Do you have to be cleared into Class D airspace?

  • Yes

    Votes: 8 10.4%
  • No

    Votes: 69 89.6%

  • Total voters
    77

N941WR

Legacy Member
Do you have to be cleared into Class Delta airspace?

It couldn't get much easier thant that.
 
Trick question...

This is sort of a trick question. My understanding is that you don't have to be cleared, like you do for class B. But that you have to have made radio contact with the tower. So I would say no.
 
This is sort of a trick question. My understanding is that you don't have to be cleared, like you do for class B. But that you have to have made radio contact with the tower. So I would say no.

Agree with the radio contact, in our area we have an old TRSA, which has an outer band at about 10 miles. Technically, if you are VFR you only have to contact the tower to enter the space and get clearance to land. We treat it as a mini class B, by contacting approach control then being handed off, finally to ground after exiting runway.
 
Two way radio communication must be established. There is no permission/clearance required.

I say, "XXX tower, Experimental RV NXXX"

tower responds "RV NXXX, say position and intentions"

He repeated my N-number, two way radio communication established.
 
No CLEARANCE required.

Only have to establish 2-way radio communications.
 
Don't mix up TRSA's with Class D. Permission to enter with TRSA's approach control is somewhat optional-- only radio contact has to be established.
Although someitmes you will hear "remain clear of the class C" upon contact.
For Class D airspace, you had better get permission to enter, depart, or transit the area during their hours of operation.

Vic
 
Only have to establish 2-way radio communications.

Just took the written...this is the way it is! Only establish radio contact. Radio contact at a minimum would be the controller saying your N number and standby.
 
I agree.

This is sort of a trick question.

You do not have to be "cleared". However, you must be in radio contact with the tower. Meaning you have called the tower and they have acknowledged you by your full call sign. "Aircraft calling [insert name here] tower, please say again.", does not constitute "radio contact".

That being said, I think I answered "yes". :eek: Subtract one from yes and add one for the no's.
 
Just took the written...this is the way it is! Only establish radio contact. Radio contact at a minimum would be the controller saying your N number and standby.


While this is true because of the way the FAR is written I would heed Vic's advice.

I imagine you would be in for a less than pleasant day if you called approach, they acknowledged that call with your N number, you asked for a radio check and then blasted across the primary airport in the Class D.
 
Don't mix up TRSA's with Class D.
Also, don't mix up a TRSA and Class C.
Permission to enter with TRSA's approach control is somewhat optional-- only radio contact has to be established.
You don't need any permission to "enter" a TRSA as it isn't even classified airspace anymore and you won't find any FARs published pertaining to their regulation. Just establish communications to "participate" in the services it may provide in that area. Participation is absolutely optional.
Although sometimes you will hear "remain clear of the class C" upon contact.
Which is a whole other thing.
For Class D airspace, you had better get permission to enter, depart, or transit the area during their hours of operation.

Vic

All just airspace 101 that any pilot is supposed to know real well. The longer I am around, the more I'm sometimes alarmed at just how many people are flying around without the required information stored. I've only been a pilot for 17yrs. I still have a lot to learn.
Sorry Vic, I didn't mean to pick apart your post. You're da' man.
 
Very good, most of you got it

Here is the reg. Note that if you radio goes Tango Uniform, you can still enter Class D but you had better know the light signals.
FAA said:
§ 91.129 Operations in Class D airspace.

(a) General. Unless otherwise authorized or required by the ATC facility having jurisdiction over the Class D airspace area, each person operating an aircraft in Class D airspace must comply with the applicable provisions of this section. In addition, each person must comply with §§91.126 and 91.127. For the purpose of this section, the primary airport is the airport for which the Class D airspace area is designated. A satellite airport is any other airport within the Class D airspace area.

(b) Deviations. An operator may deviate from any provision of this section under the provisions of an ATC authorization issued by the ATC facility having jurisdiction over the airspace concerned. ATC may authorize a deviation on a continuing basis or for an individual flight, as appropriate.

(c) Communications. Each person operating an aircraft in Class D airspace must meet the following two-way radio communications requirements:

(1) Arrival or through flight. Each person must establish two-way radio communications with the ATC facility (including foreign ATC in the case of foreign airspace designated in the United States) providing air traffic services prior to entering that airspace and thereafter maintain those communications while within that airspace.

(2) Departing flight. Each person—

(i) From the primary airport or satellite airport with an operating control tower must establish and maintain two-way radio communications with the control tower, and thereafter as instructed by ATC while operating in the Class D airspace area; or

(ii) From a satellite airport without an operating control tower, must establish and maintain two-way radio communications with the ATC facility having jurisdiction over the Class D airspace area as soon as practicable after departing.

(d) Communications failure. Each person who operates an aircraft in a Class D airspace area must maintain two-way radio communications with the ATC facility having jurisdiction over that area.

(1) If the aircraft radio fails in flight under IFR, the pilot must comply with §91.185 of the part.

(2) If the aircraft radio fails in flight under VFR, the pilot in command may operate that aircraft and land if—

(i) Weather conditions are at or above basic VFR weather minimums;

(ii) Visual contact with the tower is maintained; and

(iii) A clearance to land is received.

(e) Minimum altitudes when operating to an airport in Class D airspace. (1) Unless required by the applicable distance-from-cloud criteria, each pilot operating a large or turbine-powered airplane must enter the traffic pattern at an altitude of at least 1,500 feet above the elevation of the airport and maintain at least 1,500 feet until further descent is required for a safe landing.

