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the_other_dougreeves

Well Known Member
From Aero-News Net:

Car Speeds Off FL Airpark Runway, Five Killed

Mon, 28 Jan '08
Details Sketchy On Incident At Jumbolair

Speeding down the runway at a private Florida airport community had tragic consequences for the five people inside a BMW, after the car ran off an embankment and flew 200 feet before impacting a tree.

The accident occurred early Saturday at Greystone Airport/Jumbolair Aviation Estates (FL17) near Ocala, reports to The Associated Press. All five men inside the car were killed, according to the Florida Highway Patrol.

It was not immediately known whether the 2008 BMW may have been racing a second automobile on the exclusive community's 7,550' runway (shown above). Residents say the vehicle may have gained access to the runway through an unlocked back gate.

The automobile apparently ran off the 85-foot-high embankment at the end of the runway. The car split in two when it hit the tree, ejecting three of the occupants.

"Portions of the vehicle were actually embedded into the oak tree," FHP Lieutenant Mike Burroughs told The Orlando Sentinel. "They were airborne the entire time.

"It's too early in the investigation to determine a speed and also to determine whether seat belts were in use at the time of the crash," Burroughs said, adding "There was no visible signs" that alcohol was involved.

The FHP identified the victims Sunday as driver Joshua D. Ammirato, 18; James Devon Hime, 19; Isaac Rubin, 20; Jacob J. Casey, 19; and Dustin J. Dawe, who had just celebrated his 19th birthday on Friday.

Jumbolair is arguably best-known for one of its residents, actor John Travolta, who also keeps his private Boeing 707 at the airport.
 
Real sad part is he was on an airport.

News flash--------"Keep our kids safe, close airports":mad:
 
I have seen that embankment at Jumbleair. It is concrete and slopes up just like some sort of ramp at the end of a very long runway. I guess this incident was just waiting to happen.
Oh, and I just realized that when we were there we just drove onto the property through the open main gate. No security in sight.
 
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Car crash at Jumbolair

Another sobering aspect can be found here where the young driver was apparently a participant on a message board like this one.

I participate on the COPA (Cirrus) website as well as here, and the interesting observation has been made that COPA members, although they are a probably a majority of Cirrus pilots, are only involved in something like 5% of the known incidents/accidents.

A similar trend was noticed years ago with the American Yankee Association, IIRC.

Community standards, even virtual ones, really can alter behavior, although in this case it appears to have been too little, too late.
 
more ammo for the people opposed to the local Airport

M5DAL said:
This is such a tragedy. I am very upset by this.

Why was he allowed to drive it on a #$!@*% runway at 3AM? Maybe some of the authorites might like to answer that.

Out on the road he could have taken his chances. We cant do much about that. We can control other environments though.

These cars are not designed for airstrips. Planes are for that."
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it's a terrible tragedy that 5 young men had to die, because 1 irresponsible parent deems it OK to buy his 18 year old son a 500hp sports car to keep up his image. and that kid thinks it's somehow OK to break into an airfield and try to hit top speed WITH 4 OTHER PEOPLE IN THE CAR..

i admire the fact that he sought out a strip of asphalt that would be empty, as opposed to trying that stupidity on the open road, but an unfamiliar unlit airstrip that you don't even know how long it is, or how quickly that strip would run out at those 100+mph speeds.... c'mon.

my prayers are with the families and friends of the young men who perished in that fantastic act of macho stupidity.

as someone who works for Younglife, and therefore is constantly working with highschool aged kids, i know that "macho" feeling of "hey, check this out" all to well.. and i know (first hand) how devastating this kind of tragedy can be to the families, as well as the friends..

PARENTS PLEASE EDUCATE YOUR KIDS ON THE CONSEQUENCES OF THEIR CHOICES. :)

and pilots, please educate your acquaintances on the joys and benefits of local airports and private airparks!! ;)
 
flyeyes said:
Community standards, even virtual ones, really can alter behavior, although in this case it appears to have been too little, too late.
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i read thru that whole thread, and all of AmericanM5's post's.. (americanM5 is Josh, the driver of that car)

most of the other users maturely cautioned him about being 18 and owning/operating a 500hp monster.. he responded, as you would expect an 18 year old to respond, but apparently didn't heed their warnings.

to be honest, i don't think there is to much more they could have said to prevent him from his death that night..

he was a member of the forum for only 6 days total, his last post was 1 day and a few hours before the accident..
 
imac said:
i read thru that whole thread, and all of AmericanM5's post's.. (americanM5 is Josh, the driver of that car)

most of the other users maturely cautioned him about being 18 and owning/operating a 500hp monster.. he responded, as you would expect an 18 year old to respond, but apparently didn't heed their warnings.

to be honest, i don't think there is to much more they could have said to prevent him from his death that night..

he was a member of the forum for only 6 days total, his last post was 1 day and a few hours before the accident..
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I think this is the post that you are speaking of:

AmericanM5 said:
"M5froth I completley understand where you are coming from assuming that I am irresponsible..that is definetly understandable. I do sometimes make bad decisions but I am young and I do drive safe and I will not endanger the lives of others..and I hope you are not under the impression that I am the one to brag, I have never been that way and never will. Plus I will have pictures up asap with me in the pictures. I have no reason to lie buddy.
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If only it were true. So sad.
 
yep

that's the one... only i think you captured his emotions better than i did.

americanM5 said:
i will not endanger the lives of others
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that is very humbling to me, cause a few years back that should've been me.. when i used to stunt motorcycles..



i hope that the reverberations of this tragedy do not end as quickly as these young men's lives did.. i hope that their untimely deaths can profoundly impact other youths who are into the street racing/car-modding scene. and give them a true sense of what it really means to be safe
 
I am glad that he did not do this on a public street where he could have killed an entire family (ies).
 
hmmmmm

when i tell people i fly all they can think of is a crash. when i tell them i cover 100 miles a week on my bike they say how great that is. i know i am 10 times more likely to be run over by these thoughtless types riding my bike (pedal type)than i am to die flying a plane.

i am overly exposed to the kids that do this kind of ****. alot of them film it and put it on youtube. They are worse now than ever and parents dont think anything about buying them cars with turbos and superchargers. the new mustang has 540 hp some were complaining because the new camaro is ONLY gonna have 400 hp.:rolleyes: Not a week goes by that one of my students doesnt get a speeding ticket. or at least it seems.
 
