KALEWIS

KALEWIS

Well Known Member
For those of us who are filling 5 gal jugs of 91+ octane from the "gas station", are there any concerns of getting low grade that was left in the hose/pump handle from the previous customer?? I would imagine there may be a gallon at least in the hose from the pump to the fill handle, maybe more. If you fill two five gallon jugs, that is possibly 2 gal of 87 in with the total of 10 gal of 93. That is 20% 87 !! (possibly) Not sure what the reduced octane level would be, if any.

One fix would be to put the first gallon or so in your vehicle, then fill the 5 gal jug. hmmm.

Anyway, just a thought. We are working on a 30-40 gal barrel with a manual pump to fill the -12 tank with.
 
No worries, there would not be enough lower grade to cause a problem. If you fill two cans only one hose full of lower grade would make it into your first can. I would be more concerned about contamination than a cup or two of regular.
 
Last edited:
I think I recall that the system actually sucks the fuel back out of the hose for safety reasons. In either case I doubt there is a enough to make much difference. I would be much more concerned about the huge difference in the quality of auto fuel that can occur even week to week at the same station. There was a interesting special on a few years ago where they purchased and tested auto gas from many different stations. Premium might be premium but then again it often was not when tested. There may or may not be ethanol in the fuel regardless of what the pump states. Formulations certainly change each season but could be completely different again week to week. This can have a major effect on vapor pressure ect...

George
 
I assume you are talking Auto gas with ethanol ?

I occasionally get zero ethanol and at all of the stations I have located it, it is a separate pump from all the other fuels.
 
A 5/8" ID hose twenty feet long would hold 0.32 gallon. A 0.5 inch diameter hose would hold 0.2 gallon.
I assume the selector valve is in the dispensing pump so the hose length is from maybe the base of that up to above your head then down to the nozzle.
 
keep buying that "better" gas, but I hope what happened to me doesn't happen to you!!!
i went to an EXXON gas station with brand new, never used, 5 gal gas can. filled em up. drove stright to airport, filled my gas tank. took off, after about 5-10 minutes my engine just quit! luckly I was able to land in a hay field that was freshly cut and bailed. no damage except for the unexplainable teeth marks in my seat cushion!!! cause? over a pint of water was drained from my fuel system. got gas in another brand new 5 gal can, flew out and now only buy from airports. so far, no more engine out problems. physically, no problems, mentally....... every take off now I think about engine out. not fun.
 
Hey Fred -- -

I fill my 6 gallon plastic cans, then at the airport, use a Mr. Funnel into my Fast-Flo can for putting into the plane. Mr. Funnel would have let you know you had water. I know it takes an extra step, but my fuel goes thru a screen in Mr. Funnel for an extra step of filtering also. It does work, and will let you know if there is ANY water in the gas. Works well, and really does not add that much time. Maybe 1 - 2 minutes for each can full.

John Bender
 
Mr. Funnel would have let you know you had water. thats good that you transfer to another can, i guess, but what about the dummy like me who does not have mr funnel.

does mr funnel tell you before or after the water has passed into your tank? or does mr funnel shut off asap and keeps the water out? if not,
now you have to drain the fuel system. you can "cheat" on car gas for your car. nothing to loose if or when your car engine fails. these are airplanes we are messing with, a lot different.
 
I have a Mr Funnel, and use it only to drain the dregs from my 5 gal bottles. I figure if there is any **** or water it's in the 1/2 gal or so in the bottom. I find the Mr Funnel a pain even for that small use as it tends to spill out when removing it from inlet. Also should there be a pint or more of water it's only going to catch the first 1/2 cup or so. I rely on running my pump and drain sampling at the gascolater after fueling and before each flight.
I agree that the gas station is a pain also, but it beats using 100ll.
Dick Seiders
 
After refueling find something to inspect, check weather, flight plan or chat with pilots for 15 min. Then sump the tanks. In 225 hrs of flying I may have found only 1/2 oz of water if added up from all my samples. I still sump them every time. If one does not have 15 minutes, one definitely won't have the time it takes to get out of that field. Let's keep insurance costs down and live longer.
 
Alcohol/ water in fuel

JBPILOT said:
I fill my 6 gallon plastic cans, then at the airport, use a Mr. Funnel into my Fast-Flo can for putting into the plane. Mr. Funnel would have let you know you had water.
Click to expand...

Sorry for the thread deviation but I have to ask this:

1. I have never heard of the Mr. Funnel. Very cool!

2. Does everyone know that ethanol has a wonderful affinity for water? Well, has anyone thought of POURING some water IN the gas, slosh it around and either drain it somehow (put in a drain plug) or use the Mr funnel to remove the alcohol AND water? Wonder if the alcohol would stay attached to the water molecule and not drain through...
 
VETE76 said:
keep buying that "better" gas, but I hope what happened to me doesn't happen to you!!!
i went to an EXXON gas station with brand new, never used, 5 gal gas can. filled em up. drove stright to airport, filled my gas tank. took off, after about 5-10 minutes my engine just quit! luckly I was able to land in a hay field that was freshly cut and bailed. no damage except for the unexplainable teeth marks in my seat cushion!!! cause? over a pint of water was drained from my fuel system. got gas in another brand new 5 gal can, flew out and now only buy from airports. so far, no more engine out problems. physically, no problems, mentally....... every take off now I think about engine out. not fun.
Click to expand...

