Best formation card

[fehdxl]

Which formation card is better, FAST or FFI? And why?

FAST -or- FFI

Thanks for your thoughts!

-Jim

[Capflyer]

Originally Posted by fehdxl

Which formation card is better, FAST or FFI? And why?

I think the Red Star group (Yaks, CJ's, etc.) which uses FAST has laminated cards so they are probably better quality than the paper FFI cards issued from Falcon at FFI.

Seriously though, it doesn't matter. They both accomplish the same thing and there are plenty of RV'ers out there with FAST cards. Some of the RV formation teams my require you to have an FFI card to fly in air shows with them but from the FAA's perspective they are both equal.

[flyride]

FAST requires ex-military aircraft. FFI was created "for the rest of us"

The programs are very similar. Going through the FFI program in RV's, you will fly in standard formations to aerobatic maneuvering limits. Many FAST programs do not train to that performance level.

FFI and FAST are equivalent in the eyes of the FAA and at airshows. The flight lead always has final say on the makeup of his or her flight. Some warbird formations require a type patch, which essentially signifies a checkride in the make and model.

Tim Redden
FFI Flight Lead

[Stu McCurdy]

Originally Posted by flyride

FAST requires ex-military aircraft. FFI was created "for the rest of us"

The programs are very similar. Going through the FFI program in RV's, you will fly in standard formations to aerobatic maneuvering limits. Many FAST programs do not train to that performance level.

FFI and FAST are equivalent in the eyes of the FAA and at airshows. The flight lead always has final say on the makeup of his or her flight. Some warbird formations require a type patch, which essentially signifies a checkride in the make and model.

Tim Redden
FFI Flight Lead

As previously stated, FAST and FFI are parallel programs and both cards allow formation flying in Waivered Airspace. Originally, FAST was for Warbirds and FFI was for Experimetals and GA. When Jeff Weller took over at FAA he allowed FAST to issue cards to other planes. FFI remains as is with emphasis on RVs and Bonanzas. FFI programs toward a formation card is very tight with a Procedures Manual describing required maneuvers. The evaluation requires Airshow Quality formation flying.

Under FARs, anyone can fly formation in their airplane as long as it is briefed. To fly formation in FAA Waivered Airspace, FAA requires a formation card issued by an agency authorized by FAA. FFI only evaluates pilots recommended by one of its Flight Leads and evaluates as though the next formation flight will be at an airshow in front of FAA and 10,000 people.

[fehdxl]

Originally Posted by flyride

...FAST requires ex-military aircraft...

Tim, I know this is not true. FAST is all inclusive, as Stu also indicated.

Originally Posted by Stu McCurdy

...FFI programs toward a formation card is very tight with a Procedures Manual describing required maneuvers...

Stu, How can I obtain a copy of your procedures manual?


All,

Thanks for the info thus far.

Since either card in the end is equivalent in the FAA's eyes, I should have asked which program is better leading up the checkride? I'm considering things such as training materials, sylabus, training standards, instructor/checkpilot availablility, cost, currency requirements, etc, etc, etc.

Fly safe,

-Jim

P.S. I still like Scott's answer. :-)

[Kahuna]

Actually a better question is, who do you for have local resources for training and preparing you for formation flight?
The key to success is whom do you have to train you locally. It wont matter what their card says and it does not matter what your background is. Local training and practice is the key to success.

[N520TX]

Originally Posted by fehdxl

Stu, How can I obtain a copy of your procedures manual?

Current versions of FFI documentation are posted on the Falcon Flight web site - http://www.falconflight.aero/Paperwork.html.

Note that FFI cards are also laminated ;o)

--Ron

[fehdxl]

Thanks Ron. Wonder why googling FFI or formation flying inc doesn't depict the site you provided...weird. Thanks again, Jim

[Snowflake]

Another option: Swift Formation Committee (SFC), which is a FAST signatory as well. Swifts fly a hair slower than RV's but are great formation partners. Our local group only had Swift people handy when we started and we still fly with them regularly.

Google for Swift Museum Foundation, I don't have a link for their website handy.