RVG8tor

RVG8tor

Well Known Member
Ok, I did a search and need some help since I can't find the answer. I want to use the Andair valve and know come rework from the plans are required. I am working on the QB fuselage and want to order the valve, the problem is the only thing I know about the engine I want is IO-360. Do I need to know what FI system I will use to order the valve, from what I have gleaned this is true? What is a good resource for deciding on the FI system, to me one that does not require a return line would make things simpler but what would be the pros and cons of return lines? Thanks in advance for any help.

Cheers
 
No real rework required, just a slight modification. See Kevin's site, he has a good picture.

http://www.kilohotel.com/rv8/article.php?story=20021024163721788&query=andair

You just need to decide if you want to be able to return to the same tank selected, in that case duplex valve. Or, you could have a dedicated return and know to only purge with the one tank, so std valve would be fine. There are pros and cons for both. I kept things simple no return installed.
 
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I have the standard Andair valve in my IO-360 RV-8 and it has the fuel lines run exactly per plans.

Updatem - I checked my notes and I used the FS 20x7T as William says below. You have to plumb the valve opposite of the normal valve. On the Andair valve when looking from the top, the left port goes to the left tank. On the -8 this takes some inginuity, and I suppose the -8A is similar.
 
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Not sure what the "standard" Andair valve is but the new FS 20x7T valve seems to be the one Van's is recommending for non return fuel systems. The 90 degree elbow and the lower AN fittings eliminate many of the separate AN fittings normally used with the kit supplied valve.

http://www.vansaircraft.com/cgi-bin...2&browse=airframe&product=fuel-selector-valve

cat-med_fuel-selector-valve.jpg
 
Andair

I used the Andair Fuel Valve on my IO-360 equipped RV-8. It is a top notch valve. Don't bother with the complicated fuel return lines. I have over 200 hours now and have never missed a hot start.

I used the Airflow Performance Fuel Pump and Filter. I highly recommend Don Rivera and his crew. I have had other dealings with them, and they are very good at what they do.
 
Hot starts are not a big deal. Someone at Poplar Grove told me how to do it last fall. I may not be doing it exactly the way he said but this has worked 20 times in a row. Even with quick stops for fuel on hot days this gets my IO started.

Mixture - full rich
Throttle - full
Boost pump on and count to 10 - this purges the fuel/vapor mixture and also makes sure you are rich

Boost pump off
Throttle at full *note - this originally said "idle" but someone asked via a pm about this and I checked my POH. I go full throttle
Mixture to idle cutoff

mags on and crank the engine. As the rich mixture goes lean it will fire. As it does slowly move mixture to rich and bring throttle back toward idel to clear the engine and get it running smoothly.

As mannanj says, don't worry about all the extra tubing runs for a return.
 
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Aircraft engine or conversion

As I understand it, if you are using the FI system designed and built for aircraft, there is generally no requirement for a full fuel return. If you are using an auto conversion with the FI for an automobile, that's a different story. I plumbed my tanks for a full return, just in case (I was seriously considering rotary or other). It was easy, and not much additional tubing required. As it turns out, I really won't be "needing" the full return (IO-390), but will get use out of it during the purge instead of just venting that out. We're talking teaspoons of fuel here, maybe tablespoons.

Pros:
Purged fuel returns to tank instead of wasted
In the event of auto FI, extra fuel from return line goes into the tank it came from, preventing you from inadvertently shooting it out the other tank's vent line.

Cons:
A few more ounces shaved of your useful load
Couple more tubes to bend, holes to drill

Seriously, takes another hour, two at the most. Your choice.
 
Duplex valve

captn kirk said:
I used the andair valve If you use the ECI FI system you will need a return line. I did one to each tank
Click to expand...

OK, so if I understand all of the posts, I can just just use a normal Andair valve, (left, Off, Right), with one fitting for each setting. If I need a return line it can be run to the tank. This is instead of the Andair duplex valve that has two fittings for the Left and Right. I was thinking the return line had to run to the valve.