It's bad that the gas station sold you contaminated gas. I hope you aren't blaming them for your failure to preflight the fuel tanks. This happens at airports as well so buying at an airport still doesn't relieve the pilot of his responsibilities.

-Andy
 
I bought my RV from the builder and he often used zero-ethanol from his local gas station. He always used a Mr Funnel. I bought a Mr Funnel as soon as I decided there would be times when I would use zero-ethanol from my local gas station.

The Mr Funnel has a very fine filter down the center. You pour fuel into the funnel and only what can pass thru the filter will reached the center and down the funnel spout. (you can google for a video demonstration). Water and debris are filtered at the funnel and do not enter your tanks.
 
Always sump the tanks before flying

I use high octane ethanol free car gas in my left tank and aviation 100LL fuel in my right tank. I take off and land with the aviation fuel. I have done this from day one. I now have close to around 600 hrs. I have always used a Mr. Funnel when pouring the car gas. After adding the car gas I sump the tank. I occasionally get up to a half inch of water during the sump. On one sump I ended up getting about three fuel tubes full of water out of the tank. I have never gotten any water from the aviation fuel side.

I try to never take off with out sumping the tanks. To me that is more important than using the Mr. Funnel.
 
I do my best to follow a similar line as Bobby and Wayne. On cross country stops, I fuel as soon as I land and then get my snack, bio-break etc. then sump as part of my standard pre-flight. That gives the new fuel a good 15+ minutes to rests and settle. I'm going to be taking an extended cross-country in a month. I think I'll pack my Mr Funnel. While it may slow my refueling. Little, it won't be any slower than what the tank baffles cause.
 
I made a commitment a long time ago to make sure my fuel is clean, dry, and fresh.

fuel_tank.JPG


I have pumped about 6500 gallons of fuel though this baby, over hauled it 3 times. Change both filters every 6 months. My grandkids fly with me.
 
Last edited:
Dave12 said:
Very nice Larry, Details????? Where did that tank come from, capacity, etc.??????
Click to expand...

The tank is an old 100 gallon diesel tank off an 18 wheeler. I bought the trailer, the12v electric pump, and the fuel meter new at the local farm store. I have two 10 micron water filters on the system.

I always run the fuel back into the tank to flush it out at the beginning of any flying day.
 
Sooooo, regading sumping in an RV-12

Given that an RV-12 built per plans does not have a tank sump per se, my question is this: will water in the tank go as far as the gascolator on its own?
 
Farm fuel

I do agree that we need to be careful out there. I have even burnt farm purple in both my 7ECA and 7 GCAA yrs back and never had a problem.

Now if there is all of this water from the auto fuel, than why are there not cars stopped in the middle of the highway from water contamination? How many of us have had our vehicles quit due to bad fuel?

The risk is always there but from the better stations it is probably not any higher than buying av gas. My citabira ran better on the cheap farm fuel than on the 100 LL
 
Dgamble said:
Given that an RV-12 built per plans does not have a tank sump per se, my question is this: will water in the tank go as far as the gascolator on its own?
Click to expand...

The Gasolator should be lower than the tank. I believe there is only one since the wings are removable. I had an Aero commander Darter (Think Cessna 172 only not as popular) and it ONLY had a gasolator. Worked just fine. When I ran auto fuel (had the STC) it sumped the water out just fine. i would have still used the "Mr Funnel" if I had known about it.
 
RECOMMENDED MODEL?

As there are many models of Mr Funnel available, please advise which one you are using. Thanks.
 
Subwaybob said:
Sorry for the thread deviation but I have to ask this:

1. I have never heard of the Mr. Funnel. Very cool!

2. Does everyone know that ethanol has a wonderful affinity for water? Well, has anyone thought of POURING some water IN the gas, slosh it around and either drain it somehow (put in a drain plug) or use the Mr funnel to remove the alcohol AND water? Wonder if the alcohol would stay attached to the water molecule and not drain through...
Click to expand...
Bob,

I think that if you were to pour water in fuel with ethanol with the intent of getting the ethanol out, then you would have a lower octane fuel in the end. So, unless you were mixing the end product with 100LL you would end up with a fuel not up to the task for the Rotax 912ULS. Sounds like a lot work plus I could never bring myself to deliberately put water in fuel.
 
No cars stopped because of water

Hi from what i recall most cars pick up the fuel from a port off the bottom. I think my dad told me long ago that 1 to 2 gallons of gas is never used. In fact, he told me if I ever ran out of gas in my car, to urinate in the tank and then drive to a station. Never tried this though.
 
Not that it is important here - but

modern cars do suck gas off the very bottom of the tank. Just put a pump in a Regal recently.

John Bender
 
johnny stick said:
Hi from what i recall most cars pick up the fuel from a port off the bottom. I think my dad told me long ago that 1 to 2 gallons of gas is never used. In fact, he told me if I ever ran out of gas in my car, to urinate in the tank and then drive to a station. Never tried this though.
Click to expand...
Johnny,

Now that would be sa sight to see! Worthy of You Tube for sure.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.