A

alpinelakespilot2000

Well Known Member
Whenever I crimp a 22AWG wire into a red terminal I'm always thinking: "not much wire for the terminal to grab onto. I wonder if this thing is going to hold."

Is it good (or not good) practice to strip extra insulation away and double over the wire before inserting it into the terminal and crimping it? It seems like the terminal has more to grab onto doing it this way, but perhaps somewhere there is a prohibition against doing this?

Any thoughts? Thanks.
 
alpinelakespilot2000 said:
...Is it good (or not good) practice to strip extra insulation away and double over the wire before inserting it into the terminal and crimping it? ...
Click to expand...

Steve,

I would do a pull test on the connection. If it does not pull out, you are fine, you may want to use heat shrink tubing to provide some support for the wire itself (depending on the application).

Adding extra wire (folding over) will not buy you any additional strength if the pull test passed in the first place.

... those are my thoughts.
 
alpinelakespilot2000 said:
Is it good (or not good) practice to strip extra insulation away and double over the wire before inserting it into the terminal and crimping it? It seems like the terminal has more to grab onto doing it this way, but perhaps somewhere there is a prohibition against doing this?

Any thoughts? Thanks.
Click to expand...

I have no idea is the aviation wiring bible is for or against the practice, but I have been doing it for a lot of years, and never had an issue.

As was stated, pull on the finished connection------all of them.
 
I don't know which crimps you use, but I use the type that have an additional crimp on the wires insulation. I get these at the local FBO.
They are a pink color & see thru.

L.Adamson
 
Use Amp PIDG or Equivilant Terminals.

The price for the terminals are reasonable.

You should not need to fold your wires with the correct terminals.

Tech Pages http://www.gen-aircraft-hardware.com/images/pdf/ampring&splice.pdf

The cost for the tool (p/n 59824-1) to do the crimp on the wire and the insulation at the same time properly is "Not Cheap" nor will a cheap one do that specific job as well.
 
Last edited:
I have Stein's crimper and Stein's pink terminals, so I'm good to go on the quality part. It's pretty hard to make a bad crimp with them, and I have pull tested every single crimp I've made.

My only question was whether there is anything to gain by doubling the wire over before crimping and whether it is even "permissable" to do so.
 
alpinelakespilot2000 said:
I have Stein's crimper and Stein's pink terminals, so I'm good to go on the quality part. It's pretty hard to make a bad crimp with them, and I have pull tested every single crimp I've made.

My only question was whether there is anything to gain by doubling the wire over before crimping and whether it is even "permissable" to do so.
Click to expand...

I don't think you have a problem with doubling the wire. "PERMISSIBLE" is up to you.

I had to think long and hard before I decided to SOLDER all of my terminals. I use the crimp on connectors but cut off the insulation, insert the wire and give an easy crimp. Then solder, not to wick past the barrel. Then it is covered with a layer of heat shrink for support. Right or wrong, I feel good about my connections and have had no problems.

Having said that, everyone seems to get by just fine with just a good crimp and a pull test.

A bad crimp will create resistance and will change the reading of any gauge that reads resistance.
 
gasman said:
I don't think you have a problem with doubling the wire. "PERMISSIBLE" is up to you.

I had to think long and hard before I decided to SOLDER all of my terminals. I use the crimp on connectors but cut off the insulation, insert the wire and give an easy crimp. Then solder, not to wick past the barrel. Then it is covered with a layer of heat shrink for support. Right or wrong, I feel good about my connections and have had no problems.

Having said that, everyone seems to get by just fine with just a good crimp and a pull test.

A bad crimp will create resistance and will change the reading of any gauge that reads resistance.
Click to expand...


Stand back! You are about to get buried in replies, all telling you the many reasons you should not have soldered your terminals.
 
Steve,

In regards to doubling over the wire - logically speaking, you're not weakening the wire where the strands enter the insulation. So long as the crimp grips and the barrel holds, I'd say you're ok to do that.

On a side note: I went to great pains to calculate my wire needs and set about purchasing 25ft of 22AWG, 15ft of 20AWG, 22ft of 18AWG, 10ft of 16AWG, etc. For those who are getting ready to wire their aircraft - may I suggest you consolidate your wiring? Why buy 22AWG, 20AWG, and 18AWG in various lengths when 18AWG will handle all of those needs? We don't have so much wire in our aircraft that the extra weight would be even three pounds additional for upsizing a few wire runs. Purchase a couple of spools of 18AWG and 12AWG. That should be satisfactory to carry the majority of your electrical needs with the exception of some of the wiring on the firewall side.
 