(2) Each pilot operating a large or turbine-powered airplane approaching to land on a runway served by an instrument approach procedure with vertical guidance, if the airplane is so equipped, must:

(i) Operate that airplane at an altitude at or above the glide path between the published final approach fix and the decision altitude (DA), or decision height (DH), as applicable; or

(ii) If compliance with the applicable distance-from-cloud criteria requires glide path interception closer in, operate that airplane at or above the glide path, between the point of interception of glide path and the DA or the DH.

(3) Each pilot operating an airplane approaching to land on a runway served by a visual approach slope indicator must maintain an altitude at or above the glide path until a lower altitude is necessary for a safe landing.

(4) Paragraphs (e)(2) and (e)(3) of this section do not prohibit normal bracketing maneuvers above or below the glide path that are conducted for the purpose of remaining on the glide path.

(f) Approaches. Except when conducting a circling approach under part 97 of this chapter or unless otherwise required by ATC, each pilot must—

(1) Circle the airport to the left, if operating an airplane; or

(2) Avoid the flow of fixed-wing aircraft, if operating a helicopter.

(g) Departures. No person may operate an aircraft departing from an airport except in compliance with the following:

(1) Each pilot must comply with any departure procedures established for that airport by the FAA.

(2) Unless otherwise required by the prescribed departure procedure for that airport or the applicable distance from clouds criteria, each pilot of a turbine-powered airplane and each pilot of a large airplane must climb to an altitude of 1,500 feet above the surface as rapidly as practicable.

(h) Noise abatement. Where a formal runway use program has been established by the FAA, each pilot of a large or turbine-powered airplane assigned a noise abatement runway by ATC must use that runway. However, consistent with the final authority of the pilot in command concerning the safe operation of the aircraft as prescribed in §91.3(a), ATC may assign a different runway if requested by the pilot in the interest of safety.

(i) Takeoff, landing, taxi clearance. No person may, at any airport with an operating control tower, operate an aircraft on a runway or taxiway, or take off or land an aircraft, unless an appropriate clearance is received from ATC. A clearance to “taxi to” the takeoff runway assigned to the aircraft is not a clearance to cross that assigned takeoff runway, or to taxi on that runway at any point, but is a clearance to cross other runways that intersect the taxi route to that assigned takeoff runway. A clearance to “taxi to” any point other than an assigned takeoff runway is clearance to cross all runways that intersect the taxi route to that point.

[Doc. No. 24458, 56 FR 65658, Dec. 17, 1991, as amended by Amdt. 91–234, 58 FR 48793, Sept. 20, 1993; Amdt. 91–296, 72 FR 31678, June 7, 2007]
 
You need no permission - only radio contact, an emergency (expect light signals), or pre-arranged entry (e.g. call ahead with a no-radio classic plane).

Example of confirmed radio contact:

Pilot - XYZ Tower, N1234 10 south with the numbers
Tower - N1234 stand by...

You may now enter the airspace.

This is a radical difference from class B where they may give you a vector into the airspace and then turn around and violate you for not having heard the words, "You are cleared into Class B airspace..."

Beware!
 
This is a radical difference from class B where they may give you a vector into the airspace and then turn around and violate you for not having heard the words, "You are cleared into Class B airspace..."
I'm not entirely sure about your interpretation the Class B issue. If I'm given a vector that will take me into the Class B and aren't give the magic words, I'll ask if I'm cleared into the Class B - 95% of the time I then get "Roger, Flight Design 621CT is cleared into the Class Bravo airspace." I do the same thing with the permanent "temporary" flight restriction above Pres Bush II's house here in Dallas - I'm often given vectors that take me through it but always ask if I'm cleared through.

HOWEVER, if ATC has you on radar contact (NXYZ is radar contact, X miles ....) and gives you a vector that takes you into the Class B, it's going to be hard for the FAA to bust you. Same with TFRs.

I guess the moral is what Reagan always said, "Trust but verify".

TODR
 
HOWEVER, if ATC has you on radar contact (NXYZ is radar contact, X miles ....) and gives you a vector that takes you into the Class B, it's going to be hard for the FAA to bust you. Same with TFRs.

Sorry TODR, but I'd hate for you to risk your license - it won't be hard AT ALL for the FAA to bust you in this case (if they want to). You didn't get the "magic words", and you (not the controller) are PIC. The FAA is prosecutor, judge, and jury in enforcement actions like this, and the regs clearly state that you must have explicit clearance to enter the Class B. You are correct on insisting on hearing the words, because it is your ticket...

Paul
 
I'm not entirely sure about your interpretation the Class B issue. If I'm given a vector that will take me into the Class B and aren't give the magic words, I'll ask if I'm cleared into the Class B - 95% of the time I then get "Roger, Flight Design 621CT is cleared into the Class Bravo airspace." I do the same thing with the permanent "temporary" flight restriction above Pres Bush II's house here in Dallas - I'm often given vectors that take me through it but always ask if I'm cleared through.

Yes, it is undoubtedly rare that they pull this silliness - but the U.S.A.F warned me about the possibility over 20 years ago and my flight instructor reiterated it just last year. You are quite correct to query them if they have not provided that clearance.

When in doubt, always ask ATC to shake the stick if they have control of your airplane. No shakey, your responsibility...

:D
 
I've been known to do a similar dance (confirmation) with early cancellations of IFR if they just try to dump me off without the magic words "IFR cancellation received". No way am I going to penetrate the Class B without hearing the explicit clearance. We've asked for that clearance a few times too.