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alpinelakespilot2000

Well Known Member
Hangar Building Question

Trying to plan ahead, I checked yesterday on hangar availability in my area well before I thought I'd need it. Ended up #10 on a waiting list at my local airport with low turnover. While the airport is "hoping" to build some more hangers in the "next 5 years," I'm not holding my breath. Consequently, I'm trying to look at other airports and other options. One option is to lease airport land and build private hangers. Has anyone else gone through this process at other airports? Are there any good reference sources that anyone is aware of that would give me some insight into whether or not this will be feasible in terms of cost to do (either independently or with a couple other interested parties) or red-tape to wade through?

I don't think I'll need a hangar for at least another year, maybe year and a half, but I'm going to be pretty bummed out if I finish and can't find anyplace reasonably close to keep my new plane sheltered!

Steve
 
I researched this topic quite extensively last year. After 4.5 years on my local airport's waiting list (when I owned my RV-6), I finally got a new hangar last year for my Rocket.

Much of it depends on your airport. Check with the airport board and ask the chairman if this is an option. Most lease you the land at a minimal rate for 25 years. Expect to turn over ownership of the hangar at the end of the lease.

My plan was (and still might be) to build a 60 X 60 hangar with doors on both ends with three other tenants. My break even point was about 13 years. Make your own assumptions about rental rates, upkeep, building maintenance, etc.

For most folks, this is not much of a viable option. You need to be able to fund all the upfront costs, hope you keep enough tenants around to pay for it, fix it when things break, and then hand the keys over to the airport at the end of the lease. Most folks either don't stay in one place, or stay in aviation long enough for it to be worthwhile.

If you are considering this, you might want to look at living in an airport community. At lease you'd have a better chance of making it financially viable.
 
Hangars at County Airports

We have a hangar at the county airport.
We built it. 42x42...45,000 7yrs ago.
It belongs to the airport....we don't pay personal property taxes on it.
We lease it for 10.00 per year.
We keep it up. and improve it.
We pay the insurance on it 550.00 per yr.
It can be sublet or sold. The lease that is.
In 25 yrs...we have the option of renting from the County for the going rate.
We fit 3 and sometimes 4 airplanes in it.
one high wing Kolb Slingshot
one Long-ez
two RV-6's
you do the math....one hell of a deal!!!
Maybe it wouldn't look so good if you had a big airplane and only could fit one airplane in it....so the RV's are another way to make flying cheaper. :)

Some comments:
you have to be able to pay for it upfront....I don't think banks would lend money on a lease.
It is wonderful we get to use it, but pay no pp taxes on it.
The county loves it to. They get to show it as an asset from day one.
Plus we bring $ to the local economy.

I love the idea of living on an Airpark....I hope it is my next move!
I want one like Roberta has........smile
Regards,
Bob Martin
RV-6
 
f1rocket said:
I researched this topic quite extensively last year. After 4.5 years on my local airport's waiting list (when I owned my RV-6), I finally got a new hangar last year for my Rocket.
Click to expand...

So what did you do with your -6 for those 4.5 years, Randy? Leave it outside? I'm not real fired up about that idea but would love to know if others have had to do this and how they minimized the wear and tear of weather.

Steve
 
Steve,

Where I live, being number 10 on our list would be something to jump up and down about! I asked out at the airport (GKY) a few weeks ago, and the list had about 65-people waiting, and they tried to tell me that whenever your number is called, you MUST have a flying aircraft to be considered (which I don't agree with, but oh well). And as you mentioned, turnover isn't very high at GKY either. GKY is only about 15-minutes from my house. When I get to that point, I suppose I will choose another option which would be to go up to the same airport that Jay Pratt and numerous other RV-er's are located at (T67). It is about a 45-50 minute drive as opposed to 15-minutes. Or, one other option is a buddy who has a large hangar about 1-hour from my house, up at 52F, where Doug Reeve's is based. This fella has a standing offer to let me rent out a portion of his hangar. When the time comes, it sure would be nice to be closer to home...but as you are finding out, that may not be the case. In the meantime, I'll keep buying Lotto tickets and hope for the best! If I win, I will buy me a place like Roberta's! Then I can live WITH my new plane :D
 
Hangar space

Chandler airport in AZ recently built hangars for purchase. Pretty pricey unless you get two or three involved and that adds to the complications.

