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prkaye

Well Known Member
I'll be starting the Fuse soon, and was watching the Orndoff's fuse video. They recommend some things that should be done early in the fuse construction because it's much harder later. One is the powerpack for the strobe lights, and the other is the mounting bracket for an autopilot like the trutrak. So here comes my questions - I don't know anything about autopilots, and I find the product descriptions on Trutraks website a little less than clear.

I'm thinking what is suitable for me is a basic autopilot that i can set a heading and say "hold this heading". I think the "single-axis" autopilots will do this just through aileron control, and that seems fine for my needs. It would also be nice if I could say "hold this altitute", but I can probably do this adequately with trim, except on really bumpy days.

So which one of the Trutrak products do I want? One of the "single-servo autopilots" like "digitrak" ? Or is there something even simpler/cheaper?

http://www.trutrakflightsystems.com/instruments_digitrak.htm

Is the Orndoff video correct that I should install this while constructing the fuse, rather than wait till later?
 
ADI I would be great....

gps/sl30 nav, doubles as art horiz.- one less vacuum gauge needed.

Nice thing about Tru Trak- you can upgrade down the road for the price delta.
 
I think you could probably buy a control head that can handle dual axis, and only put in the roll servo--------then if you want it later, add the pitch servo.

Better check with TruTrack though, just in case the control head would get confused by not having the pitch installed.

Or, IIRC, TruTrack lets you up grade and it only costs you the difference, you get full credit for original purchase price.

Mike.

P.S., get a ride in a dual axis equipped plane before you decide????
 
Choices choices

For a single axis A/P the Pictorial Pilot is hard to beat. It gives you a turn coordinator output that actually agrees with the horizon (imagine that!) in addition to being an autopilot....This can be viewed as an upgrade to the Digitrak which has no TC display.

So if you were thinking of adding a TC, now you just buy the PP and forget the TC. Lots of us who fly IFR use the PP as both the autopilot and the backup attitude indicator ...In other words of my Dynon quits I'm still happy even in clouds.

Now if you want altitude hold...I.e fly to your desired altitude trim it up for cruise and now you want to stay there, then the cheapest simplest way is to add an ALtrak.

This is the setup I have for IFR.

If i was doing it again I would go for the thing that combines the two into a single unit and gives a full artificial horizon in both roll and pitch...I just can't think of the name off hand...But this sounds like more than you want anyway?

If you intend to have pitch control (ALtrak..or the two in one deal) then it would be wise to make your elevator belcrank with the additional hole required and to install the servo bracket before you put the rear top skins on the fuse.

The Pictorial pilot (or Digitrack) uses a wing mounted bracket which was quite easy to fit to the completed airplane...Just make sure you run the wires...same for the ALtrak)

Frank
 
Lots of us who fly IFR use the PP as both the autopilot and the backup attitude indicator ...In other words of my Dynon quits I'm still happy even in clouds.
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Except what do you do for backup pitch information? This provides only turn and bank, right?
 
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You don't

But I was less than impressed by Dynon's rate of trun coordinator as it kept rescaling...I believe they have fixed this with the latest firmaware update.

If your Dynons are truly redundant units (i.e your not simply swapping the display (cus the second one will go blank if the first Dynon fails) . Then you don't need the PP IMO

Frank
 
Instrument scan

prkaye said:
Except what do you do for backup pitch information? This provides only turn and bank, right?
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Well of course if we were flying ancient spam cans I would wax lyrical about how I would be trained to watch my primary instruments of airspeed and altitude and all that nonsense...Well its not really nonsense but its not an ideal way to fly.

I still have my ALtrak so i can fly straight and level, and to be honest as long as I can keep the wings level then adjusting altitude with reference to the ASI and ALT is not that big of a deal.

Frank
 
prkaye said:
Except what do you do for backup pitch information? This provides only turn and bank, right?
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I primarily use airspeed for picth...that, and I have the AlTrak to hold altitude. FrankH said everything else that I would have ....I really wouldn't want to fly IFR very long in my RV without an altitude hold and at an autopilot that will hold heading and/or track the Nav signal.

VFR only? Different requirements! (But adding the bracket at the bellcrank will only cost a couple of bucks, and save hours of sweaty labor later if you change your mind...)

Paul
 
ADI I

Actually, it looks like the ADI Pilot I does give you pitch information too, correct??
This looks like the ideal solution... put a steam alt and airspeed guage with this and that gives me me redundant flight instruments for IFR... cheaper than buying two dynons!
Autopilot with GPS nav, and an artificial horizon/turn-coordinator all in a small package for under three grand. Pretty incredible what you can get these days if you ask me.

