or did something. But I'm sure that is just a small number. We can't be worried about what these people are doing, for they are just hurting themselves. I keep telling my wife when she points out a cheater, I don't care what he is doing, as long as I know who he is, then I can stay far away from him. As far as the faa, well they don't care what you are doing, how you did it, or how great you do it, AS LONG AS THE PAPERWORK IS RIGHT. So those pics are very important to have.
 
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