TIS support and the Garmin GTX 330

[gvgoff99]

I thought that people interested in the Garmin GTX 330 might be interested in this email I received from Garmin. It is a good reply and answered my question. I had asked if Garmin would be able to upgrade the GTX 330 to ADS-B when the FAA dumped TIS. Here is the response.

Good afternoon Mr. Goff,

The FAA controls the TIS system, and it is at their discretion how the
system will be managed. Unfortunately Garmin does not control how the TIS
system is operated by the FAA or their decisions on supporting it. I
suggest contacting AOPA concerning their efforts to persuade the FAA to
maintain TIS services. Here is a link to an AOPA article on the subject -
http://www.aopa.org/whatsnew/newsite...051101tis.html.

There currently are no plans on upgrading the 330 or 430 for ADS-B, it will
most likely require a new unit to use those services, like the GDL 90 -
http://www.garmin.com/products/gdl90/.

I understand your concern about the future availability of TIS services, it
is something we are watching as well. The FAA is in the driver's seat on
this issue, and hopefully organizations like AOPA can make a difference in
maintaining this safety service.


Sincerely,

Brian Eastman
Aviation Product Support

[aadamson]

I only wish, the FAA would slow down that train. Here in ATL, they just decommissioned the TIS in Pensacola, and they are only a few months away from doing the same to a site in Taledega.

One note, it isn't really a "decommissioning", more over it was not included in the contract that we let and being delivered to upgrade the FAA infrastructure. The existing RADAR sites are being replaced with a new version/generation and when they do that, they don't have a TIS module that operates on the new platform. It was never developed, nor do I expect it will be.

[osxuser]

Right, it wasn't developed because the FAA thought that by this time ADS-B would be in full swing... so much for that. Garmin is very quickly crippling the 430/530 series. At this point I wouldn't install a 430 unless I got a KILLER deal on one. 480/MX20 or Avidyne is the only way to go now .

[aadamson]

Originally Posted by osxuser

Right, it wasn't developed because the FAA thought that by this time ADS-B would be in full swing... so much for that. Garmin is very quickly crippling the 430/530 series. At this point I wouldn't install a 430 unless I got a KILLER deal on one. 480/MX20 or Avidyne is the only way to go now .

I'd almost agree with you... however, the 480 is *way* longer in the tooth than the 430.... In fact, I'll make a prediction... I'll bet we see a 580 but with a twist. It will be a Large screen, WAAS GPS, NAV/COMM with the g1000 style interface (used in the 396 too). Most likely will support ADS-B, TIS, XM, and probably some limited interface options to the SL-30/40 (this might be a stretch).

Might make this OSH, but if not, for sure next year.

Ya see, once they get WAAS in the G1000, they have all the parts and software.

Oh, and the MX-20.... No way, it's so under powered right now, ever tried to switch screens, zoom, and have a flight plan up.... Expect delays counted in the 10's of seconds..... And don't even try that with the ChartView option, you'll be waiting. It's a 386ex based platform running windows embedded NT. It has to be replaced soon, heck I don't even think MS is providing support for that platform anymore.

Prehaps a replacement for it as well in the similar time frame. BTW, an EX-500 next to a MX-20 will run circles around the MX-20 from a performance standpoint...that is if we are talking standalone MFD's.

[Davepar]

IMHO, Garmin is the one that is crippling safety. If they ever come out with a reasonable ADS-B platform, we'll install it and then be on our way to real traffic awareness. The big drawback with TIS is that it only works where the ground stations support it. Can you imagine if your comm worked like that? TIS was a bad design.

ADS-B is ship-to-ship as well as ship-to-ground. It'll never be installed on 100% of the planes, but eventually enough people will have it that you'll get traffic alerts for almost everybody, everywhere.

If the 430 can get info from the GTX-330, I can't understand why it can't get ADS-B info from a remote unit like the GDL-90 (that hopefully costs less than 3 limbs).

(end rant)

I'm just extemely frustrated. I'm buying avionics this month. I want traffic awareness. There is no good solution for less than $20k.

Dave

[aadamson]

What some told me about it that I thought was good info.

If you buy the 330, it's about 3K. Consider that a 500 a year "subscription" for TIS services and in 5-6 years replace it with ADS-B then

[ccrawford]

Originally Posted by aadamson

Oh, and the MX-20.... No way, it's so under powered right now, ever tried to switch screens, zoom, and have a flight plan up.... Expect delays counted in the 10's of seconds..... And don't even try that with the ChartView option, you'll be waiting. It's a 386ex based platform running windows embedded NT. It has to be replaced soon, heck I don't even think MS is providing support for that platform anymore.

Prehaps a replacement for it as well in the similar time frame. BTW, an EX-500 next to a MX-20 will run circles around the MX-20 from a performance standpoint...that is if we are talking standalone MFD's.

Just saw this link in the EAA monthly eHotline:

GARMIN LAUNCHES GMX 200 MULTI-FUNCTION DISPLAY
Garmin's GMX 200, a new multi-function display (MFD), sports a high resolution (640 x 480 pixels) display that provides a 20 percent larger viewing area than other panel-mounted MFD units. Advanced backlighting improves color and contrast, resulting in brighter, and more vivid chart depictions in all lighting conditions. The GMX 200 builds upon the features offered in Garmin's successful MX 20.
(read more)

[gmcjetpilot]

I am familiar with TIS and understand the principal and limitations. Obviously you are saddled with reliance of ground stations to provide the info, which is the issue.

My suggestion is buy a:

http://www.monroyaero.com/detect.html
http://www.zaonflight.com/mrx.html

I understand after spending $8K or $13K (or more) for a Garmin GPS/Map/Nav and mode-S transponder, you want the feature you payed for, but I prefer the stand alone passive units available on the market for about $500-$800. Many are upgrading their Monroy 200 for a 300 (also gives delta Alt), so 200's can be found for a bargain.

I don't have one yet but convinced these are real aid to safety and have the potential to reduce mid risk significantly. I fly jets with TCAS, and realize TIS is superior (where available) than the passive units because they provide direction. However knowing range and even altitude differential is more than half the battle. George

[RV7Guy]

I have weighed in on this in the past. I got this system after my neighbor who is a Tracon operater in the Phx Tracon recommended it. To date I have had 3 situations where traffic was avoided that I only saw on the screen. It has been extremely useful in flying in the crowded Socal environment.

It works for me and is a good system. Is it perfect? Certainly not, but it should be good for a few more years in the busier parts of the country.

When the new system replaces it, I'll worry about it then. In the meantime, I happy with the current system.

Bottomline, trying to chase the rapidly changing electronics market will only drive you crazy. At some point you've gotta lock in your choices and fly to it's capabilities.

[aadamson]

Originally Posted by aadamson

Oh, and the MX-20.... No way, it's so under powered right now, ever tried to switch screens, zoom, and have a flight plan up.... Expect delays counted in the 10's of seconds..... And don't even try that with the ChartView option, you'll be waiting. It's a 386ex based platform running windows embedded NT. It has to be replaced soon, heck I don't even think MS is providing support for that platform anymore.

And look what happened this week!

http://www.garmin.com/pressroom/aviation/030906.html

Not sure what all was changed, but I certainly hope they resolved the slowness and screen refresh issues and updated the internal design.