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  #31  
Old 12-20-2010, 06:40 AM
Bill.Peyton's Avatar
Bill.Peyton Bill.Peyton is offline
 
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Just to be clear on the GPS altitude readout in flight. My KLN94 has a serial input from the encoding altimeter. It also has a Baro set page on bootup and when using it for an IFR approach it prompts for the Baro setting. The KLN94 then reads out the encoders altitude being provided to the transponder, adjusted for Baro. When you have your IFR pitot static test done, one of the requirements is to provide a table of actual verses encoder reported altitude. If you copy that table and bring it with you in flight, you can correct for the errors of the encoder and get a pretty good verification of your altitude, verses your altimeter, which btw, should also have a cal table after a PS test. I always use this feature to verify I have a good altimeter setting when I am flying IFR.
With that said, this does you no good in terms of checking the static port in flight because you don't really know your actual altitude.
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  #32  
Old 12-20-2010, 10:04 AM
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clevtool clevtool is offline
 
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Default Cleaveland Ports

The ports with the flat face (as in our old photo) are the old ones.

The new ports are domes so that they further protrude into the air stream.
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  #33  
Old 12-20-2010, 01:35 PM
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Default Static and GPS

My BMA (and I'd bet most other panel mount systems) have a settings page for calibrating during the pitot/static check. The tech who did my initial check used his system to run my static system up to preset altitudes and we read the calibration numbers and entered them into an altitude table in my system. When done, he proceeded to do a normal check and my system checked out with 0 error at all altitudes. Hard to say about speed but my EFIS is in lockstep with my analog airspeed and my recorded indicated speeds are accurate enough for operations; at 8000+ feet I take airspeeds with a grain of salt anyway.
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  #34  
Old 12-20-2010, 06:33 PM
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RV10inOz RV10inOz is offline
 
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Flion and anyone else reading this.

READ THIS POST CAREFULLY

Do not assume your system is accurate just because you had your avionics checked by the avionics technician when you did your last AD Inst 8/9 or whatever you guys call it over there.

Your avionics as flion above points out above may be deadly accurate all the way to 20,000' and my Dynons were, better than the TSO'd Altimeter I have.

The problem is you are sitting in your hangar with a known static source testing your plane.

YOU ARE NOT dragging a static on a drogue 100 yards behind the plane comparing a "True and Known" static with the static in your aircraft at speed.

If you are not 100% sure of what I am saying go ask some test engineers to explain it better. Kevin Horton on this site is a classic for explaining it, search his name and threads.

Am I making myself clear. In flight static is not the same thing as when you get your altimetry checked out on the ground and can yield very big errors as I found when doing our test flights.

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  #35  
Old 12-20-2010, 07:24 PM
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G34U G34U is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rleffler View Post
Phil,

I don't have the links handy, but Tim had several write ups on his site. If my memory is correct, I think he ended up with the Cleaveland product and was fundemental in Cleaveland coming up with their second iteration of the product.

bob

p.s. I have these installed too.
I cant find the mentioned write ups. Can someone post the links ? Thank you.
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  #36  
Old 12-20-2010, 07:42 PM
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flion flion is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RV10inOz View Post
YOU ARE NOT dragging a static on a drogue 100 yards behind the plane comparing a "True and Known" static with the static in your aircraft at speed.
Your point is well taken. My -6A is flying using the Van's method of pop-rivet static ports and I see no altitude error at speed. However, I'll be sure to double check when I get the -10 flying, as I will be using the flush ports.
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  #37  
Old 12-21-2010, 06:44 AM
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Bill.Peyton Bill.Peyton is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RV10inOz View Post
Flion and anyone else reading this.

READ THIS POST CAREFULLY

Do not assume your system is accurate just because you had your avionics checked by the avionics technician when you did your last AD Inst 8/9 or whatever you guys call it over there.

Your avionics as flion above points out above may be deadly accurate all the way to 20,000' and my Dynons were, better than the TSO'd Altimeter I have.

The problem is you are sitting in your hangar with a known static source testing your plane.

YOU ARE NOT dragging a static on a drogue 100 yards behind the plane comparing a "True and Known" static with the static in your aircraft at speed.

If you are not 100% sure of what I am saying go ask some test engineers to explain it better. Kevin Horton on this site is a classic for explaining it, search his name and threads.

Am I making myself clear. In flight static is not the same thing as when you get your altimetry checked out on the ground and can yield very big errors as I found when doing our test flights.

Oils aint Oils
I don't think I ever implied that having a pitot static ifr check will verify the system is correctly reading in flight. I agree 100%, you can not calibrate nor check the system on the ground, other than for a leak and for the actual accuracy or the readout of the altimeter, the encoder and whatever other system you may have. The only way to verify the accuracy of the total system is in flight, and for altitude, with a known reference.

Last edited by Bill.Peyton : 12-21-2010 at 06:47 AM.
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  #38  
Old 12-21-2010, 07:08 AM
N427EF N427EF is offline
 
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Default Known reference?

I too have installed the flush static source in the 10 and had them installed in my 8.
The 8 was "accurate" in all phases of flight measured against the GPS.
Since a GPS is the only available tool to use as a reference, would you agree that this is an acceptable method to verify the Static system in flight?
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  #39  
Old 12-21-2010, 07:21 AM
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Brantel Brantel is offline
 
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Location: Newport, TN
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David is correct on this one....several people here have the misconception that just because they pass a static/pitot test on the ground that they are good to go. There is much more to it than that and you could have major errors in your IAS and ALT readings. Certified birds have the luxury of having well proven certified static sources. The system works for them but with us we need to take it on ourselves to ensure accuracy.

I went thru this process myself and it can be frustrating to no end. I can tell you that for an RV7, it is very sensitive to port position, port shape, port protrusion etc when the port is in the area specified by the plans. Very small changes can make big changes in the results.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by RV10inOz View Post
Flion and anyone else reading this.

READ THIS POST CAREFULLY

Do not assume your system is accurate just because you had your avionics checked by the avionics technician when you did your last AD Inst 8/9 or whatever you guys call it over there.

Your avionics as flion above points out above may be deadly accurate all the way to 20,000' and my Dynons were, better than the TSO'd Altimeter I have.

The problem is you are sitting in your hangar with a known static source testing your plane.

YOU ARE NOT dragging a static on a drogue 100 yards behind the plane comparing a "True and Known" static with the static in your aircraft at speed.

If you are not 100% sure of what I am saying go ask some test engineers to explain it better. Kevin Horton on this site is a classic for explaining it, search his name and threads.

Am I making myself clear. In flight static is not the same thing as when you get your altimetry checked out on the ground and can yield very big errors as I found when doing our test flights.

Oils aint Oils
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Last edited by Brantel : 12-21-2010 at 07:26 AM.
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  #40  
Old 12-21-2010, 07:43 AM
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rleffler rleffler is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by G34U View Post
I cant find the mentioned write ups. Can someone post the links ? Thank you.
http://myrv10.com/tips/flight_testin...rts/index.html

Pretty easy to find via search......

I suspect there are more detailed conversations on the RV-10 matronics list as well, but I didn't look for that history.
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