ECI Cermanil Cylinder Break In

rv7plt · #1 06-09-2012, 06:49 AM

I just replaced the cylinders on my IO360 200hp. I am now running ECI Freedom remanufactured cylinders with the nickel/graphite (Cermanil) bore. The cylinders came with break in instructions that say to use 65-75 percent power until oil usage stabilizes. I have 5 hrs on the cylinders now and the rings have not seated. The CHTs have not exceeded 370 degrees. I am wondering if I should now run at max power to seat the rings? That is the way I have broken in steel cylinders: run at max power with CHTs in the 400-450 degree range until the CHTs drop. The only problem is that by running at the high CHTs, the cylinders may glaze and the rings would never seat. Alternatively, I can continue to run at reduced power and hope that the rings seat. These cylinders supposedly have an easy break in. Anyone that has experience breaking in cermanil cylinders please chime in.

John Henley, RV7

Stu McCurdy · #2 06-09-2012, 07:22 AM

I replaced my high blow-by cylinders with ECI Titan cylinders. Now have about 500 hours on them. I started out using about 1 qt of oil at 10 hours, then 12, then 15, now 20 hours per qt. Big thing I noticed was that for first 25 hours I would reach high CHT (400) before I would get down to normal GPH on fuel flow. Gradually over time it got better, but it was not until about 50 hours that I could reach peak EGT by reducing fuel flow and still keep CHT below 400. Now I can run any fuel flow and keep CHT well below 400. My oil consumption it still 20 hrs/qt and my compression at last check was still 79/80 on all four.

DanBaier · #3 06-09-2012, 08:22 AM

I have 4 ECi cylinders (nickel carbide) that I replaced due to the AD. Initial ring seating was in about 3/10ths of an hour (by reference to drops in CHT and EGT across all 4 cylinders). The remarkable thing was that all four happened at just about the same time.

I think on a break in you want to achieve two things. 1) you need a lot of BMEP (pressure) in the cylinder to force the rings up against the cylinder wall to avoid glazing and 2) at the same time, you need to keep the temperatures low to avoid glazing. I think this is especially true when the cylinders have been replaced and not run on an engine in a test stand.

From reading your message, you may have taxied to the runway (CHTs may have gotten really hot) and while flying it doesn't sound like you've applied enough power. I'd try really pumping up the power - don't worry too much about the EGT - but limit the CHT to 400. For example, if you can go full throttle without hitting CHT of 400 - then that's the way to go.

I wish I could tell you that with only 5 hours you are okay - but it is possible the glazing has begun.

Dan

rocketbob · #4 06-09-2012, 10:29 AM

ECI now hones their cylinders with a plateau finsh so I expect they should break in within minutes like every other modern reciprocating engine made on the planet.

rv7plt · #5 06-09-2012, 11:40 AM

I have done everything humanly possible to avoid glazing. My inital engine start was followed by a one minute taxi and then airborne. At no time have I exceeded 380 begrees. I have run 24 squared for 45 minutes. I maybe I should run it oversquared at full throttle and a low enough rpm to keep the CHTs below 400.

John

mannanj · #6 06-09-2012, 11:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rocketbob

ECI now hones their cylinders with a plateau finsh so I expect they should break in within minutes like every other modern reciprocating engine made on the planet.

Bob:

How could you!???

You can't go exposing these myths that way!

. How can you expect an aircraft engine to be modern????

RV10inOz · #7 06-10-2012, 05:04 AM

Assuming you are running a break in oil, not a W100plus or similar, you should see most break in pretty quickly.

The best way to achieve this would be low level(28"MP), WOT, say 2500 RPM and 60-80F LOP.

This will be around 10.0 - 10.7 GPH.

Some folk will struggle with this concept.

Ironflight · #8 06-10-2012, 07:25 AM

I ran Cerminils for close to 1500 hours on the Valkyrie, and even though I followed the Mattituck break-in instructions to the letter, they never really got better than about 8 hours to the quart, and more like 6 most of the time. At the end, they just got worse and worse. these were circa 2005 jugs (group "A"s), and the rings at that time had a problem with delamination - unfortunately, ECI never made much noise about that problem (and I stay pretty tuned in to the experimental aviation world), so I never re-ringed them early on. Finally swapped them out with Lycoming jugs a few months ago, and can cut down on my oil orders for our fleet. re-honing the nickel jugs is not simple - takes a special diamond hone to do it right, from what I learned from ECI.

It will be interesting to see if your consumption improves with a bit more running.

Paul

rv7plt · #9 06-10-2012, 06:56 PM

I will try the low level at 28' MP AND 2500 RPM mate but I will back off at 400degrees CHT and I will run full rich for cooling. Will let you all know how it turns out.

Cheers,

John

RONSIM · #10 06-11-2012, 12:17 PM

Out the breather ---- Circa 2005 installed new ECI Cerminils (Group "A", in the AD) ---- at 125 hours (RV-10, IO540C4B5), still blowing oil like crazy ----- compressions are in mid 70s. ECI will not provide any warranty relief, so the owner is stuck----- I will probably install an oil separator, just to keep from dripping oil, from the belly, onto the hangar floor.