How do you Navigate the Los Angeles area?

Tom McCutcheon · #1 08-02-2006, 07:10 PM

We are flying our RV-4's from Vancouver WA (near Portland OR.) in September. I haven't done this for 17 or 18 years. Can anyone tell us the best way to get from the Bakersfield area to Long Beach. I've been through the VFR Coridor and that was a hassle a long time ago. We will be flying VFR. Is VFR flight following commonly available? Any suggestions would be helpful.

Thanks
Tom

dan · #2 08-02-2006, 07:15 PM

Depends on which corridor you used. The SFRA (Special Flight Rules Area) is trivial. Fly to Santa Monica VOR (SMO, 110.8), tune in 128.55, and squawk 1201. Fly the 132 radial until you're south of LAX, announcing your position as you go. Squawk 1200 when you're done and call LGB tower.

Another way to go is around to the north. Fly toward downtown LA at 2000'. Follow the 60 freeway to the 710 freeway. Talk to El Monte (EMT)tower on 121.2 and tell 'em you're transitioning eastbound along the 60 at 2000'. Freq change when you're clear of their Class D, then call LGB tower inbound.

How's this for an offer...let me know when you're coming and from roughly which direction, and I will escort you to LGB. All you have to do is fly off my wing.

Bob Axsom · #3 08-02-2006, 08:51 PM

From Arkansas - It is something to do your homework for and the VFR solutions are varied including just going over the top or under the base (from VTU) of the Class B out toward Catalina and coming in from the island.

Otherwise, coming down from Bakersfield you will be going over Gorman VOR an through the pass toward Van Nuys. Be sure you have a good plan for the class B and the Burbank class C Airspace. Using the old "LA corridor" Dan described is best if the weather is compatible with a 3,500ft flight in that area. The problem is getting into it. The top of Burbank is 4800ft and the floor of the class B over the Santa Monica Mountains was 5,000ft (they play with this from time to time so you need to get the current limits nailed down). My approach was to fly at the lowest appropriate altitude for my direction of flight above 4,800ft over the Burbank airspace until a point where I can descend to 4,900ft for 2 minutes or less before passing under the Class B airspace which was defined by a radial off of Ventura which youy will be too low to receive. You need a good defining land mark for the co-located Class B north and Burbank Class C south boundaries or a GPS moving map that shows you these boundaries the danger is getting too high and clipping the LAX Class B or descending into the Burbank Class C. I found a reservoir up on the north side of the hills was a good visual reference for the boundary. Once I passed the bounday in VFR weather I made a rapid descent to 3,500ft and follow the radial south as Dan described. I stay up there until clear of Torrance airspace then descend to the west out over the ocean and call SoCal approach for that area to get into Long Beach.

If the weather is not cooperating for the corridor I turn east as soon as I come over the San Fernando Valley and follow the high mountains. There is a major freeway near the foothills called the I-210 and I stay to the left of it to be sure I'm out of everyone's airspace. I also stay above 4,800 ft until I have passed passed the Rose Bowl and I know I am clear of Burbank's Class C before descending. I go farther east than Dan but that's just me. I go the El Monte but I stay at 3,500ft and I don't call them. I fly 150 degrees to the Rose Hills Cemetery on a 1,300+ft hill near the 60 freeway and I-605 and call SoCall Approach as I getting into that area. This gets a little tricky because of El Monte's Class D, Fullerton's Class D, the Disneyland TFR, and the Class B airspace. Perhaps Dan's suggestion is best as far as calling El Monte Tower is concerned, they will give you a SOCal Frequency to call as you leave their airspace and it kind of gives you a warm and fuzzy feeling as you start talking to the controllers.

Bob Axsom

jtrusso · #4 08-02-2006, 09:07 PM

I fly out of both Santa Monica (noth of the Class B) and Torrance (south of the Class B). For what it's worth, when I'm coming from the north I take the Special Flight Rules at 3,500, following the procedure Dan mentioned. Once you pass the "Candy Canes" (red and white stripped smoke stacks on the coast just south of LAX, can't miss them) you'll be clear of the LAX Class B. Continue south, turning east just a bit aiming for the east side of the Palos Verdes pennisula, it's the big hill in front of you. Maintain at least 2,500 and you'll be clear of the TOA airspace, and contact LGB tower, telling them you're inbound from the north-west. You'll most likely get a downwind entry to 25L. You'll enter the pattern flying just north of signal hill which will probably be you're reporting point.

