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Steve Barnes

Well Known Member
I own a small part time manufacturing business (Van's Aircraft parts only). After 30 years + in the same commercial location the NEW management wants to enforce the premises liability insurance requirement.

I have been on the phone half the day and have talked to many agents. Some have tried to be helpful by directing me to other companies and others not so helpful. No joy!

They all ask the same question. "What service or product do you provide?" I've even said that I provide several different products and services, like sheet metal or fiberglass work. They all want to know what is your main product? What is your market. It all comes down to Van's Aircraft parts. If I grossed $100,000 + per year it would be easier. When I tell what the yearly gross is they don't have a product that meets my budget.

If any of you small manufactures or insurance agents have any ideas it would be much appreciated. I want to stay at my location and stay in business. I love working with the Van's crowd.

Steve Barnes
 
Steve,

I'm not an expert on this, but I did have the same type of problem when I had my consulting business. I think the important point is that you are not looking for product liability insurance only liability insurance for the premises.

I would never have been able to get product liability insurance for all of the things that we designed, but I was able to get insurance for the premises of my office space.
 
Trying going on-line and finding the SIC codes for what you do. You should be able to find something that covers CNC or metal stamping, or whichever services you do.

If you try to "describe" your way through with the broker you'll both get flustered but if you tell them 60% SIC code 1 and the rest is Code 2 and Code 3 they'll plug it in without hunting.

If you know others doing the same type of work ask them which codes they say they are doing.

Good luck, it's a strange maze to navigate for sure.
 
Premises liability only

Spot on advice, in the first response. Even Robinson Helicopter Co. does not have product liability insurance. Frank Robinson was quite bold and open about this. If you read your building lease agreement, 99% bet that it requests premises liability. In case a traveling salesman falls and breaks his leg on the sidewalk in front of your bay, that way you pay, not the land lord.
 
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Premises Liability not Product Liability

If you really want to have some fun, try going into a business related to the design, manufacture, sales , and support of the parachute industry.

Bill Booth is one of my favorites, he is so bold he registered his company as Uninsured United Parachute Technologies, LLC.

see the contact box at the bottom of this page.

http://www.unitedparachutetechnologies.com/index.php/company-profile


As far as I know all of the companies that I deal with in the commercial side of the parachute industry say that there is no way they could ever fins an underwriter that would give them any for of product liability insurance and allow them to stay in business. I have a hunch that manufacturing experimental airplane or race car parts is a lot like that as well.
 
Clark Howard

Why don't you try calling Clark Howard, the radio talk show consumer guru. Not only is he a super nice guy, bet you a dollar to a donut, he'll have an answer for you. Waiting to talk to him on the radio might take most of your life. Just call his team at 404 892 8227. I've never heard a question like yours on his show. Might just be, they'll bump you right up to the front.

Worth a try.
 
rapid_ascent said:
I think the important point is that you are not looking for product liability insurance only liability insurance for the premises.
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I agree with Ray. Once the agent knew I was only looking for liability insurance for the premises of my business, I was able to get coverage through a local State Farm agent.
 
I would have to see the lease terms but those that I am familiar with, a general liability umbrella is all you would need to satisfy the lease requirements. General liability policies are not that expensive. My $5M policy is less than $200 a month. Most leases only require $1-2M.
 
Agree with the perspective of looking for premises liability, not product liability, but this ignores an important point related to the uninsured parachute supplier.

Nobody brought out the point of protecting the sole-proprietor with the alter-ego business entities, Corporation, LLC or Trust.

Yes, many stories about how that didn't help, but these adverse results are typically rooted in the failure of the operating individual to "respect" the entity - usually by commingling person/business expenses.

FWIW

mjb
 
THANK YOU VAF MEMBERS

Got a lot of good feed back from you guys. One PM in particular I think may have saved my Bacon.

Steve
 
Hangar insurance

Related to this subject (sorta) I noticed a note on my last hangar bill that said to include proof of insurance naming the township (owner of the hangars) and a beneficiary. Is this common?
 
von_flyer said:
Related to this subject (sorta) I noticed a note on my last hangar bill that said to include proof of insurance naming the township (owner of the hangars) and a beneficiary. Is this common?
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Yes, very common at public airports. They may be asking for an "additional insured endorsement". I don't like that practice. It entitles the public airport owner to a defense by your insurance company and they could take half your coverage in a situation where both you and the airport are liable for an accident involving your airplane. That raises the price of your insurance. Also, since an insured cannot sue his own additional insured ("subrogate a claim"), it gives them unneeded immunity from your lawsuit for their negligence.

Complain to your state insurance commissioner. You have a right to use a public airport without giving up insurance rights.

What they should be asking for is Proof of Insurance--merely a paper from your ins. co. that certifies you have insurance.
-Kent
 
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