(But adding the bracket at the bellcrank will only cost a couple of bucks, and save hours of sweaty labor later if you change your mind...)
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Is the bracket universal (the same for a variety of Trutrak products)? If so, maybe it would be a good idea to throw the bracket in there in case I ever upgrade.
 
I installed the pitch servo bracket in my -7 very recently. It was a piece of cake to put in. I bought mine for $50 (+8.50 S/H) from Stein. Supposedly, when you buy the rest of the AP, you get the 50 bucks back. So, for the cost of shipping, you basically get the bracket for free when it is easy to put in. I documented the install at http://rvplane.com/?categoryid=4&dayid=379 .
 
Don't sweat early installation

I flew my RV-6A for a year or more IFR with no Autopilot and it was a BEAR! Every chart change was an unusual attitude exercise. I installed Tru Trak's Pictorial Pilot and Altrak with NO PROBLEM. I'm no super pilot but I do have 4,700+ hours with a good portion in IMC. In this airplane the altitude hold is at least as important as the direction. ALTRAK is dirt simple to install.

Bob Axsom
 
What's the best place to buy these things? Are there any other shops with lower prices than those on the TruTrak website?
 
I had to laugh

Bob Axsom said:
I flew my RV-6A for a year or more IFR with no Autopilot and it was a BEAR! Every chart change was an unusual attitude exercise. I installed Tru Trak's Pictorial Pilot and Altrak with NO PROBLEM. I'm no super pilot but I do have 4,700+ hours with a good portion in IMC. In this airplane the altitude hold is at least as important as the direction. ALTRAK is dirt simple to install.

Bob Axsom
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My CFI of course would not let me use the A/P during my IFR training in the 7a and so I sure can relate...One day he got a little frustrated at my progress and decided to show me how it was done....Guess what, yes he did better than me but not real good as we were being bucked around in real IMC.

When he handed me back the airplane he said.."your right, this thing is a handful!"...Gave plenty of light relief...:)

He's building a 7a too and I let him fly left seat to sharpen his IFR skills for his ATP checkride...Guess he thought if you can fly that thing you can fly anything!

I agree for normal IFR flying I use the A/P all the time, for practice approaches I fly manually but its a pretty scary experience for me...in real IMC at least.

Frank
 
TruTrak works well

I just installed a TruTrak ADI Pilot II. It has the ability to track a heading or take data from a GPS or VOR, etc. to follow a programmed route. It also has altitude hold. All of this is in one control head (3 1/8"). Two servos. The unit works great in intercepting a course and holding altitude even in turbulence.

If you're going to do any cross-country flying, I highly recommend this system. You can buy just the wiring harness from Stein and the servo brackets from TruTrak before you buy the actual servos and control head. I suggest you do that now as you're building to save you a lot of extra work later.

Depending on your build speed there may be an upgrade to the system by the time you're ready to finish, but TruTrak seems to be pretty good about factoring that in to their next gen stuff so the basic brackets and wiring will probably still be ok.

I wish I had done this while I was building rather than later.

Chris
 
You can buy just the wiring harness from Stein and the servo brackets from TruTrak before you buy the actual servos and control head
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Sounds like great advice. I didn't see the brackets for sale on TruTrak's website... I guess I just contact them to order the brackets?
Is there a reason to install the wiring harness early?
 
chrispratt said:
I just installed a TruTrak ADI Pilot II. It has the ability to track a heading or take data from a GPS or VOR, etc. to follow a programmed route. It also has altitude hold. All of this is in one control head (3 1/8"). Two servos. The unit works great in intercepting a course and holding altitude even in turbulence.

If you're going to do any cross-country flying, I highly recommend this system.
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I'll put my vote in for the ADI Pilot II as well. We just upgraded our CT from a pictorial pilot to the ADI Pilot II, and it's worth every penny. It can serve as a primary or secondary horizon instrument as well, although I think I'd only want to use it as backup. I think we're going with Dual Dynons plus the ADI Pilot II as backup attitude plus autopilot in our RV project.

Only downside is that you can't program in climb/decent rates.
 
prkaye said:
What's the best place to buy these things? Are there any other shops with lower prices than those on the TruTrak website?
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Chief Aircraft is where I got mine--------no tax, and free shipping.

http://www.chiefaircraft.com/cgi-bi...ction=serve&item=/Avionics/MfgSZ/TruTrak.html

Stein is another good source, and he is the OEM supplier for the wiring setup.

http://www.steinair.com/harnesses.htm

I have had good luck with both places.