Flying Dan's other suggestion, crusing just north of dowtown LA at 2,000 feet is definitley the scenic route, and a lot of fun. However if you're not familiar with the area and the airspace it might be a bit challenging. But if you take Dan up on his offer not only will it be a piece of cake, it should also be a lot of fun.

cwoodyfly2001 · #5 08-02-2006, 09:46 PM

I have the privilege of flying in and out of LGB about every weekend and it is a very very busy area... LGB is probably my least favorite airport to fly into for trying not to get hit by someone... Any given day there is always someone lost and not were they are supposed to be... I have had more TCAS RA in and out of Long Beach than all other airports combined.. The good part is that is is a very beautiful area of the country...
Just do what you have been trained to do and enjoy yourself..
Cwoodyfly2001

tin man · #6 08-02-2006, 10:56 PM

If you are depending on a computer forum for advice stay home. Sit down with an instructor you trust and ask him/her to walk you thru the process. Explain your PERSONAL LIMITS and plan accordingly.
Sorry if this sounds harsh.
Tom
northern california

dan · #7 08-02-2006, 11:02 PM

Tom, ignore the discouragement and the overly complex answers. Just get yourself an LA Terminal Chart. There is lots of "airspace" but it's not really any more complicated than anything else. On the back of the chart you'll see the various transitions.

Drop me some email as the date gets closer and I'll help you out...SIMPLY.

Tom McCutcheon · #8 08-03-2006, 03:12 AM

Thank you Dan and the others very much for the help. And, don't wory, I'm not descouraged by the one negative note. I have several thousand hours, instrument & commercial rated. However, I always learn something when I go somewhere unfamiliar by just asking questions and listening. Actually I've flown many times into Long Beach from up here. But since it has been quite a while, I thought I would ask the question. We ordered the TCA chart a couple of days ago but the sectional showed the the L.A. TCA larger than I remembered. So, I asked the question here and (as is expected and is usually the rule) all but one of you were very helpful.

We would go IFR except that our planes are not legally equiped and my son doesn't have the rating. Moving maps sure are nice though. Thank you again for all the help.

szicree · #9 08-05-2006, 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dan

Tom, ignore the discouragement and the overly complex answers.

I feel like I've gotta comment on this one. The original poster said that he was coming from Oregon, which I figure is significantly less congested than SoCal, and that he hadn't done so in 18 years. He also revealed some lack of familiarity by asking if VFR flight following is available. The post that advised him not to rely on this forum, but to instead have a sit-down with a qualified instructor is not at all negative, just conservative. As a low time pilot myself who has flown the LAX corridor, I have to say it can be a bit intimidating. I'm sure some will read this and decide I'm not a "real pilot" for admitting a weakness, but I plan on living to 100 and part of my strategy is to keep from getting in over my head by being honest about my limitations. I'm not trying to spoil anybody's good time, but this is deadly serious stuff.

As an example, even though I'm low in total time, I have logged a significant amount of acro. I sought out the right training and now am comfortable with basic loops, rolls, spins, etc. My honest feeling is that, for me now, a loop is no harder than most other things you do in a plane. But should I pass this opinion on to a newbie? Telling a stranger to ignore the advice of other experienced pilots seems a bit too much in something as dangerous as flying.

David-aviator · #10 08-05-2006, 03:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tom McCutcheon

Thank you Dan and the others very much for the help. And, don't wory, I'm not descouraged by the one negative note. I have several thousand hours, instrument & commercial rated. However, I always learn something when I go somewhere unfamiliar by just asking questions and listening. Actually I've flown many times into Long Beach from up here. But since it has been quite a while, I thought I would ask the question. We ordered the TCA chart a couple of days ago but the sectional showed the the L.A. TCA larger than I remembered. So, I asked the question here and (as is expected and is usually the rule) all but one of you were very helpful.

We would go IFR except that our planes are not legally equiped and my son doesn't have the rating. Moving maps sure are nice though. Thank you again for all the help.

Tom, the last time we visited my oldest son who lives south of Long Beach and flies out of Fall Brook, he gave me the LA VFR local area chart to hang on our wall in Missouri. It is indeed interesting and could be intimidating, but after a bit of study, very straight forward and no big deal. Makes for good conversation in the mid west where things are not quite so crowded.

With a bit planning, you won't have a problem. Might even be fun.

dd