Parents!

In my growing up in the UK I didn't know anyone that could AFFORD to drive under the age of 21 and the thought of a parent actually buying their kid a car (any sort of car!) was unheard of.

Over here we hand them out to 12 year olds like they were confetti!

As long as they have their God given right to flaunt their money than I gues this carnage will continue.....High schools with have parking places for students..Hello!!!!
 
Why not a Pinto

When I was 18, I owned the fastest car I could buy with my own (earned) money. That happened to be a 1974 pinto with 110HP (I think).

When I think of how crazy I drove that car, I seriously doubt I would have survived if my parents had sprung for a Vette or a Porsche.
 
I had a worn out '79 Chevy pickup (this was in '89) with 130,000 miles on it because that's all I could afford - and I drove it hard enough as it was to get myself in plenty of trouble. I probably wouldn't be around today if I had a blank checkbook at my disposal back then.

When I got my drivers license my parents made me the deal that they would pay for my insurance until I got my first ticket. That lasted 5 weeks.
 
airguy said:
When I got my drivers license my parents made me the deal that they would pay for my insurance until I got my first ticket. That lasted 5 weeks.
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I did it a little different. My kids had to pay for their own insurance, but I let them ride on my policy until they did something that effected the rates. After that they were on their own.
 
I bought my $800 '85 VW Golf when I was 17, then two 110hp Saturns, (All were totalled, my fault on the VW)... Now at 22 do I own my dream, turbo, 2001 VW GTi of 1.8L and 150HP...

It may seem cynical, but Darwinism plays it's role...
 
I guess we can

only hope that what they innevitably do is tame enough to not cause injury but bad enough to shock them out of irresponsibility.

A few years back we had 4 kids around here roll a PU truck...two of them riding in the back of course...2 dead I believe....Such a waste.

Purely personally but there is no way they would be on my insurance, in fact while they were underage and living in my house they wouldn't be driving on their own period!

The potential liability of losing my house and garnished wages due to the likelyhood of one of my kids hurting someone is just too big a risk.

But thats my position FWIW.

Frank
 
When you talk about teens and too much power remember that many motorsport series have teens racing - including F1 and lots of road racing series (Grand-Am/Rolex). Age isn't the issue, it's how you approach and manage the risks.

Driving a M5 with 4 passengers down a runway at 3:30am is not good risk management. But a 900Hp, 1300lb car doing 190+ mph on a closed road course with other professional drivers on it ...sounds fine to me.

TODR
 
The thing about insurance is...

In my state (MO): children of the age of 16, with or without a license, living in your house, under your guardianship, are on your policy whether you want them or not, whether they drive or not, as long as their address is the same as yours. Insurance companies won't let you say that the kid will never drive your vehicles. They believe that statement to be a lie, having heard it many times and getting stung by it.

I wasn't going to let my girls get their licenses at 16 so that I could keep them safer a little longer, let them mature a little more, and to avoid the huge increase in premium. The insurance company put them on my policy even with no license or even a learner's permit.

So, I took them out in the snow with rear wheel drive, disabled the ABS, over controlled the vehicle, demonstrated recovery techniques, and then made them do the same things until I was satisfied. It generally made them cautious. But, they were girls... I remember being a teen age boy... My first car was a '59 VW Beetle that would only do 50mph straight and level, 55mph downhill, but I still managed to do some things that would scare me today.

Thank goodness most of us live through it. I thoroughly enjoy reading the VAF posts by all those who obviously did.

I feel for the families and the kids of that crash.
 
It is a tragedy for 5 young men to die so needlessly.

This may not have helped in this situation, but NE just passed a law where you have to be 18 to have passengers other than family members. I think it is a good law. Basically, it models the "Student Pilot" portion of our PPLs.
 
I bought my son (almost 20 years ago now) an old 300D Mercedes. I figured it was the slowest and most crash-worthy car out there. He never crashed it (thank God) but did manage one speeding ticket. He admitted to "blowing it out" about once a month and somehow managed 90 mph out of it on a night when a policeman was about. Claimed he learned from me.... Couldn't argue that one. Buying a kid a rocket is asking for trouble. I feel so sorry for all the parents involved. Devastating.

Bob Kelly
 
Being 20 years old and I hear these kinds of stories pretty much on a daily basis considering it seems like one out of every 3 students here at school has a Crotch Rocket. I have to agree with the other doug reeves in that it is all how you approach and manage your risks. Now for me I drive a dodge ram so theres not much to get in trouble with there however in 2006 my roomate (20 years old at the time)and I took our Aero Clubs Pitts S2-B from Daytona beach fl to Grayson County Tx for Aerobatic Nationals. Now with an aircraft like that and all the time we spent it in that week there were many times when we could have done something incredibly stupid getting ourselves in alot of trouble or even killing ourselves. It wasnt worth it one bit, we knew that we were going to have plenty of fun flying at nationals so there was no use in breaking any flying rules on the way to and from just to get one more thrill in. Took off climbed to alt and cruised for our 1.2 hours of fuel before another fuel stop. (Ya it took quite a few stops) I guess what im trying to say is that its all in the way that people approach the situations they are given, some make smart descisions and some dont.
david
 
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