Personally, airport living is the way to go. I have a place at Stellar airpark in Chandler AZ. I got in at a good time. Very nice to walk out the kitchen door and into the hangar. Unfortunately we don't have any lots left and the only houses for sale are starting at about 1.4 mil. My house has doubled in value in 3 years. Doesn't really mean anything cause I'm not leaving!!! The comraderie is incredible. If you need 3 people to help on something, you get six. Everything has a beer rating system. Goes like this, "yeah we'll help. Looks like a 3 beer job."

Several have thought about building a bank of hangars to lease but the cost has gotten out of hand with the code requirements.

Good luck on your efforts.

Darwin N. Barrie
P19
 
Unfortunately, airpark living is not an option unless I buy a couple hundred acres, build a runway, and then build a house--nothing remotely close to me in this regard!

Gary--Where are you on the 65-person waiting list around Arlington? A 10-person waiting list may not sound too bad, but the problem is that the county only has 14 hangars. It doesn't look good unless they build more. Like you, the next best alternative probably going to be about 45 minutes away... I guess I'll keep my fingers crossed and try to build a little slower! :(
 
alpinelakespilot2000 said:
So what did you do with your -6 for those 4.5 years, Randy? Leave it outside? I'm not real fired up about that idea but would love to know if others have had to do this and how they minimized the wear and tear of weather.

Steve
Click to expand...
I found as many RV buddies I could living in my general area and found someone willing to share a hangar for a year or two. I never had to keep it outside.
 
Thank you, Jay! I sure may need to take you up on that one of these days. The offer is MUCH appreciated!
 
All,
I revently purchased a lot on an airpark that is under development here in middle GA. I am in the early planning stages of my house and hangar and have a few questions.

1) Detached hangar versus part of the house hangar... I like the idea of having the house/hangar all one structure since it will likely save me a little on building costs. The HOA requires the outside of the hangar to match the house (which has to be stone or brick). However, I am wondering about insurance. Will I be able to get separate insurance for the hangar? If not, do I severly limit my options for finding homeowner's insurance (read monopoly pricing!)? Another issue here is taxes. If the hangar is attached and heated/cooled, the square footage of the hangar may go into the assessed value at the same rate as the house. This would significantly overstate the value of the property and up my taxes. A 2500 sq ft hangar is not worth as much as a 2500 sq ft house.

2) Does anyone know of a good website for home/hangar designs? I know about the steel building websites. However, since I will need to brick the outside, I am not sure I want to go that way.

3) Any other advice for building an airpard home/hangar would be appreciated.

Thanks,
 
Hangar homes

Hi Tony,

Good luck on your project. I live in an airpark. The hangar is attached to the house and is 1800 square feet. The only thing is, the city codes require a fire sprinkler system if the hangar is 3000 feet or more.

Insurance isn't an issue because your home owners (in most cases) doesn't cover any vehicles that are motor driven that are garaged or hangared at the home. The policies for those things cover them. So if your house burns down the airplane better be covered with an airplane policy!!! My insurance was not affected any more than if I didn't have a hangar.

My 2 cents worth, do an attached hangar. Much easier during bad weather. Start from scratch and design your own, starting with the hangar :D

Darwin N. Barrie
Chandler AZ
RV-7 N717EE
 
Combined hanger home

I just made comment on this in another thread, and wrote the same comment about wanting a combined hanger / house structure.

I had a airpark lot and plans at one time. I shelved my project because of time and all the travel I was doing at the time. I also had reservations about the airpark and the lot so I bailed. I ended up not building and sold the lot for a net gain, but one challenge I knew I would have if I did build was the combined house hanger structure.

I never checked insurance but can concur depending on local code, fire marshal etc... You will (may?) need fire walls, fire doors and fire proof glass. Fire walls by the way are more substantial than some dry wall. Also if there is living space above the hanger its a factor. The fire extinguisher system also sounds like a reasonable requirement as the was posted. All this stuff is expensive, but my give you better insurance rate.

Of course having your structure to code or using the structure as allowed by code affects insurance. I know some fellow home owners got around the code by calling it a garage or storage? However if you had a problem and the structure where not used to the code it was built may be a disaster.

