Well, having the device in an experimental airplane is not illegal. Using your cell phone while in flight is illegal, per FCC rules. And none of us would ever, ever, ever use our cell phones while in flight, connected to the cell phone input on our headsets or audio panels, right? hehe
 
gotcha

I'm a M.D. and would just need to know if the ER is calling... Don't need to answer - until I'm on the ground. I just need to know that I need to land. (airport is 2mi to the hospital)
 
craigvince said:
... Using your cell phone while in flight is illegal, per FCC rules...
Click to expand...

Are you sure about that?

The only FAR I'm aware of that affects us in this regard is 91.21, and it only prohibits cell phone use when under IFR (91.21(a)(2)). And even under IFR, I interpret it to mean that cell phone use is permitted if you have "determined will not cause interference with the navigation or communication system of the aircraft on which it is to be used" (91.21(b)).

FAR 91.21:
http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov/cgi/t/tex...8&view=text&node=14:2.0.1.3.10.1.4.11&idno=14

If there are other relevant regs, please provide a specific citation.
 
klovning said:
Would it be legal (or a good idea even) to put a repeater in the airplane?

http://www.repeaterstore.com/products/repeaterkits/digital-antenna/DA4KSBR-50M.html

- I searched the archives and didn't see anyhing on it... maybe it's illegal?
Click to expand...

Probably not illegal, but probably not that useful either.

1) Are you flying yet, and do you actually have problems with cell phone reception when you fly? When I fly (currently in a Piper) I normally get great cell phone reception. Better than on the ground in the same area. In short, I'm questioning whether this is a solution for a non-existent problem.

2) The repeater you found recommends "Note: A minimum distance of 25 ft and a structure (e.g. RV roof) between inside and outside antennas is recommended." You'd have a hard time achieving that in a 20 ft airplane.

klovning said:
I'm a M.D. and would just need to know if the ER is calling... Don't need to answer - until I'm on the ground. I just need to know that I need to land. (airport is 2mi to the hospital)
Click to expand...

3) Even a properly installed and positioned repeater may improve your reception range (or it may not). But even in the best case, it is no guarantee that you will not hit dead spots while flying.
 
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I have a similar setup in my home for amplifying a cell signal to my AT&T broadband aircard for internet access. As long as the aircard is within a foot or so of the receiver the system works pretty well.

My setup cost considerably less than what you show for the setup you are looking at. They may be very different but I would say you do not need to spend that much to get a signal booster to work.

I think this setup, or a similar one, could work in the RV with a couple of caveats.

I did read this NOTE in the description you posted:

Note: A minimum distance of 25 ft and a structure (e.g. RV roof) between inside and outside antennas is recommended.

That is the same notice I had on my setup too. It might be a little difficult to separate by 25 ft the boost antenna and the receiver in an RV.

In addition, my system discussed the importance of placing the receiver between the cell tower and the aircard antenna. Having the aircard antenna between the repeater antennae and receiver would cause the signal from the aircard to oscillate back and forth between the aircard antenna and the receiver and cancel out any positive effect the booster antenna would provide. I have experienced this and can attest to the very poor signal that results when this happens. With the airplane I am not sure you can always be sure the alignment would be the way it needs to be to boost the signal.

I think this might be a little on the expensive side and unnecessarily complicated for installation in an RV. How often would you see the benefit from such an installation?
 
Found this on the FCC website:

Federal Communications Commission (FCC) rules prohibit the use of cellular phones using the 800 MHz frequency and other wireless devices on airborne aircraft. This ban was put in place because of potential interference to wireless networks on the ground.

In March 2007, the FCC terminated a proceeding that it began in late 2004 to consider potentially lifting this ban. The FCC determined that the technical information provided by interested parties in response to the proposal was insufficient to determine whether in-flight use of wireless devices on aircraft could cause harmful interference to wireless networks on the ground. Therefore, it decided at this time to make no changes in the rules prohibiting in-flight use of such devices.
 
roee said:
Are you sure about that?

The only FAR I'm aware of that affects us in this regard is 91.21, and it only prohibits cell phone use when under IFR (91.21(a)(2)). And even under IFR, I interpret it to mean that cell phone use is permitted if you have "determined will not cause interference with the navigation or communication system of the aircraft on which it is to be used" (91.21(b)).

FAR 91.21:
http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov/cgi/t/tex...8&view=text&node=14:2.0.1.3.10.1.4.11&idno=14

If there are other relevant regs, please provide a specific citation.
Click to expand...

The FCC has regulations on cell phone use in aircraft, not the FAA. Craig is correct about the FCC regulation.

Last year there was discussion in the legislature about removing this regulation because there was some scientific evidence showing there was little, if any, adverse effects on navigation from cell phone use in an airplane.

The general consensus during the discussion to change this regulation was that keeping the ban in place would not hurt anything and that the flying public did not want to be on a commercial flight where everyone would be constantly chattering on their cell phones during a flight. More than anything else, I think this is why the repeal on the ban was defeated.
 
RVbySDI said:
The FCC has regulations on cell phone use in aircraft, not the FAA. Craig is correct about the FCC regulation.
Click to expand...

Ah, yes...

Bob Brown said:
Federal Communications Commission (FCC) rules prohibit the use of cellular phones using the 800 MHz frequency and other wireless devices on airborne aircraft.
Click to expand...

If the prohibition is only with respect to the 800 MHz band, why not get cell phone service from one of the carriers that operate on the 1900 MHz band.
 
Frequency

roee said:
Ah, yes...

