L

leaker311

Active Member
I was wondering what y'alls techniques are for entering class D for landing (vfr).

I was always told to talk to approach an X number of miles out, tell them who, where, what etc. They (approach) tell you to remain vfr and proceed and upon reporting the field in sight they switch you over to tower for landing. simple.

The field that I am flying out of now is class D with tower and approach; however, this approach is controlling traffic to a large international airport (class C) plus two class D airfields, as a "side task", in other words they are sometimes extremely busy and it is impossible to get a word in as a small vfr experimental on the bottom of the food chain.

Long story short, during my last flight I was put-putting vfr, and on return avoided talking to approach altogether (tried for 5 minutes) and switched straight to tower for landing. That worked amazingly well, tower was not busy at all, got the "report right base" and was on the ground a minute later.
I was wondering if this is an acceptable technique/procedure or is this frowned upon? In this case approach is always super busy while tower is not, so I guess I am doing everyone a favor, but I don't know enough to decide that.

Thanks a lot in advance!

Marco
 
The typical advantage to calling approach first before entering a class D is sequencing. Approach will put you in trail with any other arriving traffic (vfr or IFR).

Having said that, there is no reason you can't go directly to tower for entry into the Delta. If they cannot accept you because of a busy arrival push, they will instruct you to call approach for sequence (or some other sort of instruction) Keep in mind that I'm strictly talking about a class D and NOT B or C.
 
You did just fine, you contacted the controlling authority before entering their class D as is required, they cleared you to proceed and report base, you did, then they cleared you to land, you did, sounds acceptable to me.

In the North West KEUG, Eugene OR is the only class D I have ever had complain that I did not contact their Cascade approach before contacting the tower, I had done this several times in the recent past before they complained, I believe I was still perfectly legal but after on the ground and parked they said ?they would prefer we contact Cascade approach first?.
 
Question

Is your class D within the class C? Normally, of course, entering a class D just requires contact with the tower before entering the air space (I usually make initial contact 10 miles out). If the class D is within the class C, I imagine you would have to contact approach (20 miles out) before entering. If I recall correctly, all you have to do is establish 2 way communication. If they acknowledge your call then that constitutes 2 way communication - no need for further approvals to enter the class C (unlike class B). In this case you could establish 2 way comm, enter the class C, then contact the tower of the class D. Just my 2 cents - I'm sure there's a published procedure somewhere - just ask the tower at your field.
 
Last edited:
Airspace

Marco -

It depends what class of airspace you are operating within while approaching the class D. If you are in class G or E and VFR you have no communication requirements whatsoever. You need two-way comms with tower to enter their airspace and therefore need to talk to them prior to entry.
 
You acted properly!

What you did was correct. In the future IMHO I would make two calls to approach. If they if they are to busy to handle you or they dont reply then go over to tower and proceed without approach. After you are talking to twr you might mention that you tried approach but were unable to get handling.
 
good flexibility

Sounds like you know how to work the system and evaluate which of your options to use under differing circumstances. I think you made a good decision with a good outcome and that normally speaking with approach first is helpful when they're not swamped. I would say that your preferences seem to mirror mine. That said, I know there are pilots who go out of their way to avoid talking on the radio unless they're absolutely required to. They prefer listening to music, talking on air-to-air or just taking in the scenery and reveling in our freedoms...different strokes...

All best

Jeremy Constant
 
It sounds like you are planning for the future procedure to this specific airport

I never call approach going into a stand alone (you do not have to pass through a higher level airspace to get there) class D airport which this one obviously is since you did it. You really do have to know what your requirements are for each airport you go into as well as the air space requirements to protect yourself from violations and unnecessary procedures.

I flew for many years in the Los Angeles area in Cherokee 04L twice a day between Santa Ana/Orange County/John Wayne (SNA Class C) and El Monte (EMT Class D) under the Los Angeles Class B. The only time I ever called SoCAL approach going into El Monte was when it was IFR but returning to SNA I had the DME set for the on airport facility and had an escape plan to turn to Seal Beach if I could not establish two-way communication before penetrating the Class C outer ring. At one point the Long Beach airport was trying to get a Class C designation which would have cut off my escape route - I wrote my comment letter stating the facts of daily commuting in that area - I don't know the reason but I was glad they never got a Class C designation.

A recent post on another subject makes me wonder if pilots are not looking at the the "big picture" on fixed scale macro view sectional charts anymore to develop a comprehensive view when planning flights. There is real value in that practice.