I know many fires in typical homes come from garages. The insurance guys appraise a hanger as a greater risk than a garage proportional to the larger size. The people to talk to are fellow home owners and insurance underwriters. Some pick their gear option for their RV airplane project based on perceived insurance rates.

All the fire protection has something to do with calling it commercial or residential structure. Even if its a home hanger, when its too large or has a plane in it, than you need to build to commercial standards. The code I was working to required commercial standards if a plane (industrial equip) was in it and attached to living space. In addition to the fire stuff above you will need to wire in commercial conduits. Normally you can just string wire in the wall loose. Again more $$$$.

All this stuff is doable but is expensive and adds to the cost. Some home builders are not familiar with all this stuff so maybe a commercial builder would be better for the hanger section of the house. I would encourage you to build it to the way you want. At the same time you may be able to manipulate the code and eliminate all the requirements. George

PS. There are airpark home web sites that will have more info.
 
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I have a hangar/home in Wisconsin. It is the best way to go. The fire and building codes for this type of home are no different than any other home in WI. Insurance was never a problem and the rates are no differnt than a home with a garage. Insurance and assessments are based on living space and the rate for nonliving space is lower as any other type structure.

Your best source of information is to talk to owners in areas that you intend to build in. Here is a helpful link, if you have not already found it.

http://www.airporthomes.com/

If an airport home is your dream, go for it. It's completely doable and you will never regret it.

Roberta
Livin' the Dream

house20hb.jpg
 
Hangar

My 2880 sq ft hangar is 50 ft from my house . I have my home and hangar insured with Allstate and the hangar rider cost $39 a year and is listed as an outbuilding. A small attached hangar would be ok but a large hangar might look out of place. I have lived with my planes for 20 years now and it is great.
 
Your right about a large hangar on a small house looking out of place. That was a design consideration when we built our hangar home. Our lot was 150 feet wide with trees on both sides. A ranch style would have been too wide, but a story and a half gets dwarfed by the 42 foot wide hangar. To compensate for the largeness of the hangar, we offset the garage so it was only 36 ft wide in front, jogging out to 42 in the back by the hangar door. This kept the street side more proportionally in line. We wind up with a 22 X 36 ft garage area while the hangar portion is 24 X 42 ft. The whole area is clear of any support structure due to the enormous trusses used and allows us to manuever things about the garage/hangar unimpeded

We were able to produce a house that is over 2000 sq ft and a garage/hangar that is 1800 sq ft and still present a normal looking street side look. Our lower level is 1300, the upper is 750, and the finish basement is another 600 sq ft. My 600 sq ft shop is accessed from a 6.5 ft wide stairwell the leads to the hangar floor via double 36" doors.

A great place to build and fly airplanes!! And live, too!! Do I wish the hangar was a little bigger? Sometimes, but the one we have is large enough for any plane that will fly out of Air Troy, three cars, and all the junk we have collected over the years. We always have the option to build a second detached hangar. I really like parking behind the RV. It gives me a chance to check on things everyday and the plane never gets ignored or neglected.

Building the attached hangar does require the use of matching exterior sidings or bricks to maintain continuity, but, remember, part of this can be incorporated into the house. So you are not actually spending this money for all three or four sides for just the hangar. I would say the cost is comparable to building a detached hangar. The beauty and convenience outways any drawbacks (JMHO).

Roberta

scene3xc.jpg
 
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Airpark home

robertahegy said:
... That was a design consideration when we built our hangar home. Our lot was 150 feet wide with trees on both sides....
Click to expand...
You've got a real gem there, Roberta!
 
Roberta,
With all the snow I see in your picture and no paved taxiway out of your hanger, how much flying do you get to do in the winter? If I owned a home in an airpark in an area that had lots of snow, I would think it would be preferred to have paved taxiways and runways.

Rick Schwandt
RV-9A Fuselage
www.rjsflyer.com
 
We have a grass strip that some of us get out and snowblow the runway and our own taxiways. We usually can fly most of the winter, but there are times when we are earth bound due to snow. Spring thaw stops us for a week or two, also. Snowblowing removes most of the snow without wrecking the turf and the sun will sublime the rest of the snow. Generally, we are flying most anytime the current weather conditions permit. That photo was taken after a very unusually large snowfall. Right now, the the yard and runway looks more like the photo of the hangar side. No snow. All but two of the homes on Air Troy are next to the runway and the taxiways are short.

