[digidocs]

I'm curious if anyone has experience with the Civil Air Patrol that they'd be willing to share. What is the organization like and how much time is required? I'd be joining as a "senior member" rather than as a cadet.

Of course I'd have to fly an RV to the meetings
-DC

 

[SebsRV7A]

CAP

I was AF Reserve Liaison to CAP for 4 years. Great outfit, and amazing what they get done with an all-volunteer force. There's Senior and cadet and composite squadrons. Some have aircraft, others don't. In Houston, there are probably several squadrons. In my experience in Sacramento area, there are different personalities and focus between the squadrons. I enjoyed working with cadets, though many prefer to just work with senior members. When my schedule allows, I'm probably going to look for a composite squadron so I can do some mission flying as well as interact with cadets.
It can be a lot of time, depending on how deeply involved you want to get. Like most volunteer organizations, 5% of the people do 90% of the work.
It seems like a very rewarding service. I'd recommend visiting several squadrons ( especially if you can fly the RV there!!) and get a flavor for each.

Sebastian Trost
RV-7A 350 hours
Henderson, NV

 

[lancef53]

I am kinda involved in the squadron here. It takes a lot of time to get all of the required schooling and test done, and many of them seem to be pointless if you are just looking to help out, not become deeply involved or become an incident commander. You need to get 100-700 ICS/NIMS training just to be an active member, and them get trained to do any of the tasks that they have.

10% of the people do most of the stuff, and just let the other members in if they are getting tired of whatever project they are on. They have lots of different currency rules, and lots and lots of paperwork.

 

[RV7Ron]

Great organization...

...but lots of work to get trained and lots and lots of paperwork (it is the govt after all). And from what I can tell, it is ongoing and never ending. I joined just before I started my empennage, thinking naively that I could get all of my initial training done before starting the project. Didnt happen...not even close, now I am partially CAP trained, but dont participate much because I am not qualified for missions and I would rather build my plane than sit in hours and hours of classes.

Ok, now that I have @#$%-ed enough. It is a great organization, hats off to the guys/gals that have the time and dedicate themselves to it. I absolutely support their mission...just dont have the time for it right now.

 

[Nomex Maximus]

You HAD to ask...

I'm curious if anyone has experience with the Civil Air Patrol that they'd be willing to share. What is the organization like and how much time is required? I'd be joining as a "senior member" rather than as a cadet.

Of course I'd have to fly an RV to the meetings
-DC

Hi -

I was a happy go lucky new builder of an RV-7A just having completed my PPL...then I stumbled into CAP. All my free time disaappearred and the RV- sits in the basement four years later with the empnnage 80% completed.

Why'd I get involved? I wanted to fly and the RV wouldn't be done for years... CAP offered a cheap way to get flying, and for a worthy cause. I loked into CAP just after an RVer was lost on a ferry flight from the east coast to the west coast and I became interested in being able to participate in search and rescue work as a private pilot.

It became something of a compulsion for the past two years. Chasing after administrative qualifications, then after aicrew qualifications, first scanner then observer then mission pilot. Then being on search and rescue practice missions, conferences, aqctaul missions, meetings, etc... and after several months I actually managed to get authorized to fly the plane. After that, I could go fly whenever I wantes - for $29 an hour plus fuel for a nicely maintained 1985 172. Get to use a cool tactical callsign when flying. Actually get priority from ATC if I were to use the "RESCUE" callsign (but I've never actually used it yet). Get to wear cool looking uniforms when flying. CAP has been moving towards new 182's with G-1000 glass, and I believe the cost to fly those is about $40 an hour plus fuel. You just have to get a CAP CFI to give to give you the training...

Time involved? Weekly meeting that you don't *have* to attend. Time spent pursuing online courses and certificates. Time spent practicing SAR techniques. Time spent flying and maintaining qualifications (but that's all fun). Yearly checkflights. Checkflight for each new type of airplane you want to fly as a CAP pilot. Cjeckflight for beig a mission pilot in addition to the yearly BFR equivalent. Checkrides are performed to PTS standards. Time spent cleaning the airplane and taking it to and from maintanence. Time spent working in non-flying administrative and support roles (i.e, communications officer, finance officer, operations officer, etc.)

