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  #11  
Old 10-19-2011, 07:38 PM
ArVeeNiner's Avatar
ArVeeNiner ArVeeNiner is offline
 
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Location: San Jose, CA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike S View Post
Did you mean to give one value in FT/LB, and the other in IN/LB???

50-70 ft/lbs seems like a lot for a 1/4" bolt.

Good luck.
Good catch! Thanks!
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Kelly Johnson
San Jose, CA
RV-9A

Pink slip issued: 5/7/12

First flight: 5/28/12, Memorial Day.

Phase I Complete: 8/18/12!

2020 donation: complete
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  #12  
Old 10-19-2011, 09:48 PM
pauldan181 pauldan181 is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 203
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Putting some sort of lube on the bolts is a good idea but I also swabbed some in the spar holes. I figured that if you only lubed the bolt, by the time it came through the last part of the hole all the lube sould be gone and that last inch would be dry.

FWIW I used DC33 low temp bearing grease, great stuff for a lot of applications.

Paul Danclovic
Jamestown NC
RV-8A N181SB
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  #13  
Old 10-19-2011, 10:00 PM
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Greg Arehart Greg Arehart is offline
 
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Location: Delta, CO/Atlin, BC
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I recall that it was difficult to impossible to get a torque wrench on most of the bottom nuts because of the gear towers (maybe a crowfoot wrench would work?). While ideal to torque these, the exact value, if I recall correctly, is not as critical as in other areas, since these bolts are in shear and not tension.

greg
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  #14  
Old 11-06-2011, 07:56 PM
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ArVeeNiner ArVeeNiner is offline
 
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Location: San Jose, CA
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Thumbs up Wings on and torqued

OK, last weekend I got the wings installed with bolts in the holes in about 4 hours.

Today, I got all the nuts installed and everything torqued. Really, it wasn't all that difficult. Now, changing the water pump on our old Plymouth Grand Voyager under a blue tarp in the rain...THAT was miserable!!! (We sold that car a couple of years later after the water pump leaked again!) This was nothing even close to that. The hype was worse than the work. Getting things all set up and started took a little bit of time but the learning curve is steep.

NOTE: Some of what follows doesn't apply to taildraggers.

Here are some of the things I learned from dealing with the bottom 8 bolts (4 per wing):

-I didn't have to make any special tools. Nothing was ground down or welded together. Standard tools worked fine.

-I used white grease on each bolt and never tried the Boelube. Worked great.

-I tried using a rubber mallet to get the bolts in the holes with limited success. Using a block of wood between a hammer and the bolt eventually split the wood. What worked best was at first, LIGHTLY tapping the head of the bolts with a ball peen hammer. You don't damage the bolt if you tap lightly. Make sure you have a wing shaker at the end of the wing.

-After a point, you won't be able to use the hammer anymore because the aileron push tube gets in the way. This is where you use the rivet gun. I once again used it directly on the bolt head. Tap lightly and you won't damage anything.

I used a very short flush rivet set in my gun which made this all possible. I got it at the Arlington Fly-In years ago but it looks like Avery sells something similar. The swivel rivet set that Avery sells won't let you get everything in place. It's too long.

-Like we've already established, you don't want to tap the bolts all the way through the holes. You only want two or three threads showing through the hole. Now, I would venture to say that this only applies to the two larger diameter bolts in the middle and not the two on the end but I played it safe and was very conservative with tapping them in.

-Before you put any bolts in the holes, measure the running torque of the nuts. You are then going to have to measure the running torque of the close tolerance bolts in the holes once they are installed as well. I measured one or two and then used a rough average for the rest. You'll need to add these values to the final torque.

-First thing after installing the front spar bolts (less nuts), install and torque up the rear spar bolts (one each wing) for flight. This will allow you to step on the wing making egress easier.

-Either leave the flaps off or leave them disconnected (at least on the 9A) so you can move a small ladder or step stool closer to the wing. This is easier than stepping on the step many many times.

-I never had to glue the nuts to Popsicle sticks. The hemostat method described below worked great.

