Have to ask... why V-routes?

Echo Tango · #1 10-22-2012, 11:43 AM

I work at a small-ish approach control in MI (for another week

) and I have to ask, what's with all of the (50% or more) /G (gps equipment suffix) aircraft flying V-routes

Correct me if I'm wrong, but radar monitoring is an approved means of secondary navigation. If you've been radar ID'd by ATC, why not just go D-> ?

JonJay · #2 10-22-2012, 12:03 PM

I am no expert, and usually go direct by the way, but the V routes typically are the most direct route with the least amount of exposure to terrain, MOA's, etc....
I rarely fly them, but always look at the V routes when I am flight planning. I figure somebody figured them out for a reason ( I think they date back to the USPS for mail carrying. )

bkthomps · #3 10-22-2012, 12:22 PM

lost comms is always a consideration

rleffler · #4 10-22-2012, 12:24 PM

As former ATC, I too also have asked that question as well. I think the answer is that it depends. Most of it depends on preffered routing in congested areas.

I can file OSU > LUK and get that route. I filed the return as LUK > OSU, but I got something back like LUK > CVG > Vxxx ..... It took me ten minutes to look up all the way points to program into the 430 when I got my clearance. I never flew that routing. I basically got vectors towards the north, then direct. Plus I can't image that they really wanted me over CVG.

I've flown to Lousiana and back using all direct waypoints. I got diverted to a airway south of Birmingham to avoid some ground fires, but after 10 minutes got cleared direct again.

I've flown to OSH via direct routes, except when crossing Lake Michigan.

I've been told that in certain parts of the northeast, all you are going to get in certain areas are airways due to congestion and preffered routing.

That's one reason why I'm installing a 650 in my RV-10. Rubber banding an airway is so much nicer than programming all those way points on a 430.

Bob Axsom · #5 10-22-2012, 12:37 PM

What do you care what someone else thinks is important to control the destiny of their flight? GPS can and does fail. I fly with the VORs and Victor Airways as primary and the GPS as a backup situational awareness crutch and I don't give a ____ that you want to blissfully go it your way blasting through controlled airspace with no advanced preparation, etc, etc. I am restraining myself!

Bob Axsom

MarkW · #6 10-22-2012, 01:47 PM

When I first started flying IFR I tried direct and most times was given a Victor airway. I have given up and just file with airways. Sometimes they give me a direct to cut a corner and sometimes I ask.
I fly the Southeast coast and around MCO and JAX I guess it is busy and they prefer we use airways.

Lemmingman · #7 10-22-2012, 02:06 PM

During my training it was suggested that I choose V-routes for safety. If I filed a VFR flight plan using V-routes and needed SAR to come find me, they would have a much easier time finding me if I am along a V-route. Sounded good to me at the time.

Echo Tango · #8 10-22-2012, 02:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bob Axsom

What do you care what someone else thinks is important to control the destiny of their flight? GPS can and does fail. I fly with the VORs and Victor Airways as primary and the GPS as a backup situational awareness crutch and I don't give a ____ that you want to blissfully go it your way blasting through controlled airspace with no advanced preparation, etc, etc. I am restraining myself!

Bob Axsom

the reason i ask, is generally when i inquire whether the a/c wants Direct to destination or not, they almost always gleefully reply with a "YES!" i'm just trying to figure out the rationale behind filing airways. i understand that in some places aircraft are cleared via preferred routing and there isn't much getting around it.

to counter the point that if GPS does fail, you're being worked by ATC anyway, and that's your backup. "fly heading XXX, vector for CVG, advise when able to resume own navigation." disclaimer: radar does stink in some areas but this will also be going away with ADS-B for the most part.

as far as controlled airspace goes, if you're in contact with ATC on an IFR flightplan, it's not really your job to avoid anything other than VFR a/c

and on a final note, last i read, something like 50% of VORs are being scrapped anyway.

Echo Tango · #9 10-22-2012, 02:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lemmingman

During my training it was suggested that I choose V-routes for safety. If I filed a VFR flight plan using V-routes and needed SAR to come find me, they would have a much easier time finding me if I am along a V-route. Sounded good to me at the time.

i understand that as far as flying VFR goes, but not when you're on an IFR flight plan and receiving radar services. simultaneous loss of comm/radar is a very big deal and SAR would be initiated immediately.

Echo Tango · #10 10-22-2012, 02:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarkW

When I first started flying IFR I tried direct and most times was given a Victor airway. I have given up and just file with airways. Sometimes they give me a direct to cut a corner and sometimes I ask.
I fly the Southeast coast and around MCO and JAX I guess it is busy and they prefer we use airways.

you could always put a remark in your flightplan, "request direct routing when available." or "NATCA supporter." i've seen that one before. i wonder how far he made it going direct ORD

in all seriousness though, i do understand the preferential routing thing, but those aren't really what i'm talking about as most a/c i see on V-routes aren't on any routing we are familiar with (we have certain agreements with surrounding facilities about which routes to use for busy airspace/avoidance).

my suggestion would be to just file whatever route you want to fly, and take whatever route is given. doesn't really matter if you're on V-routes to MCO, if they're not the right V-routes.