Do you include "planning time" when you report "build time"?

[diamond]

I'm curious how many of you have included your thinking and planning time when you report your total build time. Here's why I ask. I'd like to be able to build a -9 in 3 years time. It seems that the typical "build time" for most of the kits is reported between 2000 and 3000 hours. I'm trying to plan ahead and decide when I will have time during the course of a day to build. At work, I stay busy, but I do have frequent periods of down-time that could be used for planning. The question is how efficiently can one plan when physically away from the project itself. If I could put in at least 1 hour a day doing planning/researching while at work, would that be feasable? or does most of the thinking/planning need to be done when the kit is there in front of you?

[Sid Lambert]

Originally Posted by diamond

I'm curious how many of you have included your thinking and planning time when you report your total build time. Here's why I ask. I'd like to be able to build a -9 in 3 years time. It seems that the typical "build time" for most of the kits is reported between 2000 and 3000 hours. I'm trying to plan ahead and decide when I will have time during the course of a day to build. At work, I stay busy, but I do have frequent periods of down-time that could be used for planning. The question is how efficiently can one plan when physically away from the project itself. If I could put in at least 1 hour a day doing planning/researching while at work, would that be feasable? or does most of the thinking/planning need to be done when the kit is there in front of you?

It does not count thinking time because you would have to count every waking second and some dreams if you did.

Much planning can happen away from the project. In fact the internet is great for planning but can be dangerous (read expensive) place to spend too much time.

[bruceh]

I'm not counting my build hours. Just get out in the garage and start working!
The only real measure of build time is start to finish by calendar date.

When you need help or have questions, search the forums and other sites until you can figure what you need to do back out in the garage. I don't consider researching time as build time. I probably have 3 times as many hours "researching" as I do building.
And don't forget time spent waiting for things you need to show up in the mail.

[Chino Tom]

I didn't count planning or research time in my build hours. I would
carry with me to the office a file folder with the the preview plan pages
and construction manual pages that applied to what I was working on.
Reviewing what I planned to accomplish that evening went along way
towards being as efficient as possible.

[ChiefPilot]

Originally Posted by diamond

I'm curious how many of you have included your thinking and planning time when you report your total build time. Here's why I ask. I'd like to be able to build a -9 in 3 years time. It seems that the typical "build time" for most of the kits is reported between 2000 and 3000 hours. I'm trying to plan ahead and decide when I will have time during the course of a day to build. At work, I stay busy, but I do have frequent periods of down-time that could be used for planning. The question is how efficiently can one plan when physically away from the project itself. If I could put in at least 1 hour a day doing planning/researching while at work, would that be feasable? or does most of the thinking/planning need to be done when the kit is there in front of you?

No, not at all - if I did, I'm sure it would increase the time significantly.

When doing my electrical, for example, I drew schematics for everything. I created a load chart, and refined it as I went. Same thing with my IFR avionics stack. It feels like I spent more time planning than actually working on these items (but the electrical system worked first time - we'll see about the avionics).

[terrye]

When I record build time it is just that, time spend in the shop actually building the airplane. Sometimes I include the time I spend making a special tool or jig but not always. I expect that the 2000-3000 hours quoted for most builds is workshop time only.

The answer to your question is "yes", you can spend a significant amount of time "planning" away from the actual workshop. I include "education" in the planning and it seems everthing I do on the project involves research and education. The curse of the engineer is you have to choose the "best" components and processes for your project. But how do you decide what is "best"? What's the criteria to make a decision?

Planning means different things to different people. Actually planning the sequence of events in construction for me was simply a matter of reading Van's instructions and following them. Planning could also include the education aspect as discussed above. To me the most important part of planning is deciding on the systems and equipment to be installed and deciding where in the airframe to put them, how to mount, ground, route etc. The most important aspect of this is to plan far enough ahead that you make provisions for this equipment before you close up an assembly or "paint yourself into a corner". There will be plenty of this kind of planning to keep you busy in your down time at work

[rv7boy]

Originally Posted by diamond

I'm curious how many of you have included your thinking and planning time when you report your total build time. ...

If you included your thinking and planning time, then you'd be talking about a lot of hours to complete your RV. Don't you know that with fewer hours claimed other builders will admire your testosterone levels? [I assume you're a man.]

I have often wondered how people measured their time. In manufacturing there are "overhead" labor costs like accounting, marketing, engineering, etc., and there are "touch labor" costs like fabrication, assembly, inspection and test. I used to think folks were only recording their "assembly" hours.

In the end, you should ask yourself, "does it really matter?" Your DAR or FAA inspector would probably like to see some indication of your labor hours but I don't think he/she will say you did a better or worse job because of how much time you say it took.

Go forth and multiply.

[diamond]

Originally Posted by rv7boy

If you included your thinking and planning time, then you'd be talking about a lot of hours to complete your RV. Don't you know that with fewer hours claimed other builders will admire your testosterone levels? [I assume you're a man.]

I have often wondered how people measured their time. In manufacturing there are "overhead" labor costs like accounting, marketing, engineering, etc., and there are "touch labor" costs like fabrication, assembly, inspection and test. I used to think folks were only recording their "assembly" hours.

In the end, you should ask yourself, "does it really matter?" Your DAR or FAA inspector would probably like to see some indication of your labor hours but I don't think he/she will say you did a better or worse job because of how much time you say it took.

Go forth and multiply.

My only real concern right now, as it pertains to build hours, is that I set realistic goals based on how many hours others took to build. So when I see a builder with 2500 hours into a kit, it is helpful for me to know if he/she is talking about actual build time or build + planning time. Before I take the big step, I want to give my family an educated approximation of how much and how long I will be in the shop building, so as to reduce the likelihood of an uprising down the road. Once I start the build, I doubt that I will keep an accurate tally of my hours.

[flybill7]

My build time was roughly 3000 hours -- slow build RV7. That did not include planning or research, only time I was in the shop physically working on the plane.

[Vlad]

Originally Posted by diamond

I'd like to be able to build a -9 in 3 years time.

Easy doable planning included. Couple "ifs" could interfere - family, job, health etc. if you can plan that you are the king Money matters too but not much