-As was mentioned, start with installing and torquing the nuts from the outermost bolt to the innermost bolt. This gives you some room to work.

-Outermost bolts-

Hold the nut with a long pair of hemostats. No need to lock the hemostats.

I used an air ratchet on the head of the bolts to turn them initially.

Hold the nut in place with the hemostat or you can even remove the hemostat and hold the nut in place with a flat bladed screw driver. Once you have the nut held next to the bolt fire up the ratchet. Once you get it started, you might be able to spin the nut on with the screwdriver. I actually was able to get a wobbly, thin walled socket on one of the nuts far enough to hold it while I turned the bolt with the air ratchet.

So, run the nut up, tap the bolt a little further, run it up more, etc. I think I used a screwdriver to hold the nut while I torqued from the bolt head side. Easy.

-Bolts 2 and 3 from the outermost bolts (these are the big bolts)-

Same deal using the hemostats to get the nuts started but I used a regular ratchet with an 11/16 socket to turn the bolt. It takes a while but the nut will start. My air ratchet didn't have enough power to turn the big bolts.

After the nuts started, I was able to spin the nuts on almost all the way using just a flat bladed screwdriver. I think I was able to turn bolt number 3 with the tip of my finger.

Same deal as before, run up, tap the bolts farther using the rivet gun, run the nuts up some more, rinse, repeat.

I kept each nut from turning during torquing by jamming it with a flat bladed screw driver.

NOTE: I assumed the nut on the large bolts used the same size socket as the bolt heads. NOT SO! This caused me a scare with the top bolts. I put the 11/16" socket on one of the top nuts and tried to torque it. That won't work so well since the nut requires a 5/8" socket. You'll swear (literally) that you've stripped the outside of the nut. Well, you did but not enough to render it useless. Just remove the 11/16" socket and replace it with the 5/8" socket and continue torquing.

Bottom line, for the large bolts, use an 11/16" socket for the bolt head and a 5/8" socket for the nut.

-The innermost bolt-

This is another of the small bolts. I was able to install the nut using my fingers. I was also able to turn it with a box end wrench and hold it with that wrench while I torqued it from the bolt side.

-The rest of the bolts that aren't blocked by the gear leg weldment are torqued the standard way from the nut side. They require no special treatment.

-I used a tool bag to transport all the tools in and out of the plane. You're probably going to grab everything including the kitchen sink until you find a winning combination so having them in a single place is a good thing. Plus, it makes you less likely to drop a tool on a newly installed wing.

-Having a knowledgeable helper outside the plane would be a good thing but not necessary. I did all the nut installations solo.

Thanks for all the advice! I literally printed out this post and referenced it as I did the work.

Bottom line, it's not bad at all. Don't sweat it! Good luck!!
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Kelly Johnson
San Jose, CA
RV-9A

Pink slip issued: 5/7/12

First flight: 5/28/12, Memorial Day.

Phase I Complete: 8/18/12!

2020 donation: complete

Last edited by ArVeeNiner : 12-01-2015 at 01:49 PM.
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  #15  
Old 11-06-2011, 08:27 PM
hesty hesty is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Boulder City, NV
Posts: 44
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Thanks for all the insight! I am not quite to the point of wing install, but I just printed out your post and will reference it when the time comes. Thank goodness for VAF and the wonderful input the members take the time to submit. It has helped so much with my 7A project. Thanks ARVEENINER!
Chad
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  #16  
Old 11-06-2011, 09:22 PM
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ArVeeNiner ArVeeNiner is offline
 
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Location: San Jose, CA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hesty View Post
Thanks for all the insight! I am not quite to the point of wing install, but I just printed out your post and will reference it when the time comes. Thank goodness for VAF and the wonderful input the members take the time to submit. It has helped so much with my 7A project. Thanks ARVEENINER!
Chad
No problem. I like to share my experiences to make it easier for the next guy. Without VAF, I would have never attempted this airplane building stuff.
__________________
Kelly Johnson
San Jose, CA
RV-9A

Pink slip issued: 5/7/12

First flight: 5/28/12, Memorial Day.

Phase I Complete: 8/18/12!

2020 donation: complete
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