I never use anything smaller than 20 AWG simply for the ease of using it.
 
FredMagare said:
Steve,

On a side note: I went to great pains to calculate my wire needs and set about purchasing 25ft of 22AWG, 15ft of 20AWG, 22ft of 18AWG, 10ft of 16AWG, etc. For those who are getting ready to wire their aircraft - may I suggest you consolidate your wiring? Why buy 22AWG, 20AWG, and 18AWG in various lengths when 18AWG will handle all of those needs? We don't have so much wire in our aircraft that the extra weight would be even three pounds additional for upsizing a few wire runs. Purchase a couple of spools of 18AWG and 12AWG. That should be satisfactory to carry the majority of your electrical needs with the exception of some of the wiring on the firewall side.
Click to expand...

If you end up installing audio panels to coms, etc; you'll end up with at least #22 ( maximum) to fit into the small pins.

L.Adamson --- RV6A
 
gasman said:
I don't think you have a problem with doubling the wire. "PERMISSIBLE" is up to you.

I had to think long and hard before I decided to SOLDER all of my terminals. I use the crimp on connectors but cut off the insulation, insert the wire and give an easy crimp. Then solder, not to wick past the barrel. Then it is covered with a layer of heat shrink for support. Right or wrong, I feel good about my connections and have had no problems.

Having said that, everyone seems to get by just fine with just a good crimp and a pull test.

A bad crimp will create resistance and will change the reading of any gauge that reads resistance.
Click to expand...

That's a good one, I do the same thing. I don't believe in butt connectors either, I solder. Oh and connectors, forget it, I solder wires together. I guess with 30 years in automotive, I got tired of corroded wires and wires that brake off of the connector. Never had troubles with solder, I guess I know how to do it.
 
GAHco said:
The price for the terminals are reasonable.

You should not need to fold your wires with the correct terminals.

Tech Pages http://www.gen-aircraft-hardware.com/images/pdf/ampring&splice.pdf

The cost for the tool (p/n 59824-1) to do the crimp on the wire and the insulation at the same time properly is "Not Cheap" nor will a cheap one do that specific job as well.
Click to expand...

True and False both.

While it's true that the PIDG terminals are really the only way to go, It's false that you need to buy a high buck crimper to crimp them with. There is no good reason to spend $275 on a crimper for the AMP terminals when it's been well proven that a $50 ish crimper will do the same job. Sure, if you are like us that do literally thousands of crimps every month, every year you will wear out the cheap tool after 5 thousand or so crimps. Also, all "cheap ones" are not created equal. Luckily, our own Bob Nuckolls did enough scientific homework and studies to figure out which cheap crimpers to use. For the average homebuilder, the lower cost crimpers will work just fine. Not the auto parts store type, but a tested one. They are available from a number of companies and I guarantee you they'll work fine. I do agree the high $$ terminals are a good tool for sure, but just not something the average homebuilder really needs to purchase. Put the extra $200 towards other goodies! :)

My 2 cents as usual!

Cheers,
Stein
 
L.Adamson said:
If you end up installing audio panels to coms, etc; you'll end up with at least #22 ( maximum) to fit into the small pins.

L.Adamson --- RV6A
Click to expand...

True - and I have tools to install those pins but wiring harnesses are available. My suggestion is merely to simplify installation and avoid collecting eight different sizes of wire when two or three will suffice for the majority of what we'll install and is not meant as the "only" way to accomplish the task.
 
Wire Crimps

Bob Knuchols has done the bend the wire over trick many times too. And he has probably crimped on more terminals than many of us combined (except Stein). Where he said to do it is when you are crimping a terminal on a 22 awg wire, but only have a blue terminal. Go ahead and use the blue terminal, just 'fatten' up the wire by stipping more insulation and bending it over on itself. Make sure to give it the pull test. PIDG is what Bob recommends and you can buy them (and other good stuff) at Mouser as well as your aviation electrical suppliers.

Scott
 
Thanks guys. I had thought I had read it somewhere before from someone authoritative, I just hadn't remembered where. Now that I think about it, I think it was in one of Bob Nuckoll's helpful pdf's.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.