[rleffler]

trying to find a primary care physician after moving to the Phoenix west valley. Are any known to be Basic Med friendly? The closer to Surprise the better.

I’m assuming that any of the Banner or other large corporate base physicians won’t be.

 

[tlpopp]

My PCP was willing to fill out the basic med form for me during my last annual checkup. Sekar Annamalai at Sunrise Medical Associates in Peoria.

 

[Red6]

Our PCP, Dr. Sean Rea, Banner Medical Center in Surprise did my Basic Medical Sep 2022. At the time, Banner didn't have any policy against doing them, it was up to the individual Doc. They are located on Statler Blvd, number is 623 478-3100.

 

[fl-mike]

The interesting thing is that "all state licensed physicians" can perform the exam. For instance, my chiropractor is a state licensed physician. I haven't used him or asked, but he could perform the exam according to the statute if he feels he has the knowledge necessary to perform the exam.

You might look for DOT/CDL exam providers. Same deal really and could be cheaper. Here is one:
https://www.valleydotphysicals.com/faa-basic-med.html

 

[MacCool]

The interesting thing is that "all state licensed physicians" can perform the exam. For instance, my chiropractor is a state licensed physician.

To clarify, chiropractors are not licensed physicians in many states, so in those states they are not eligible to do a Basic Med exam.

Here's a list... https://www.acatoday.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/10/State_physician_status_2015.pdf

 

[bwestfall]

Not that it will help you in AZ but my AME does basic med exams. Charges the same as a 3rd class. You might check your local AME's.

 

[dmattmul]

To clarify, chiropractors are not licensed physicians in many states, so in those states they are not eligible to do a Basic Med exam.

Here's a list... https://www.acatoday.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/10/State_physician_status_2015.pdf

In Florida they are, including Arizona. Great resource.

 

[JImKerr]

I'm curious why people use Basic Med vs just going to an AME for a 3rd class medical. The forms the doctors have to fill out is certifying the same information and I have seen some doctors don't have the exact test equipment needed (the color blindness test is very specific). The paper needs to be carried with. you. The pilot has to submit the docs to the FAA. I was going to do Basic Med and it ended up being more complicated than just going to an AME that knows what to do and has the systems to submit all of the paperwork to the FAA. I believe I read somewhere on this forum that some Insurance Companies are requiring AME medicals for renewals. It makes sense if there isn't an AME in the area, but that is the only advantage I can think of. Am I missing something?

 

[scard]

I'm curious why people use Basic Med vs just going to an AME for a 3rd class medical. The forms the doctors have to fill out is certifying the same information and I have seen some doctors don't have the exact test equipment needed (the color blindness test is very specific). The paper needs to be carried with. you. The pilot has to submit the docs to the FAA. I was going to do Basic Med and it ended up being more complicated than just going to an AME that knows what to do and has the systems to submit all of the paperwork to the FAA. I believe I read somewhere on this forum that some Insurance Companies are requiring AME medicals for renewals. It makes sense if there isn't an AME in the area, but that is the only advantage I can think of. Am I missing something?

There are some very valid reasons. There are some circumstances where the paperwork required for a class III is vastly burdensome, depending on condition, that simply isn't necessary with basic med.

 

[JImKerr]

There are some very valid reasons. There are some circumstances where the paperwork required for a class III is vastly burdensome, depending on condition, that simply isn't necessary with basic med.

I'm sure I am missing something, but I've always found the Class 3 pretty easy. I was looking at the 8700-2 form (https://www.faa.gov/documentLibrary/media/Form/FAA_Form_8700-2_OMB_EXP_06-2026.pdf). It seems like they ask the same questions. The doctor signing off is taking the same level of responsibility as an AME, which is likely why it is challenging to find one that will sign-off. No doubt they could be sued for malpractice if they sign someone off that doesn't meet the standards. Pilots also have to take the Basic Med course, submit everything to the FAA and if they forget to bring their medical with them an FAA investigator cannot look them up online to see if they have a current medical. When I looked at doing this it seemed like it was more of a hassle than just going to an AME. Most AME's I have seen are not trying to fail people. They tend to be an advocate if someone has a disqualifying medical issue and they can provide guidance if there are questions. An AME can also help someone get though the paperwork to get their medical back. Establishing a history with an AME can be very helpful if an issue arises. They will have a baseline to compare to to help get someone back to certification.