Bob Axsom
 
Last edited:
I fly out of KAPA, which I believe is still the 2nd or 3rd busiest noncommercial field in the country and is class D. Lots of trainers mixed with lots of bis jets. It is overlayed by KDEN class B airspace. The tower's preferred procedure is for you to get ATIS, then make first contact with the tower when 10 miles out. It can get crazy busy sometimes, but in 20 years I have never had them ask me to contact approach.

Bust the floor of the class B and they will be all over you in a flash; otherwise they are very accommodating.

Jim Berry
RV-10
 
N15JB said:
The tower's preferred procedure is for you to get ATIS, then make first contact with the tower when 10 miles out. It can get crazy busy sometimes, but in 20 years I have never had them ask me to contact approach.
Click to expand...

Ditto for KPDK (Peachtree-Dekalb - reliever airport for KATL). Very simple...call tower 10 miles out. When departing, call ground and they'll put you on the tower after the run up (and expect a freq. change 5-10 miles after departure)
 
Yeah, I'm based at a class D (KLZU) as well and never call approach when inbound.

When I *will* call approach control is when the class D airspace is located beneath or very close to class C, at which point I will call up Approach in accordance with the 20 mile radius instructions on sectionals.
 
As others have said, there is no legal requirement to call approach first as long as you're in class E or G airspace and call the tower prior to entering D.
BTW this same rule applies if you are in class E above the airport (typically >2500' AGL) but in my experience the towers don't like this so much.

Here in the SFO east bay it's very common for pilots to go to HAF (on the coast, west of SFO) via LVK (call and transition thru D), HWD (call and transition thru D), stay below the class B floor (1500'), San Carlos (call and transition thru D), and finally up and over the hill to HAF. Personally I usually call approach first to see if I can go thru B but half the time they say "unable".

One small thing: take a look at the instrument approach procedures to this airport. It's probably best to avoid them. e.g., if there's an ILS then don't do a straight in approach. The reason is there may be IFR traffic on the ILS but talking to approach, while you're talking to the tower. Approach and tower don't always have their act coordinated, so there is an increased risk of over-running or being over-run. If approach sees you on radar and you're too close they'll make the ifr guy circle back and start over, if he can't maintain visual separation. You've done nothing illegal, just best to be as considerate as possible, IMHO.
 
Good Job

You did just fine, where I fly in SoCal I would say your procedure is the norm. I frequently fly in, out, through and over class delta at KMYF, KCRQ, KSEE, etc. Talking to tower, not approach. If going there to land you want to get their current ATIS first, then, as you did, call up with who, what, where, etc. It's helpful to announce position relative to airport, or VFR reporting point, or even a common reporting point used particularily by that facility (which you would only gain knowledge of by experience there or talking to a controller). Other than class Charlie and Bravo I think the only time I call approach/departure controlin SoCal is when IFR or getting VFR flight following.

Example, I did this yesterday...

Palomar tower, Cessna 372TA, 8 miles South over the Del Mar race track, inbound for landing with Lima.

Re: Cessna 372TA, Ident, enter left traffic for 24.......



Derek
RV-9A #92103
Empennage complete
Wings on the way
 
I think you did the right thing.

Local example: KADS is Class D, bounded by Class B to the west and above. Some singles, king airs, and a lot of bizjets. If they're not busy, you can call the tower directly, but that's a little frowned upon. However, if ADS is busy and you don't call approach, you will be told to remain clear of the Class D and go call approach.

I remember well some Bonanza pilot on a busy Sunday afternoon who was trying to call approach. Unfortunately, he didn't have very good radio presence and was slow. Approach never recognized him when calling (always someone else). So he called the tower and was only sort of politely told to call approach. Never heard what happened to him, maybe he is still calling approach? :D

TODR
 
I fly out of IXD in New Century, KS, a suburb of Kansas City. It is outside of KC's Class B airspace, so I typically just go straight to tower. MKC is the Wheeler/Downtown airport, and I can get to it just under Class B from the south. Depends on where I'm coming from whether I contact approach or not when in/out of MKC. Usually if I don't have to enter Class B I don't contact approach.

Years ago when stationed at Eglin AFB, FL, and when flying GA aircraft in/out of Eglin and Destin, we ALWAYS contacted approach, but that's a little different type of airspace with lots of Restricted areas.

You'll never go wrong trying to contact approach, but depending on the type of airspace being entered, you don't have to.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.