IO-360-L2A

[David Johnson]

All,

I have the chance to get a 2000 TTSN IO-360-L2A (180 HP) from a friend's 172SP. He's changing it out for a new one right at TBO, even though it's still running fine and oil and filter analysis are clean. He has flown it as much as 300 hours a year since new, so it's had plenty of exercise. I have a few of questions for the group.

First, is there any reason why the L2A variant would not be desirable, other than not being set up for a constant speed prop? I was planning to go with a fixed pitch prop anyway. Any problems with the sump arrangement or accessory mounting that would prove difficult for an RV-7A on this engine?

Second, Lycoming charges a $10,000 core charge with his new engine until they get the old one back. I am considering offering him the $10,000, plus a little bit, in lieu of getting his core charge back from Lycoming so I can get it. Are there any obvious problems with this scheme? Seems like a reasonable deal for a good engine.

Third, I plan to overhaul it before I hang it on the plane, with the help of a trusted A&P with lots of engine experience. I'll send all components out for inspection, replacing items as required. I'll send the cylinders out for overhaul at a well regarded shop in the area as well. The purpose is not to save money, but to learn that engine inside and out. Any guesstimates as to the cost of the inspections and cylinder overhauls, assuming all parts check out OK?

Thanks for the help!
Dave

[Mel]

Dave,
I'm not familiar with the L2A as far as fit goes, but there is nothing wrong with a 2000 hr engine that has been properly cared for. My O-320 had 2500 hrs. when I bought it and ran it for another 300+ hrs before overhaul. And even then, when I tore it down, (2815 hrs) it was running great and every part was within tolerance. I rebuilt it primarily to increase hp.

[David Johnson]

I agree with you, Mel. I'm an advocate of "on condition" overhauls. The bottom end of the engine will tell you when it needs attention through oil analysis or visible metal in the filter. I very well may elect to not overhaul it until after it's been on the nose a while.

Dave

[David Johnson]

Originally Posted by cytoxin

what all it comes with. but if your gonna pay 10,000 plus some you may as well buy a new superior SL or the like at 19,500 and know its all new. starter mags, c/s crank, carb, in the end you may save 5000 at best. why would you pay more than the core anyway? unless your just gonna stick it on there as is..which as mel said an option.

Thank you for your thoughts. All options are being carefully considered at this point, including the Superior build course. There are 2 objective considerations here. One is that I am trying to keep this project on a cash basis, which means that cost savings, while not paramount to safety, is an important consideration for me. If I do save $5000 on the engine, I've just paid for a Garmin 430.

The second consideration is the learning process. I would very much like to gain the experience of overhauling a Lycoming properly. The Superior build program is excellent, but assembling a new engine is a fairly straightforward process compared with overhauling an engine. Overhauling requires more effort to tear down and inspect all components, plus requires additional decision making to determine what must be done to get the engine up to standards. Plus, as you and Mel say, I may have the chance to get a few hundred (or more) "free", safe hours out of it before overhaul, so that's attractive too.

Paying slightly more than the core charge (like $500) is a courtesy to a friend for being kind enough to deal with sitting on the engine for a couple of weeks while I arrange to bring it home. It would be easier for him to just let Lycoming take care of it. Plus, I know the history of this engine and know how it was flown. At $10,500, it's still less costly than other IO-360s of similar time I've seen, though admittedly I haven't shopped around much.

Again, thanks for your thoughts. I appreciate the input very much. Any potential flaws in my thinking are definitely open for dialog.

Cheers,
Dave

[aadamson]

Originally Posted by David Johnson

All,

I have the chance to get a 2000 TTSN IO-360-L2A (180 HP) from a friend's 172SP. He's changing it out for a new one right at TBO, even though it's still running fine and oil and filter analysis are clean. He has flown it as much as 300 hours a year since new, so it's had plenty of exercise. I have a few of questions for the group.

First, is there any reason why the L2A variant would not be desirable, other than not being set up for a constant speed prop? I was planning to go with a fixed pitch prop anyway. Any problems with the sump arrangement or accessory mounting that would prove difficult for an RV-7A on this engine?

Second, Lycoming charges a $10,000 core charge with his new engine until they get the old one back. I am considering offering him the $10,000, plus a little bit, in lieu of getting his core charge back from Lycoming so I can get it. Are there any obvious problems with this scheme? Seems like a reasonable deal for a good engine.

Third, I plan to overhaul it before I hang it on the plane, with the help of a trusted A&P with lots of engine experience. I'll send all components out for inspection, replacing items as required. I'll send the cylinders out for overhaul at a well regarded shop in the area as well. The purpose is not to save money, but to learn that engine inside and out. Any guesstimates as to the cost of the inspections and cylinder overhauls, assuming all parts check out OK?

Thanks for the help!
Dave

Dave, that's the new engine the Lycoming did for the Cessna 172's It's on both the 160HP and 180HP models. It's a 180, but they derate it with prop on the 160 models.

I suspect that you won't get any accesories. Most of the time, when you order a new engine from Lycoming, they come with none unless you order them. These accessories will include starter, alternator, mags, fuel pump, may also include injectors and spider (because Cessna changed it out due to some early fuel lock problems (ask me cuz I know)).

Also, the L2A's if on a Cessna are *dual* vacuum pump engines. The second accessory pad has a second pump attached.

So it will depend heavily on what you get vs. what you don't as to the value. That 10K, could easily be 15K that you'd have to invest to get what you need to *really* install it.

As for fit, I have no idea, a call to Vans would answer that I would assume... Or Lycoming to find out "which" type of Dynafocal mount it requires.

Good luck, you may have a deal, but then again, you may not. You need to be very clear about what you get vs. what you don't.

Also don't forget, the owner would have to ship the core back, and shipping would be out of his pocket. I doubt that is cheap with todays fuel costs.

[David Johnson]

Thanks Alan. That's helpful info. I know that the owner is planning to have all new accessories installed, but I will clarify what will come on the engine for sure. Thanks for pointing that out.

I will also check with either Van's and/or my local Cessna shop to see what mount it uses.

Dave

[CraigC]

David,

With the little spurt of Lycoming engine failures where the prop comes off the crank, I might wait a bit to see which serial numbers might be affected. Also, a lower time engine might be found for that same price. Just a few thoughts to ponder. Nice pictures from OSH too.

[David Johnson]

Ahhh...Craig! Fancy meeting you here. Didn't we just tip a few margaritas last week????

Dave