Roberta
 
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Airport homes

Hi. Don't hesitate to come over to Mallard's Landing, GA04, just south of Atlanta. there are lots of homes to get ideas, including ours. We've lived in 2 fly in communities, and have had both attached and detached hangars, and I absolutely love the attached hangar, and so does the family. Drop in, and we can talk RV's, especially RV-10. :)

Vic
 
Whats the deal?

Tony,
Where in middle Ga?
you said, under developement, is it a good time to get in on a lot?
whats the deal? Wouldn't you want a bunch of RV folks around? <smile>
Bob Martin
RV-6
Louisa VA
 
middle GA

Bob,
Tony and I both have lots in the development about 15 miles south of Macon. You can email me at [email protected] if you want more info. I think there are a couple airstrip-side lots left.
Bruce
RV9
 
airpark living

Bruce and Tony,
I sent you and email, Thanks.

I'm in the construction business building apartments and I'd say, don't let firewalls or supression systems detour your plans, normally they aren't that expensive and the peace of mind is worth it. Most all houses with attached garages or basement or lower level garages already have some sort of firewall assembly built in.
this must be an exciting time in your aviation life.....enjoy it!!
Bob Martin
RV-6
 
Thanks to all who replied

Thanks to all who replied.

Bob,
Sorry I didn't get back to you sooner. I am on a trip out on the west coast and haven't had time to check in. If Bruce didn't answer all your questions, I'll be glad to try ([email protected]).

Bruce,
Thanks for jumping in.

Vic,
Mallards Landing is really nice. I visited there a year ago when my wife and I were still in Louisiana but trying to move to the Atlanta area. I loved it and would probably have tried to move there if we had gotten a job nearby. I talked to someone out by the tennis courts who mentioned someone there was building an RV10. Perhaps that was you. I'd love to stop by and see your project sometime. I'm already hinting to my wife that the 10 may be next! You have to start lobbying early for these things you know! :) My wife and I like to go up to Atlanta frequently (except for all that construction on the weekends that cuts 85 down to one lane!).
Is there someone there (perhaps you) that Bruce and I could come up and talk to and get some ideas on Do's and Don't's for building an airpark home in Georgia?
 
Hangar dilema

Hi,
I know your dilema from experience, and I'll tell you how I solved mine.I built a house in an airpark in North Carolina (Winston-Salem area) about 8 years ago. I had already started an RV-4 in the basement of my "old" house, and was absolutly convinced it had to be in an attached hanger at the new airpark location.I spent many evenings designing the new house on paper, and building models,ect. The end result has given me 8 years of total bliss...even know I havent flown the -4 yet! I settled for a 32'x28' attached hangar that looks like a 3 car garage with a 28' roll-up door made for it.I have 11' cielings and 10' clearance, so there is plenty of room for an RV. All insulated and sheetrocked.Also, I gained a 18'x28' room in my house above the hangar for the kids,ect. In North Carolina,hangar building codes are hard to apply to residential hangars...so its a garage! Talk to your insurance agent and see what your liabilities are there...The only draw-back I can think of to my hangar is ..I cant put bigger planes in it,however,I have 5 acres of land and a great spot for a big detatched if I need.Let me know if you would like some pictures..I'll send you some.
Good luck, Bill Englert
 
Bill,
Thanks for the info. Yes, I would love to see some pictures. Also, if you have any floor plan type drawings that are emailable, please send them along, too.

Thanks,
 
Airpark home in NC (6NC8)

hangar4gs.jpg
tophouse9in.jpg
frontside6jf.jpg
Here are some pics if they come through..I cant E-mail the plans, but I can get them to you if your interested.E-mail me direct at [email protected]s i cant get the pics to upload.
Bill Englert
 
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Airpark Homes and Hangars

I just found this thread...and do appreciate those who have posted photos of their homes with hangars. I'm just wondering if there's enough interest if Doug could possibly start a new section for those of our hobby who either are already living in a home with a hangar (attached or near) or who would have an interest in seeing what others have built.
Doug, maybe you could put it under "Activity Specific" forums, since there are only two Forums there and this would seem to be a good fit. If I may suggest a little more, let's not restrict it to just "Airpark Homes and Hangars." Maybe a Forum title of "Living with your RV" would be appropriate. That would include those living in airparks as well as those living on their own property.
 
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