I have mostly enjoyed the experience but there are some down sides. Lots of rules to follow in addition to FAA rules for flying. For example, you have to get a "flight release" each time to want to fly. Lots of paperwork each time you go on a SAR sortie - weight and balance, mission objectives, aircraft inspection, ec, etc, have to be done each time you fly in a real mission. While you can pursue any ratings you want after being in for a while (instrument, commercial, etc.) for free, you have to track down a CAP CFI to give you that time - and he/she has to pry time loose from their schedule too.

Right now, I am trying to track down a CFI to give me a "Form 5" and a BFR and it is a little bit of a nuisance trying to get it scheduled. Myself I am a little burned out, but that really has more to do with the economy and my work situation than CAP...

Overall, a good organization to get into. And worthwhile use of your skills as a pilot. You may get called up one to several times a year for an actual mission, not counting the nuisance ELT-in-hanger missions. The time is likely to take away significantly from your RV building efforts.

Every squadron is different. Check out a local squadron and see what you think. Sort of a different group of aviators than you might find at a VAF fly-in. I took my last checkride from a guy who had been a bird dog pilot in Vietnam. Lots of high experience people. Lots of gray hair too.

It's all worth it though when you get called for a real mission. CAP was involved in the search for the wreckage of Columbia, was involved in Katrina relief efforts, tornado, storm and flood damage assesments, and even helps train AF interceptor pilots by being the "Target of Interest" aircraft.

Oh, and sorry, but CAP won't let you participate in an experimental aircraft. Bummer.

Bext of luck,

--Nomex

 

[Steve]

CAP notes

I was a member for 14 years. I was qualified as a CAP pilot, a Mission Pilot, a Mission Check Pilot, a Scanner, and an Observer. I was also the Logistics officer (supply guy) for my squadron. I participated in many searches over the years. Most notably the Steve Fossett search back in '07.
Because of high altitude operations, western Wings are assigned Cessna 182s. I was checked out in all models assign to my wing, i.e. fixed gear normally aspirated, turbo'd, fuel injected, the retract fuelie, and finally the new G1000 models.
You must have 150 hours PIC time in high performance aircraft (RVs don't count) to become a CAP pilot. Form 5 (BFRs) checkrides are required every year. You need 250 high perf PIC hours to become a Mission Pilot with it's own Form 91 biannual checkride. A separate first time checkride(s) is required in each model 182 you ever wish to fly. Only a PPL certificate is required.
The Utah Wing, and a few wings, had Gippsland Airvans assigned (think 3/4 scale Cessna Caravan). An instrument and commercial rating with 2nd class medical were required to drive in the left seat.
As previously posted, the CAP is a US government entity, actually an Auxiliary of the USAF. All assets are provided by the USAF. Paperwork is the lifeblood of the government. All that stuff sounds daunting but it's not tough. We built airplanes, remember.

I had a great time but it was time to do something else,
Steve

 

[frankh]

So why would an RV with a 200HP rated motor not count towards CAP requirements for the 182??

Frank

 

[jcaplins]

You must have 150 hours PIC time in high performance aircraft (RVs don't count) to become a CAP pilot. Form 5 (BFRs) checkrides are required every year. You need 250 high perf PIC hours to become a Mission Pilot with it's own Form 91 biannual checkride.

Steve, are these numbers correct?

I am in the process of joining now and the hours I've read and have been told are PIC: 150 to fly, 250 for mission pilot. But nowhere have I read that time needs to be high performance. You just need a high perf endorsement for the C-182 (or other high perf aircraft) and a checkout (~10 hours for C-182) for each type of aircraft to be flown.

 

[Capflyer]

As my nickname implies, I am involved in CAP. I am currently a Squadron Commander, a Mission Pilot, Glider Tow Pilot, Ground Team Leader, in the CD program, and participate in homeland security missions. Having said all this, every Wing filtering down to the squadrons have their own personalities and mission. My suggestion to you is visit a few squadrons and talk to the members. Some squadrons are very ES (Emergency Services) oriented while others focus on Cadet Programs, while still others focus on professional development.