 

[dmattmul]

I'm curious why people use Basic Med vs just going to an AME for a 3rd class medical. The forms the doctors have to fill out is certifying the same information and I have seen some doctors don't have the exact test equipment needed (the color blindness test is very specific). The paper needs to be carried with. you. The pilot has to submit the docs to the FAA. I was going to do Basic Med and it ended up being more complicated than just going to an AME that knows what to do and has the systems to submit all of the paperwork to the FAA. I believe I read somewhere on this forum that some Insurance Companies are requiring AME medicals for renewals. It makes sense if there isn't an AME in the area, but that is the only advantage I can think of. Am I missing something?

If you are a nervous patient (increased BP) and the FAA doctor makes one more nervous (white coat Itys) and you fail, your exam you've just lost your ticket for a minimum of 9 months. We were losing tow plane pilots left and right at my club because to fly a sailplane a 3rd class is not needed but to fly the tow plane a license is needed. If they failed a 3rd class, they could not fly their sailplane. (Once you fail a 3rd class there are some draconian consequences) So, they stopped getting their third-class ticket (Before basic med). Basic med is the best thing that's come along in our hobby in decades. A friend of mine lost his ticket because the FAA doctor thought he wanted a second class and failed one of the stricter tests needed for a second class (He applied for a third class). He couldn't fly for many months on a paperwork issue.

And yes, easy to look up on-line if you have a basic med certificate.

 

[JImKerr]

I know you are looking for a Basic Med doc. If you don't find one I thought I would share the list of AME's in the Phoenix area. David Elliott only does 2nd/3rd medicals. He is probably a primary care physician that does medicals as a side hustle.

J Burr Ross	3811 East Bell Road STE 107	Maricopa	Phoenix	AZ	85032	(602) 368-5633	United States	First Class	Western Pacific Region
John Salvatore Raniolo	20414 N. 27TH AVENUE, SUITE 375	MARICOPA	PHOENIX	AZ	85027	(877) 900-0263	United States	First Class	Western Pacific Region
Larry Robert Sobel	4550 E. BELL ROAD #114	MARICOPA	PHOENIX	AZ	85032	(602) 996-6668	United States	First Class	Western Pacific Region
Rosalie E Banasiak	12808 N BLACK CANYON HIGHWAY	MARICOPA	PHOENIX	AZ	850290000	(602) 375-1155	United States	First Class	Western Pacific Region
Deborah L Dykema	20045 N 19TH AVE BLD 9-151	Maricopa	Phoenix	AZ	85027	(602) 978-1555	United States	First Class	Western Pacific Region
David Lawrence Elliott	18404 N TATUM BLVD STE 205	MARICOPA	PHOENIX	AZ	850320000	(602) 971-5500	United States	Second Class/Third Class	Western Pacific Region

 

[MikeinPhoenix]

If you are a nervous patient (increased BP) and the FAA doctor makes one more nervous (white coat Itys) and you fail, your exam you've just lost your ticket for a minimum of 9 months. We were losing tow plane pilots left and right at my club because to fly a sailplane a 3rd class is not needed but to fly the tow plane a license is needed. If they failed a 3rd class, they could not fly their sailplane. (Once you fail a 3rd class there are some draconian consequences) So, they stopped getting their third-class ticket (Before basic med). Basic med is the best thing that's come along in our hobby in decades. A friend of mine lost his ticket because the FAA doctor thought he wanted a second class and failed one of the stricter tests needed for a second class (He applied for a third class). He couldn't fly for many months on a paperwork issue.

And yes, easy to look up on-line if you have a basic med certificate.

You hit the nail on the head. A 3rd class medical is easy right up to the point when you get a deferral or failure. You can’t put the genie back in the bottle once that happens.

