Will build your rv

n41va · #1 03-09-2006, 05:39 PM

Hey guys. What do you think about this idea. I just want to know how many would be interested in this service and if there is any profit to be made. I would like to build rv's for people. Built to their exact needs. I wouldnt charge a ton over cost of materials. I have built one 8 with my father and this was his idea, he has since passed away in an RV-8, so I started thinking about it more and more and now really thinking of getting it going. What do you guys think? Good idea or Bad idea? My Dad and I had our test flight a day and year after we got the kit (Not the qb kit). So I figure putting 8 hours a day like a full-time job and having some help, I could get them done pretty quick. Its just an idea right now but I really would like to do it. Just give me your feedback, thanks!
Kelby

OneTwoSierra · #2 03-09-2006, 05:47 PM

LOL. I'm editing my first reply and I'll just say I think its a really bad idea.

Chofrock · #3 03-09-2006, 05:49 PM

I think you are going to have a hard time getting the FAA to agree with your idea.

DeltaRomeo · #4 03-09-2006, 05:57 PM

They are right, Kelby. Short answer is bad idea. The FAA will really have a problem with a strictly dedicated 'build experimentals for sale' business. Builder asist is another thing of course.

Supporting evidence (link):

In general, we are very privileged to have only a minimum number of regulations that actually pertain to building and flying our amateur-built airplane. When a manufacturer plans to mass-produce an airplane, they are required by FAR?s to comply with design standards that are detailed in FAR Part 23. This regulation is very restrictive as to design, weight, speed, etc.. Part 23 or any other certification regulations do not restrict amateur builders. Basically, our only restriction is that we must construct and assemble the majority of the airplane. (Most airplane kit manufacturers voluntarily comply with the guidelines of Part 23.) Part 23 is titled "Airworthiness Standards: Normal, utility, acrobatic, and commuter category airplanes." As the builder of our own airplane, which will not be mass-produced, only our imagination and ingenuity limit us. Of course, when we build our own airplane we are going to impose strict limitations and restrictions concerning quality of construction, materials used, etc. We certainly want a safe, reliable airplane to fly and in which to carry our passengers.

Sorry to rain on the parade. Mel, chime in with the DAR line if I missed something.

b,
d

PS. I really miss your Dad - I followed along like everyone else on the various lists during your family's build.

casper · #5 03-09-2006, 08:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeltaRomeo

They are right, Kelby. Short answer is bad idea. The FAA will really have a problem with a strictly dedicated 'build experimentals for sale' business. Builder asist is another thing of course.

Supporting evidence (link):

In general, we are very privileged to have only a minimum number of regulations that actually pertain to building and flying our amateur-built airplane. When a manufacturer plans to mass-produce an airplane, they are required by FAR?s to comply with design standards that are detailed in FAR Part 23. This regulation is very restrictive as to design, weight, speed, etc.. Part 23 or any other certification regulations do not restrict amateur builders. Basically, our only restriction is that we must construct and assemble the majority of the airplane. (Most airplane kit manufacturers voluntarily comply with the guidelines of Part 23.) Part 23 is titled "Airworthiness Standards: Normal, utility, acrobatic, and commuter category airplanes." As the builder of our own airplane, which will not be mass-produced, only our imagination and ingenuity limit us. Of course, when we build our own airplane we are going to impose strict limitations and restrictions concerning quality of construction, materials used, etc. We certainly want a safe, reliable airplane to fly and in which to carry our passengers.

Sorry to rain on the parade. Mel, chime in with the DAR line if I missed something.

b,
d

PS. I really miss your Dad - I followed along like everyone else on the various lists during your family's build.

The reasones that you guys are giving for this to be a bad idea is fact.
The other fact is that this kind of thing is already being done and you guys know it.

sprucemoose · #6 03-09-2006, 08:58 PM

Kelby,

You are certainly not the first person to have this idea, and this issue has certainly been debated to death on this forum (although I can't find the thread.)

Short answer- to build an RV for hire, you are basically holding yourself out as an airplane manufacturer, without satisfying the FAA requirements to manufacture airplanes. To build for profit goes against both the spirit and letter of the law, specifically, the law which allows us to build and fly homebuilts for out own "education and recreation." Sure there are some that do it, but they are violating the law, and many believe (I sure do) that they are jeapardizing the regulations under which we operate. Many of us have come out very strongly against such similar proposals in the past.

I too remember and miss your Dad. I think you'd be better served by your original idea, which was to build an airplane as a memorial to him. We'd all support that.

gmcjetpilot · #7 03-09-2006, 10:38 PM

There was a world class thread on this topic. It started with a story about how a builder of an Epic Air (a large pressurized single engine turboprop jet) was rebuffed approval by the FAA. He claimed he built it with help from the "factory assistance" center. The FAA said really.

http://www.vansairforce.com/communit...highlight=Epic

The thread digressed or progressed as you will, into a discussion of the 51% rule and why build for profit, hire or builder assistance is either a grey area or down right against the regulations for Amateur build aircraft. The way you stated it sounds like a clearly untenable proposition. If you want to "assist" a builder, than that is a differnt thing, but there are some grey areas and traps. The best thing for a person being "assisted" is document everything (builder log and pictures). George

RV7Factory · #8 03-10-2006, 12:29 AM

If this were legal/possible... I would have quit my day job months ago!

Jamie · #9 03-10-2006, 05:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gmcjetpilot

There was a world class thread on this topic. It started with a story about how a builder of an Epic Air (a large pressurized single engine turboprop jet) was rebuffed approval by the FAA. He claimed he built it with help from the "factory assistance" center. The FAA said really.

I don't know if you all saw it, but I think last month's Sport Aviation had a short blurb in it about Epic receiving 51% kit approval from FAA. Also, here is Epic's press release

My favorite from their site is this little gem:

Epic is now offering a four-place kit aircraft
We are offering a four-place kit that any builder can take away to costruct and finish at their home or hangar location. Introducing the AIR IV-PB. This aircraft, like it's 6-seat Epic LT version will be turbine powered and pressuized, but will come with an on-board lavatory and wet bar. Pictured are the components and parts as they will ship. For more information contact Rick Schrameck.

Unbelievable.

n41va · #10 03-10-2006, 07:25 AM

Well that answer my question!? The memorial plane is still on, Im just having some trouble finding ways to pay for it. Any suggestions? Like I said in an earlier thred, it will be donated to the young eagles or some group that could use it. Ive raised a little money for it, but nothing to really get started with. ANy ideas?