As to the requirements to participate in different things in CAP here is a brief overview. The numbers given by Steve are not correct unless Utah has a supplement to the regulations.

To get started after you join you'll need to complete some basic courses that are all now online. Level 1 is an introduction to CAP. CPPT which is the Cadet Protection course, and OPSEC which is a quick 5 minute online deal about security of information.

If all you want to do is fly you'll need to complete what is called a Form 5 checkride in the plane you would like to fly. It gets a little confusing here because there are 4 catagories of airplanes based on performance plus a separate one for the G1000 C182's. To fly a C172, you only need to have your PPL. For a high performance aircraft, you will need to have 100 hrs of time plus 10 hours and 25 take-offs and landings in a high performance aircraft. The G1000 will require you to have completed the standard Cessna factory training called FITS then require a separate checkride in that aircraft. My squadron has a C182RG so a yearly Form 5 checkride in that counts towards a straight leg 182 and 172.

As a CAP pilot, as long as you have 225 PIC hours you can then become a Cadet Orientation Pilot. The cadets are entitled to 5 O-Flights, each lasting approximately 1 hr. The flights follow an established syllabus.

With 500 hours you can become a CAP glider tow pilot.

Getting into ES requires quite a few courses which make sense so you know how to operate in a standard FEMA designed system of mission management that all agencies use. These include IC100, IC200, and IC700 FEMA ICS (Incident Command System) courses. Once done you will get your first ES rating which is called GES (General Emergency Services).

There are two general routes to follow in the ES side of CAP. One is air and the other is ground. Since we are pilots here lets focus on that. There are four aircrew ratings; Transport Mission Pilot, Mission Scanner, Mission Observer, and Mission Pilot. The first rating you would work towards is Mission Scanner. It is very easy to get this rating especially if you are a pilot. This is also the pre-requisite for Mission Observer and Mission Pilot. Most pilots after getting their MS rating will work towards MO & MP at the same time. MP requires you to have 175 PIC hours to begin the training and 200 PIC hours to get the rating. A Transport Mission Pilot requires 100 PIC hours and allows you to move people and equipment and fly High Bird (airborn communication repeater). It only requires the time and a GES rating.

There is paperwork but a lot is now going online including in a couple of months being able to get your own flight releases online instead of trying to find an FRO (Flight Release Officer) over the phone.

It is very confusing at first but a good squadron will provide the expertise and support to get you where you want to be. Don't be affraid to check out a few squadrons and see where their priorities are. Also, don't be affraid of what seems to be a Cadet or Composite Squadron. Many of them are very active flyers and very active in ES.

There is a lot of information online and a good place to start is www.gocivilairpatrol.com

So, what are some of the benefits of being in CAP? It is a great way to volunteer your time to the community and our country doing something important that saves lives and helps to protect us. If you are a CAP pilot and have been in for 1 year, you can get training towards an advanced pilot rating (IFR, Commercial, CFI, etc.). You will learn leadership skills or hone the ones you already have. There are lots of ways to get free flying while doing something instead of just putzing around in the sky. The rental rates on the aircraft are very inexpensive if all you just want is to go fly. The cadets look up to you and the satisfaction of putting them in a plane and having them fly it for an hour while doing the tasks from the syllabus is very rewarding.

Hope this helps get you interested enough to visit some squadrons.

 

[Steve]

Oops

You are correct on the 150/250 total pic hours in any airplane. Just the high performance endorsement is required and the various C-182 checkouts.

FAR 61.31(f) defines a high performance airplane as having more than 200 HP. Back in the day when personal a/c were allowed to participate in CAP activities, a friend would fly his Beech Sierra (IO360, retract, CS prop, elec flaps). It would bug him because he would get the low C172 reimbursement rate because the plane did not have more than 200 HP. His plane met the complex, 61.31(e), but not the high perf requirements.

Steve