 

[MacCool]

I'm curious why people use Basic Med vs just going to an AME for a 3rd class medical.

Speaking for myself, I want the decision regarding my medical fitness to fly to be between me and my doctor, not between me and the bureaucratic mess that is the FAA Medical Branch. And, of course, 48 months vs 24 months.

 

[JImKerr]

If you are a nervous patient (increased BP) and the FAA doctor makes one more nervous (white coat Itys) and you fail, your exam you've just lost your ticket for a minimum of 9 months. We were losing tow plane pilots left and right at my club because to fly a sailplane a 3rd class is not needed but to fly the tow plane a license is needed. If they failed a 3rd class, they could not fly their sailplane. (Once you fail a 3rd class there are some draconian consequences) So, they stopped getting their third-class ticket (Before basic med). Basic med is the best thing that's come along in our hobby in decades. A friend of mine lost his ticket because the FAA doctor thought he wanted a second class and failed one of the stricter tests needed for a second class (He applied for a third class). He couldn't fly for many months on a paperwork issue.

And yes, easy to look up on-line if you have a basic med certificate.

Very insightful information @dmattmul. You make valid points I wasn't considering. If an AME fails someone it is entirely different than a general MD fails someone. You don't have to submit the general MD paperwork to the feds if you don't like what is written on it. An AME is required to submit it to the feds and it is a guaranteed suspension. There is no getting a second opinion with an AME. The thing that concerns me some is that the Basic Med pilot is self-certifying. If they have a disqualifying issue like high BP and they fly anyhow they could be in a world of problems. If there is an accident the NTSB would investigate. If a preexisting medical issue surfaces the insurance company could deny the claim because the pilot did not meet the requirements to operate the plane.

Speaking for myself, I want the decision regarding my medical fitness to fly to be between me and my doctor, not between me and the bureaucratic mess that is the FAA Medical Branch. And, of course, 48 months vs 24 months.

Great discussion! You all make very good points.

 

[Dugaru]

I'm sure I am missing something, but I've always found the Class 3 pretty easy.

You are in fact missing something. A hiccup in a Class 3 is potentially catastrophic. You could be done flying for many many months (at best) even if the alleged problem is trivial. You might also be required to undergo hideously expensive testing that your doctor thinks is worthless. Not so with BasicMed.

 

[Dugaru]

If a preexisting medical issue surfaces the insurance company could deny the claim because the pilot did not meet the requirements to operate the plane.

Each scenario has to be evaluated on its own merits, but in general, people wildly overestimate the circumstances under which a GA aviation insurer will deny a claim.

 

[BobTurner]

You are in fact missing something. A hiccup in a Class 3 is potentially catastrophic. You could be done flying for many many months (at best) even if the alleged problem is trivial. You might also be required to undergo hideously expensive testing that your doctor thinks is worthless. Not so with BasicMed.

+1. This is the answer. Dealing with a problem under class 3 can be a nightmare, while the same problem with basic med can be a non-event.

 

[JImKerr]

You all have me convinced about Basic Med. All great points. I will see if I can do Basic Med before my medical expires.

It sounds like going to an AME for a Basic Med may not be a good idea. If they discovered something they would likely have to report it to the FAA regardless. Gets us back to the original question of finding a Doctor who will sign off the form. Seems like you would need to verify up front if a Doctor will sign. They are busy. Randomly calling hospitals and urgent care facilities is not efficient. Most of the people answering the phones won't have a clue and busy clinics are not going to transfer people to doctors. One would have to schedule an office visit and hope they will sign. If not, they would pay for the exam and have to find someone else that may or may not sign the form. Doctors are under intense pressure by their employers and insurance companies to follow established procedures and they work in 10-15 minute intervals. Something they haven't done before could be a problem getting signed. I suspect a lot of doctors won't take the time to do the research for a one-off request and they will default to saying no. It is easier for people that already have a doctor they know, but not everyone does. AOPA needs to create a database of doctors that will perform Basic Med exams. I will talk to them about it at AirVenture.

