bobmarkert

bobmarkert

Well Known Member
wing015ef9.jpg


Is this tool defective or is it me. I rivited my first rib onto the main wing spar and I find it almost impossible to keep from hitting ths rib flange as the gun vibrates. It appears the "shoulder" on the tool is very fat and the rivit sits very low in the cup allowing for no movement from perfect before it hits the flange. Do I have bad/no skills yet or a bad tool.
See pics
Thanks
Bob
 
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You may want to re-size your pictures and put a line break between the pics.

The set looks OK. I've found that some hockey stick tape on the set head really helps to ensure a nice rivet head.
 
Standard Riveting

I think most of us were/are challenged by standard rivets until we get over the learning curve. If you're unsure of your technique, I'd recommend shooting a couple of dozen practice rivets in some scrap aluminum. Lots cheaper to learn on scrap (or non-aviation grade aluminum you've purchased) vs. your kit.

Rivet sets come in sizes, just like rivets; your set looks a bit small compared to the rivet sets I use for 1/8" rivets. Mine allow the rivet to sit slightly deeper in the dimple on the set. See if you can borrow a rivet set from another builder to compare.


Some tips:
If you have a bucking partner you can guide the rivet set with one hand. This really steadies the whole process. No bucking partner?...Clamp the parts firmly so they're not jumping around and do the best you can to keep the gun aligned with the rivet (and bucking bar!).

I use my index finger to point (laying along the gun) and squeeze the trigger with my middle finger...same with the drill. This seems to help my brain know where everything is pointed.

Try using a small piece of duct or masking tape on the face of the rivet set. This will help minimize 'smileys'.

I also like "snap-socs" (a plastic cap that goes over the rivet set) for this same purpose. They last longer than tape and seem to do a great job. They're available from most of the tool companies, including Avery:

http://www.averytools.com/pc-884-89-snap-socrivet-set-caps.aspx

Good luck,
Mike
 
Practice practice practice

You should see some of my first riveting attempts. Keep slightly more pressure on the gun than on the bucking bar. Make sure your line of force is straight down on the rivet, and both the bar and the gun are being held firmly. It doesn't take long to GET IT. By the way your rivet set looks just like mine.

Steve Barnes The Builders Coach
 
yep it is technique

Yep, you'll hit the aluminum next to the rivet unless you remain perfectly straight on the rivet. One thing I did that helped was I put the universal set on my scotchbright wheel to smooth off the edge and maybe it lowered it ever so slightly. But yours looks fine , you just need practice keeping it straight on the rivet. good luck
 
Thanks for all the answers. I forgot to mention I'm using a double offset rivet-set so I don't have to flex the rib. One issue is that I need two hands on the gun.. one to run the gun and one to keep the rivet-set from rotating in the gun while driving. Luckily my wife agreed to run the bucking bar. Did most guys used a straight rivet-set and just flex the rib out of the way? Back to the shop to start riveting
Bob
 
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Also check your air pressure... too much will cause problems as well as too little...
 
bobmarkert said:
Thanks for all the answers. I forgot to mention I'm using a double offset rivet-set so I don't have to flex the rib. One issue is that I need two hands on the gun.. one to run the gun and one to keep the rivet-set from rotating in the gun while driving. Luckily my wife agreed to run the bucking bar. Did most guys used a straight rivet-set and just flex the rib out of the way? Back to the shop to start riveting
Bob
Click to expand...


Hi there,

I have built 2 and a half RV's so have driven my share of rivets, almost exclusively by myself. (no partner) other than when i can't get my two arms around the project. My tool kit came from Avery, and they are good quality tools. It did include a double offset universal rivet set. I found it very difficult to use. It seemed to me that the two bends in the tool allowed for too much energy from the rivet gun being lost in the tool and not going into the rivet shop head, if that makes any sense.

I eventually discarded that set, and instead bought one with a slightly bent end on it, say 5 to 10 degrees (single offset). This allows you to get around the flanges of the ribs and get directly on the rivet. The energy of the rivet gun then went directly into the rivet. Rivets looked much better.

Incidentally, the double offset wants to rotate on it's own. You can try a little duct tape on it to stop this unwanted action.

Steve Ciha
 
Snap Socs are the way to go!

I shoot flush rivets just fine, but struggled mightily with the standard ones. The Snap Socs are tremendously effective, making it possible for me to actually shoot a standard rivet solo. Of course, the best way is to have a bucker, and use one hand on the gun and the other on the rivet set. With a Snap Soc too! :p
 
Holding the rivet gun

Its been mentioned in this thread about the correct way to hold the rivet gun, but here's a pic just for clarification:

Holding%20rivet%20gun.jpg


This technique puts the action of the gun more inline with your forearm, helping to reduce the "pistol" type of kick-back that can lead to the rivet set walking across the work. Also, note the middle finger is used to trigger the gun, and the ring finger is underneath the trigger. By keeping a finger under the trigger, you'll have a way of really fine tuning how much squeeze you put on the trigger (since you can feel how much the trigger is squeezing down).

This is also a very good way to hold a drill body... taught to me by a couple guys who've worked aerospace sheet metal for 30+ years.
 
When shooting rivets...

...as with drilling holes, a "trick" is to look for the reflection of the rivet set (or drill bit) in the aluminum. As long as the rivet set and its reflection are in a straight line, the set is correctly positioned perpendicular to the surface of the material. This works on curved surfaces as well as flat areas.
 
double offset and practice

I too have built 2 1/2 RV's as Steve Ciha has. I also have had the same experience of control of the double offset rivet set. I build solo and never have more than one hand on my 3X. The double offset spins and is hard to control. Maybe 2 hands on would help. I think it would be good to practice with a drilled piece of aluminum in a vice, handling both the bucking bar and rivet gun at the same time yourself. I remember doing this years ago. Watch your lines of force and and control when you practice.

Steve Barnes The Builders Coach
 
Double offset rivet sets are a PITA as others have mentioned. Another option is to use the long rivet sets. These units allow you to put the tool on the rivet head without flexing the rib nearly as much. Most of the tool companies have them.
 
If you have a bucking partner, we found that using a double-offset *backrivet* set worked really well on the wing skins. It took a few to get the hang of it, but once we had it, it set very nice shop heads and of course the backriveting makes the factory side look beautiful. Did take two hands from the person doing the riveting, though...holding the set near the rivet was pretty essential.
 
To prevent a double rivet set from twisting...

I wrap a couple layers of electrical tape around the end of the rivet gun, the spring and the rivet set. If wrapped properly it prevents the rivet set from turning and doesn't interfere with the transfer of energy between the gun and the rivet set.
 
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