VansAirForceForums  
Home > VansAirForceForums

- POSTING RULES
- Donate yearly (please).
- Advertise in here!

- Today's Posts | Insert Pics

  #11  
Old 09-20-2012, 11:26 AM
N427EF N427EF is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,516
Default What kind of mogas?

Allen,
you being located in CA. what kind of mogas are you running on, E10 presume?
__________________
Ernst Freitag
RV-8 finished (sold)
RV-10 Flyer 600 plus hours
Running on E10 mogas
Don't believe everything you know.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 09-20-2012, 11:35 AM
Mark33's Avatar
Mark33 Mark33 is offline
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Baton Rouge, La.
Posts: 753
Default Avgas VS Mogas

This is a good thread http://www.vansairforce.com/communit...ad.php?t=87674 if you haven't already read it. In most cases, as you probably already know, it's not so much the mogas itself but the design of the fuel delivery system that's important regarding the ability to burn mogas safely. It appears as though that most people that's experiencing problems associated with mogas are related to, in one way or another, vapor lock. This can be overcome with a proper fuel delivery system which incorporates electric fuel pumps and a return line from the tank you're drawing the fuel from. The key is a constant flow of cool fuel which will virtually eliminate the possibility of vapor lock. In my 7, I'm incorporating two electric fuel pumps (one primary and one backup), and return fuel lines via an Andair duplex selector, and I have the pumps mounted below the lowest level of the fuel tanks so that they are always pushing fuel, not pulling it. My pump flows 30 GPH and just returns the unused fuel back to the tank from which it's drawn, so I'll always have cool fuel going to the engine. I hope to make my first flight by December and I intend on burning mogas exclusively.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 09-20-2012, 12:42 PM
ABRV4 ABRV4 is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 70
Default Logistics

OK, so it seems that mogas will work fine in our engines. My field only sells 100LL and the nearest non-alcoholic gas is 10 miles away. So how do you transport it to your plane? Multiple trips with 5 gallon cans in the family car or can you purchase a 55 gallon drum of the stuff?
Alan
RV-4
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 09-20-2012, 12:44 PM
pierre smith's Avatar
pierre smith pierre smith is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Louisville, Ga
Posts: 7,840
Default

Alan, I used to haul several 5 gallon cans in my truck, for the -6.

My -10 holds 60 gallons, so it's too much of a pain to haul at least half that in cans. So now just burn avgas at our local pump.

Best,
__________________
Pierre Smith
RV-10, 510 TT
RV6A (Sojourner) 180 HP, Catto 3 Bl (502Hrs), gone...and already missed
Air Tractor AT 502B PT 6-15 Sold
Air Tractor 402 PT-6-20 Sold
EAA Flight Advisor/CFI/Tech Counselor
Louisville, Ga

It's never skill or craftsmanship that completes airplanes, it's the will to do so,
Patrick Kenny, EAA 275132


Dues gladly paid!
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 09-20-2012, 12:56 PM
airguy's Avatar
airguy airguy is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Garden City, Tx
Posts: 5,147
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ABRV4 View Post
OK, so it seems that mogas will work fine in our engines. My field only sells 100LL and the nearest non-alcoholic gas is 10 miles away. So how do you transport it to your plane? Multiple trips with 5 gallon cans in the family car or can you purchase a 55 gallon drum of the stuff?
Alan
RV-4
Don't know where you are located, but here in Texas it's quite common to see pickups with 100-gallon tanks in the bed of the truck, usually for diesel fuel for agricultural use but could be any fuel. That's what I use. 12-volt electric pump and about a 15-foot hose and you're set. Just fill it up every so often in town.
__________________
Greg Niehues - SEL, IFR, Repairman Cert.
Garden City, TX VAF 2020 dues paid
N16GN flying 700 hrs and counting; IO360, SDS, WWRV200, Dynon HDX, 430W
Built an off-plan RV9A with too much fuel and too much HP. Should drop dead any minute now.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 09-20-2012, 10:19 PM
PerfTech's Avatar
PerfTech PerfTech is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Redlands, Ca.
Posts: 1,458
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by N427EF View Post
Allen,
you being located in CA. what kind of mogas are you running on, E10 presume?
...I actually haven't been using it but it is looking pretty good lately with the fuel prices going up & up....
__________________
Allan Nimmo
AntiSplatAero.com
Innovative Aircraft Safety
Products, Tools & Services
Info@AntiSplatAero.com
Southern California (KREI)
RV-9A / Edge-540
(909) 824-1020
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 09-21-2012, 06:32 AM
N427EF N427EF is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,516
Default

Allan,
when are you going to get started on that Ethanol tolerant mechanical fuel pump???
You are getting everything else right, how about it?
__________________
Ernst Freitag
RV-8 finished (sold)
RV-10 Flyer 600 plus hours
Running on E10 mogas
Don't believe everything you know.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 09-21-2012, 12:20 PM
Bevan Bevan is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: BC
Posts: 1,674
Default

The current standard mechanical fuel pumps found on many lycomings MAY or MAY NOT be alcohol tolerant. As I recall, the manufacturer just doesn't want to say one way or the other. Do I remember correctly that the guys is Brazil use the same pumps with their high alcohol content fuels and just change the pumps out after xxx number of hours?

I would like to see a comprehensive study/test to prove tolerance one way or the other. Allan????

Bevan
__________________
RV7A Flying since 2015
O-360-A1F6 (parallel valve) 180HP
Dual P-mags
Precision F.I. with AP purge valve
Vinyl Wrapped Exterior
Grand Rapids EFIS
Located in western Canada

Last edited by Bevan : 09-21-2012 at 12:26 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 09-21-2012, 04:29 PM
N427EF N427EF is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,516
Default

I have recently communicated with someone in Brazil to confirm this and get more info on their installations.
The fellow told me that they use avgas for the most part and only a certain type of crop duster was certified to use 100% ethanol.
I am trying to find out more about it.
The Vanguard squadron on the other hand has used a standard mechanical fuel pump and one electric pump for over 16 years and has reported no problems with the mechanical fuel pump. That formation team has used any and all combinations of fuel and ethanol for their airshow performances and suffered no fuel related problems.
__________________
Ernst Freitag
RV-8 finished (sold)
RV-10 Flyer 600 plus hours
Running on E10 mogas
Don't believe everything you know.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 09-21-2012, 06:52 PM
tsneidin tsneidin is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 118
Default My solution for getting auto fuel to the airport.

I bought a 14gal gas buddy:
http://www.amazon.com/Moeller-DuraMa.../dp/B000MT94QA

I recommend cutting the useless pump handle off as it just slows the transfer and is leaky.

I built a simple tripod to aid with lifting it above wing level. I lay the tripod on the ground, lay the gas caddy on it and then use the leverage of the overly long 2x4 main tripod leg to lift it into position. Look closely to see the hose is draining into the tank. I tend to keep the right tank mostly mogas and the left tank a mogas/100ll mix.
http://www.imgur.com/hJsv0.jpeg

I get dual use out of it by filling both the boat(marina gas is almost as expensive as 100ll) and the plane. It has paid for itself in a month or two. I figure flying is at least $10/hour less expensive using non-ethanol and my IO-360 couldn't care less. It still takes some muscle to move 14 gallons around but I still find it worthwhile.
__________________
Todd Neidinger
RV-9 Flying
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 08:39 AM.


The VAFForums come to you courtesy Delta Romeo, LLC. By viewing and participating in them you agree to build your plane using standardized methods and practices and to fly it safely and in accordance with the laws governing the country you are located in.