I just would like to order this valve so I can fabricate the mounting while working this area of the fuselage rather than waiting. I just did not want to buy a valve and then after making my engine FI system decision realize I needed a different valve.

Now that I figure the normal valve will work, should I get it with the fitting for (L/R) 180 degrees our or 90 degrees out, which one will be easier to install, the Van's valve had the ports 180 apart.

Thanks
 
RVG8tor said:
OK, so if I understand all of the posts, I can just just use a normal Andair valve, (left, Off, Right), with one fitting for each setting. If I need a return line it can be run to the tank. This is instead of the Andair duplex valve that has two fittings for the Left and Right. I was thinking the return line had to run to the valve.
Click to expand...

The duplex valve will allow you to return the unused fuel to the tank it came from. If you only run the return line to one tank you run the risk of overfilling and pumping it overboard through the vent.
 
NPT + your choice of An

I got mine with straight-in NPT fittings. I could then order up any assortment of inexpensive (except banjo) blue AN fittings with the appropriate NPT fitting on one end. I used 90 degree elbows for all ports. You can put the Andair fittings into the valve without screwing them down (snug fit, you'll be surprised) to get the NPT elbow fitting in and tightened, then you have four possible orientations. Once you're happy, insert and tighten screws, then make the anti-rotation dimple beside the screw heads, according to the directions.

Since I used the duplex valve, this was handy. If you're using the single level (left, right, off, feed section only, no provision for return), then I think you can make it work pretty much any possible configuration, including the Andair 90 degree fittings.

Yes, standard IO-360 with AFP injection you could run a single return line straight to a tank, or even t'd into either tank's feed line on the tank side of the selector valve. As I understand it, a typical purge could transfer a quart or so from one tank to the other. Unless both tanks are already venting thermal-expanding gas, you shouldn't spill too much.

Want to be sure? Don't take my word for it. Find out which FI system you'll be using and give them a call. I did. Ask what they recommend. Call your engine manufacturer if you don't know which system it is.
 
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Fuel valve

I am building an RV8 dash one slow build, some slight differences between my neighbors quick build, ever so slight.

I used the above mentioned valve with the fitting that allows return from the pump to the valve, available from Van's or the factory. Sorry I don't have numbers right now. I got the fittings set at 90 degrees down, out of the valve. For some reason the Dash one kit puts the valve real close to the center section, much closer than my neighbors quick build, with the Andair valve and these 90 degree fittings its an easy job of plumbing!

Oh yea, I have given up on the Contential 6 cyl, so I will probably use the IO-390.

Hope this helps!
 
Oh yeah

Calvin's post reminded me, the Andair valve doesn't fit very well on the stock valve-support bracket. So I made one up out of some scrap. If you make it fit on the stock bracket, yeah, it's in a fixed position. But it was nothing to craft the new bracket, took about two hours total and you can then put the valve pretty much where ever you want it. I think I used piece of a rib I ruined, or maybe part of the HS spar I ruined :eek:. It's amazing how useful those ruined pieces are sometimes. :D
 
RVG8tor said:
Now that I figure the normal valve will work, should I get it with the fitting for (L/R) 180 degrees our or 90 degrees out, which one will be easier to install, the Van's valve had the ports 180 apart.

Thanks
Click to expand...
Which "normal" valve are you talking about? While the Vans kit supplied valve had ports 180 degrees apart, due to how it was plumbed, the selections are 90 degrees apart. In addition, the FS20x7T has ALL AN ports, no need to mess with NPT fittings.
 
I just dropped the original Van's valve and got credited for practically nothing (compared to Andair valve prices). So if you anyway are going to get Andair it's going to cost a lot. But I figured this so that if I'll need to get valve with return capability it's cheaper to get it right away rather than first buy one without it and then later get correct version of the valve:

FUEL VALVE FS 20X7T Price = $205.00
FUEL VALVE FS 20x20-3 Price = $365.00
 
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