If the prohibition is only with respect to the 800 MHz band, why not get cell phone service from one of the carriers that operate on the 1900 MHz band.
Click to expand...

No mention of frequency in the rule:

FCC 22.925
Revised as of October 1, 2007

Sec. 22.925 Prohibition on airborne operation of cellular telephones.

Cellular telephones installed in or carried aboard airplanes, balloons or
any other type of aircraft must not be operated while such aircraft are
airborne (not touching the ground). When any aircraft leaves the ground, all
cellular telephones on board that aircraft must be turned off. The following
notice must be posted on or near each cellular telephone installed in any
aircraft:

"The use of cellular telephones while this aircraft is airborne is
prohibited by FCC rules, and the violation of this rule could result in
suspension of service and/or a fine. The use of cellular telephones while
this aircraft is on the ground is subject to FAA regulations."
 
klovning said:
I'm a M.D. and would just need to know if the ER is calling... Don't need to answer - until I'm on the ground. I just need to know that I need to land. (airport is 2mi to the hospital)
Click to expand...

Jason,

One thing to keep in mind. W/O the repeater your digital cell phone will lose signal at altitude and you will very quickly run your battery down.

You have a few choices. Plug your phone in to a charger while flying and HOPE you get the message, turn it off and check it when you land, or get an old fashioned pager, like the drug dealers in the 80's used. (Can you even get those sat pagers anymore?)
 
Its not illegal if you don't get caught < i have heard of no case were there was a fine to GA folks, Looks really nice I might get one for my plane thanks for sharing. Would you mount the antenna externaly?
 
The ED ain't that smart

I doubt that I could educate the 50 or so diffrent people that work shifts at our ED on how to run the handheld... I usually carry a pager - the vibrate mode is hard to detect in a plane (because the plane vibrates) and I can't hear the audible alert with my headset on - there's no audio jack on a pager...

Maybe I need to pay the FBO something to x-mit to me if my phone rings..

-jason
 
Illegal

Let me throw a few facts into this discussion:

1. It is illegal to use a cell phone in flight per the FCC, period. The rule does not differentiate if your plane is an experimental or not.

2. The technical issues with having a phone turned on in flight is that most of the time (depending on altitude) you will not get a signal and will run your battery down. Further, if you get a signal, because of altitude again, you will hit so many towers that the carrier will know you are in an aircraft. (I know this because one of my coworkers went in a test flight of a helicopter a few months back, and forgot to turn his cell off, when he got back down he realized his phone was in "airplane" mode with no RF being transmitted)

3. I do know of an operator who got a hefty fine from the FCC for using cell phones in flight. Chances are the FCC will not go hunting you down, but your carrier has the ability to identify your cell phone as hitting too many towers and turn it off, or worse, report you to the FCC.

As far as I can tell, even if you only leave your phone on in flight (without trying to make or answer a call) you might still be breaking the FCC rule.
 
Just curious Doc on how the medics communicate to the ER on the ride in? We have med channels to each of the hospitals and they're VHF channels that work quite well with the extended range of MARS/CAP mod-ed radios. I have all the med channels programmed into my ham radio although I have no real reason to use them unless we have some MCI or other disaster where communications might need to be established. Not sure what you use in your area, but you might check on that route. I also use mine to set up communications with outside police agencies when they request our help. One thing to consider though. If you do go the ham radio route. You must be authorized to use that frequency and you must ensure that your modified radio transmits accurately on that frequency and without drifting and splattering adjacent frequencies.
Also, doesn't regular old pagers work? We carried ours all the time when we had them and they reached us nearly everytime. I don't think the altitude really affected their reception.
BTW, the old analog cell towers were pretty much omnidirectional and received all around and therefore when somebody was flying they would hit all the towers nearby. Apparantly, they put new antennas in that are more aligned to the horizon and reject signals from above. That's why you can't get cell coverage while high up anymore. Of course this is what I've been told and not what we do.so, I don't think the "repeater" will work. Anyhow, you could get your ham license and then be legal while airborne. The APRS and packet radio section of the forum should be checked too. FWIW
 
The Galaxy 4 satellite lost control and left its orbit some 10 years ago. Most of the pagers in the US went out of service. Pagers work(worked) differently than cell phones, and besides, most of them are passive (reception only).

Edit: What about satellite phones?
 
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Here in Canada it is legal to use a cell phone from an airplane. It is also an accepted way to contact the tower if you have a com failure. Its great to call ahead for your family to arrive at the airport to pick you up.
 
GregM said:
...Anyhow, you could get your ham license and then be legal while airborne. The APRS and packet radio section of the forum should be checked too. FWIW
Click to expand...
One of the very basic tenets of amateur radio is that it is not for any commercial uses. If that was not the case the messaging capabilities of APRS could be quite useful for this type of purpose.
 
John Clark said:
No mention of frequency in the rule:

FCC 22.925
Revised as of October 1, 2007

Sec. 22.925 Prohibition on airborne operation of cellular telephones.

Cellular telephones installed in or carried aboard airplanes, balloons or
any other type of aircraft must not be operated while such aircraft are
airborne (not touching the ground). When any aircraft leaves the ground, all
cellular telephones on board that aircraft must be turned off. The following
notice must be posted on or near each cellular telephone installed in any
aircraft:

"The use of cellular telephones while this aircraft is airborne is
prohibited by FCC rules, and the violation of this rule could result in
suspension of service and/or a fine. The use of cellular telephones while
this aircraft is on the ground is subject to FAA regulations."
Click to expand...

Do you know if this applies to 3G data services?
 
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