 

[bonefishdave]

Just want to clarify some misinformation here about basic med and its advantages.
First of all the basic med CMEC FAA form 8700-2 is the form you would take to a doctor to be filled out by the physician.
Once completed and signed by the doctor this form is returned to the pilot which he must keep.
Next the pilot would need to pass one of the available online basic med courses and upon completion would fill in the doctors name and his medical license number on the test form. Once submitted that completion certificate will be sent to the FAA and basic med is now active for 4 years with the online basic med course required to be repeated in two years.

After about 3 days if you do an airman search inquiry on your self you will see you have basic med along with the valid dates

As said before basic med CMEC form 8700-2 is not submitted to the FAA. It is kept with the pilot along with his/her course completion certificate. Unlike a medical certificate, It is important to note that the regulations do not require you to fly with these documents in possession. They only need to be made available upon request.

Here is what my search shows.

Medical Information:

Medical Class: Second Medical Date: 10/2023

MUST USE CORRECTIVE LENS(ES) TO MEET VISION STANDARDS AT ALL REQUIRED DISTANCES.

BasicMed Course Date: 3/29/2024 BasicMed CMEC Date: 11/22/2022

Certificates

AIRLINE TRANSPORT PILOT FLIGHT INSTRUCTOR REMOTE PILOT REPAIRMAN EXPERIMENTAL AIRCRAFT BUILDER

There is a huge advantage to basic med regarding medical conditions. I have been diagnosed with a medical condition that prohibits me from flying on a 1s, 2nd, 3rd, or special issuance. However my condition is not prohibited from flying under basic med. had it not been for basic med, there is a chance I would never again be able to fly my RV7 and cub.

To qualify for BasicMed, you must meet the following requirements:

1. Hold a valid FAA Pilot Certificate.
2. Hold a valid state-issued driver’s license.
3. Have held any medical certificate (1st, 2nd, 3rd, regular, or special issuance) on or after July 15, 2006.
4. It is perfectly acceptable to hold both a medical certificate and basic med at the same time.
5. however f you solely hold a medical certificate and it gets denied Due to a medical reason, a special issuance would be required before one would be eligible for basic med.

 

[maxmirot]

Send the form in advance to your physician.
Ask in advance if the basic med form is OK with them.
Make sure you note that it is for any physician to sign.
Any primary care doc should not be able to handle it.
It is well within their scope of practice and their mal med insurance will cover them.

Don't fly with a third class med unless you need one. You setting your self up for large cost and flying down time.
There are lots of people permanently grounded because a problem came up while on their third class med.
The same person would still be flying today if they were on basic med.

Dr. Max

 

[maxmirot]

Good point on the form.
Make sure your provider know this too.
Welcome to ClubMed

 

[Dugaru]

I will see if I can do Basic Med before my medical expires.

+1. I see zero downside to this and many potential advantages.

 

[bbaggerman]

Send the form in advance to your physician.
Ask in advance if the basic med form is OK with them.

The Basic Med form has lots of links to supporting info for the examining physician. Some are more important for the physician than others. Although the Basic Med questionnaire for the physician is comprehensive, the most import areas seemed to be related to heart health and prescription drugs. I printed out those two info items, attached them to my Basic Med form, and dropped them off at the doctor's office in advance. My doctor has done several Basic Med exams and he was very appreciative to have the supporting info for a change, especially the info on prescription drugs.

As others have pointed out I see absolutely zero upside benefit to getting a 3rd class from an AME, only downside.

 

[BobTurner]

As others have pointed out I see absolutely zero upside benefit to getting a 3rd class from an AME, only downside.

Full disclosure: I use Basic Med.
To be fair, there are some small downsides.
1. Can’t fly in Canada (and by default can’t get to Alaska).
2. I must give up my dream of pushing the -10 up into the flight levels, just to say I did it.
3. Originally had the problem that you couldn’t be a safety pilot unless you were PIC (!) but after a decade the FAA fixed that.