Call TruTrack for more info--------if you still havent made your decession yet.

As others have said, the ADI pilot is going to fit your needs pretty well, at least as far as what you have talked about so far.

Good luck, Mike
 
FWIW, Dynon is working on an A/P. They told me that it will be included in the software in their EFIS' at no extra charge and all you will need to add is a servo for each axis. That was last February; said they hoped it would be ready for Arlington. So, if a person is uncertain now about the exact purchase, install the servos now, choose the A/P later--Dynon or whoever provided the servo. A friend who talked to Dynon is installing a Trio servo. Don't know if you can buy anyone else's servo separately.
 
Sounds like great advice. I didn't see the brackets for sale on TruTrak's website... I guess I just contact them to order the brackets?
Is there a reason to install the wiring harness early?
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TruTrak has good products (I've owned their AlTrak) but they're not the only game in town.

Take a look at the Trio Avionics site before you write any checks. :)

http://www.trioavionics.com
 
I second Sam. TruTrak has a fine reputation, but they're not the only player. My experience with the Trio folks has been top notch.
 
prkaye said:
Sounds like great advice. I didn't see the brackets for sale on TruTrak's website... I guess I just contact them to order the brackets?
Is there a reason to install the wiring harness early?
Click to expand...

When I ordered my Altrak, they sent along the "bracket kit" for the RV-8...it was two pieces of angle aluminum and a couple of bolts....they actually have the engineering drawings on their site (or at least used to - I didn't check recently)....see if they have the drawing for your plane on line, or just give them a call. Theres nothing magic about the mounts....like I said, a couple bucks of material.

Paul
 
Take a look at the Trio Avionics site before you write any checks.

http://www.trioavionics.com
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I would add to my quote that there is no need to be in a rush to make a decision on autopilots, avionics, etc. While it is convenient to install a servo mount while the fuse is open, installing an autopilot system in a buttoned up fuse is no big deal. I've had occasion to install several flavors of autopilots and and EFII in my RV-6 after it was flying and the fact that the plane was finished was never a deal-breaker.

There are many reasons for delaying your avionics decisions until the very last phase of construction. New toys are constantly being introduced along with enhancements of existing systems. There is no need to lock yourself into present technology while still in the fuselage stage of the project especially if the mission profile of the plane/pilot is still indefinite.
 
I'm thinking of going with Trio

I'm 2+ years away but I'm planning on provisiong my 9A for Trio servos. I may even change from manual to electric pitch trim since they have trim control for only $225 extra. TruTrak wants $975 to control the trim motor.

Besides, I bet Trio will have some new stuff out, soon...

Does anyone have links to a builder site for installing a Trio gold servo in the bellcrank bay of a 9 (or 7 or 6)? SafeAir1 sells kits but that is for wingtip installation.
 
Trio is great

Nothing against TruTrac--I'm sure they are fine units, but I couldn't be happier with my Trio. I upgraded from Alt hold I to II and had mine back in less than a week. Had a problem with heading hold (which turned out to be the GPS, not the EZ-Pilot) and they sent me a new unit the day I called. Super service and the AP's really do what they are supposed to.

Bob Kelly
 
IowaRV9Dreamer said:
Does anyone have links to a builder site for installing a Trio gold servo in the bellcrank bay of a 9 (or 7 or 6)? SafeAir1 sells kits but that is for wingtip installation.
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Dave,
Provided you have removable wing tips it might be easier to go with the SafeAir kit. It goes in the first bay from the wing tip, is reasonably easy to install even on a completed wing, can be easily accessed for servicing and comes with all the parts needed including the push rod between the servo and the bell crank.

Fin 9A
 
RScott said:
FWIW, Dynon is working on an A/P. They told me that it will be included in the software in their EFIS' at no extra charge and all you will need to add is a servo for each axis. That was last February; said they hoped it would be ready for Arlington. So, if a person is uncertain now about the exact purchase, install the servos now, choose the A/P later--Dynon or whoever provided the servo. A friend who talked to Dynon is installing a Trio servo. Don't know if you can buy anyone else's servo separately.
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I have to disagree with Dynon's approach here. Yes, it'd be great if the EFIS could also drive the AP, but I like the idea of them having separate horizon and heading references. Loosing the Dynon does not kill the AP and you can use it as a backup horizon and heading, if so equipped. Dissimilar backups are your friend.
 
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